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Forums - Movies & TV - Spider-Man no longer in the MCU after disagreement between Sony and Disney (UPDATE #2): Sony releases statement

RaptorChrist said:
JRPGfan said:

You read it WRONG :P


Sony made 1.1bn on their own Spiderman movie  (we re not talking about avengers or the like here).
Not something disney makes.

Basically Sony does all the hard work, makeing the entire movie, putting in the risk (capital/funding) and production ect.
And disney comes along and says "give us 50%" (or we take away your movie director + wont allow spiderman in MCU movies anymore).

This isnt about the MCU, but the Spiderman movies that Sony themselves make.
Disney wants 50% of the profits sony makes on them..... dispite Sony owning the IP and doing everything themselves for the movie.


Disney is basically bullying them for no reason, when its clear they dont deserve to just magically get 50% of the profits for no reason.
Yet in this thread, you see people writeing "screw sony" ect. and sideing with Disney.

I see where my confusion came from...

Disney saw Sony makeing $1.1bn on their last Spiderman movie and their like "we want half of the next movie you do", if we help you with the director + MCU appearences of Spiderman.

You used "their" to refer to two different subjects in the same sentence, so I inferred that it was Disney's Spiderman movie. :P

Anyways, yeah, it's a shame that the superheroes can't all be together, and it seems like this doesn't bode well for Spidey fans. I don't watch much of the superhero movies but it's still interesting to me nonetheless.

It really depends man. In this thread it seem a lot of Spidey fans are fine with it not being part of MCU.

S.Peelman said:
JRPGfan said:

You read it WRONG :P


Sony made 1.1bn on their own Spiderman movie  (we re not talking about avengers or the like here).
Not something disney makes.

Basically Sony does all the hard work, makeing the entire movie, putting in the risk (capital/funding) and production ect.
And disney comes along and says "give us 50%" (or we take away your movie director + wont allow spiderman in MCU movies anymore).

This isnt about the MCU, but the Spiderman movies that Sony themselves make.
Disney wants 50% of the profits sony makes on them..... dispite Sony owning the IP and doing everything themselves for the movie.


Disney is basically bullying them for no reason, when its clear they dont deserve to just magically get 50% of the profits for no reason.
Yet in this thread, you see people writeing "screw sony" ect. and sideing with Disney.

Sony doesn’t own anything.

This isn’t a shared ownership or Pokémon-like construction, Spiderman is fully owned by Marvel, which is fully owned by Disney. Spiderman is Disney’s property. Similarly, EA doesn’t own Star Wars. Sony owns a licence to make Spiderman movies, left-over from when Marvel, who were handing out licences like candy, was independant, like how Fox owned a licence to make X-Men movies. Or Universal a licence for theme park attractions. Obviously Disney wants that all back, to redistribute as they see fit. This also means I doubt Sony gets anything from merchandising or anything else regardless, but that’s another thing. 

Sony probably has a much better deal with the Spiderman movie licence than say, EA has with the Star Wars game licence though, and that’s their luck.

Generally speaking, not directly aimed at you, JRPGfan;

I think some of you are jumping to conclusions. So Spiderman made over a billion at the box-office. Sure this is a plus, but I highly doubt this is the prime motivator for Disney to tighten the strings. A billion in movie gross is nothing special for Disney anymore. Pretty much everything they touch reaches that nowadays. The Lion King is far past that already. Spiderman isn’t that special, even in the MCU. Ignoring Avengers of course, even Captain Marvel beat it. An Iron Man and a Captain America are above it. Black Panther has run a circle around Spiderman. I’m positive some of the upcoming MCU movies are going to easily beat Spiderman as well, and this is all with a surely inflated number for a modern Spiderman movie because of it’s connection to the MCU.

Secondly, I see comparisons with the Raimi Spiderman films, about how Sony can make a more successful Spiderman film than Disney/Marvel can. But that’s not a good comparison. Those movies are old now, and had little competition in the superhero genre. I’d say the fact that the Raimi films all easily beat the new Spiderman films, adjusted for inflation, actually bodes pretty badly for a stand-alone new Sony Spiderman film, if even the Marvel backing couldn’t do it.

Finally, I see people being pissed about supposed Sony blaming here in this thread. However, meanwhile I’m seeing a whole lot more Disney bashing in here, which seems to be fine. Comes across as a bit hypocritical, but whatever I don’t know.

And before this statement gets me being accused of defending Disney or being a Disney-fanboy, a Sony-hater or whatever, don’t bother, it’s not like that, I’m Switzerland.

You may say you are not defending Disney, but you are defending what they done. And in this case there was already an agreement and Disney want more, so any lack of acceptance or defaulting the deal is on Disney. It is very simple.

If Disney want the IP back pay for it instead of bullying while pretending to be a nice guy.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Yeah, fuck Disney for the sole purpose of being greedy.

@ that guy that said "Sony doesn't own anything"
Back in 2015, Sony struck a deal with Disney's Marvel Studios that PERMITTED Spider-Man to be part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Spidey has been in 3 MCU movies so far and Sony cannot incorporate the character into its own extended universe until the deal comes to a conclusion. Now guess what, that deal has come to a conclusion and Sony is free to incorporate the Spider-Man franchise into their own spidey-universe.



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Spiderman fans in my experience can have a lot of odd and fierce ideas about 'what' Spiderman is, even the writers are like that.

See all the fighting and squabbling over the idea of him being married.

Frankly I don't see a reason not to have him in the Marvel Universe proper and being allowed to grow up into something better than 'living in Aunt May's basement or barely scraping by' like editorial insists he must, and many fans for that matter.



The Democratic Nintendo fan....is that a paradox? I'm fond of one of the more conservative companies in the industry, but I vote Liberally and view myself that way 90% of the time?

KrspaceT said:
Spiderman fans in my experience can have a lot of odd and fierce ideas about 'what' Spiderman is, even the writers are like that.

See all the fighting and squabbling over the idea of him being married.

Most fans like MJ and like him being married, it's good for him and his character, having issues also shows reality and is nice to see. However, Joey Q did not. Joe Quesada was EIC, not fans. One More Day story was not popular.

Progress doesn't mean just breaking up, it's means progress. Like when he became a teacher or Octavius took over his mind, stuff like that. It promotes good story telling.



Hmm, pie.

S.Peelman said:
Barkley said:

Uh.

But as Sony Pictures themselves say, they own the Spiderman IP (when it comes to movies).

Yes, Sony doesn't get anything from merchandising.

Which is what I said. They can make movies. They can’t do anything else with the character without permission because the character isn’t their’s.

The whole point of the thread is about Sony making Spider-man films, so stating "Sony can make movies but can't make other things" is kind of confusing, even pointless.

Sure, they cannot sell Spider-man cakes but I don't thing Sony Pictures is really into selling cakes anyway.



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LudicrousSpeed said:
They’ll reach a deal. Maybe not 50/50, but it should be higher than 5%. Spider-Man is only as big now because of the MCU involvement.

Good luck with SM movies with Tim Rothman in control lol

And Avi Arad, who's fucked up Spider-Man and Ghost Rider since 2007. He also gave us the 2 worst X-Men films, the 2 shitty Fox Fantastic Four movies, the godawful Elektra, the terrible watered-down TC of DareDevil, the shitty Ang Lee Hulk film, Ghost in the Shell and is now gonna put CARNAGE in a PG-13 movie (!), because it worked so well for DareDevil and Ghost Rider, LOL.  

Not only that, but every attempt of theirs to start a franchise has failed. Jumanji, Resident Evil, GhostBusters. They also made the Emoji movie, Pixels, The 5th Wave, the Dark Tower, the RoboCop and Total Recall remakes, Sex Tape, Jack and Jill, Grown Ups 1 and 2, also complete failures both critically and commercially. Yeah they have the occasional sleeper like Superbad and Once Upon a Time in Hollywood (which Tarantino, wrote, produced and directed with full creative control and Sony only distributed and signed the checks, so I'm not even sure this counts), but that's not exactly a boastful list right there.

And people wonder why others are petrified of them taking Spider-Man without Papa Marvel overseeing them. 

Oh and BTW, their stocks have taken a MASSIVE drop since backing out of the deal, LOL:

Last edited by KManX89 - on 21 August 2019

KManX89 said:
LudicrousSpeed said:
They’ll reach a deal. Maybe not 50/50, but it should be higher than 5%. Spider-Man is only as big now because of the MCU involvement.

Good luck with SM movies with Tim Rothman in control lol

And Avi Arad, who's fucked up Spider-Man and Ghost Rider since 2007. He also gave us the 2 worst X-Men films, the 2 shitty Fox Fantastic Four movies, the godawful Elektra, the terrible watered-down TC of DareDevil, the shitty Ang Lee Hulk film, Ghost in the Shell and is now gonna put CARNAGE in a PG-13 movie (!), because it worked so well for DareDevil and Ghost Rider, LOL.  

Not only that, but every attempt of theirs to start a franchise has failed. Jumanji, Resident Evil, GhostBusters. They also made the Emoji movie, Pixels, The 5th Wave, the Dark Tower, the RoboCop and Total Recall remakes, Sex Tape, Jack and Jill, Grown Ups 1 and 2, also complete failures both critically and commercially. Yeah they have the occasional sleeper like Superbad and Once Upon a Time in Hollywood (which Tarantino, wrote, produced and directed with full creative control and Sony only distributed and signed the checks, so I'm not even sure this counts), but that's not exactly a boastful list right there.

And people wonder why others are petrified of them taking Spider-Man without Papa Marvel overseeing them. 

Oh and BTW, their stocks have taken a MASSIVE drop since backing out of the deal, LOL:

Sony Corp already recovered from that small loss, they are on green.

Last edited by Manlytears - on 21 August 2019

deskpro2k3 said:
Yeah, fuck Disney for the sole purpose of being greedy.

@ that guy that said "Sony doesn't own anything"
Back in 2015, Sony struck a deal with Disney's Marvel Studios that PERMITTED Spider-Man to be part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Spidey has been in 3 MCU movies so far and Sony cannot incorporate the character into its own extended universe until the deal comes to a conclusion. Now guess what, that deal has come to a conclusion and Sony is free to incorporate the Spider-Man franchise into their own spidey-universe.

Because it worked so well for Spider-Man 3 and both ASM movies.

And both Ghost Rider movies, even though they're not apart of the Spidey universe. They still count because they're Sony (standalone) films.

LOL. 



KManX89 said:
deskpro2k3 said:
Yeah, fuck Disney for the sole purpose of being greedy.

@ that guy that said "Sony doesn't own anything"
Back in 2015, Sony struck a deal with Disney's Marvel Studios that PERMITTED Spider-Man to be part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Spidey has been in 3 MCU movies so far and Sony cannot incorporate the character into its own extended universe until the deal comes to a conclusion. Now guess what, that deal has come to a conclusion and Sony is free to incorporate the Spider-Man franchise into their own spidey-universe.

Because it worked so well for Spider-Man 3 and both ASM movies.

And both Ghost Rider movies, even though they're not apart of the Spidey universe. They still count because they're Sony (standalone) films.

LOL. 

Don't see why we go back to ghost rider on this topic when Sony just made one of the best spider-man movies of all time without any assistance from Disney. 

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/spider_man_into_the_spider_verse

Don't you think that's more relevant than how bad a completely different super hero movie franchise was almost a decade ago?



...

Not gonna lie, I don't care whose fault it is, I just want to see all Marvel properties and IPs controlled by one corporate entity. Doesn't have to be Disney, but if they can get it done, fine. Tired of seeing Spiderman separated from the rest like this. Better yet, actually, if I had a magic wand, I'd put all Marvel IPs into the public domain. Then I could actually enjoy every company's attempt at a cinematic universe, all in one lifetime.