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We Need A More Mature Spider-Man Movie

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Best Spider-Man movies?

Spider-Man (2002) Trilogy 19 51.35%
 
Amazing Spider-Man Duology 3 8.11%
 
Spider-Man Home Duology 15 40.54%
 
Total:37
Snoorlax said:

Hiku said:

When they restart a superhero series, there are certain integral elements to the character that they usually don't want to skip. In those cases it's more about how each iteration of the character deals with it.

This is the third live action iteration of Spiderman that literally explores the same themes as the first but with worse actors and more comedy thats pretty much it.

That men are pigs.

...uhh... Yeah I guess?  even without the sarcasm nobody would get offended by that men don't need to be empowered for the sake of being empowered

There are men with inferiority complexes if they're unable to be the 'strong' one, or the 'provider' etc.
I don't notice 99% of the suspected tinfoil hat cases of 'hidden attempts to empower women' that some people bring up. Which may be odd, considering I've been made painfully aware of the subject thanks to it being brought up in almost every single thread regarding any female character that is more than just average.

I would say that the men who feel their position as a male is diminished by the display of empowered women in popular media (leading more women to look up to them instead of the damsels in distress) are men who need to be empowered for the sake of being empowered. But I digress.

The point was that it's ridiculous to constantly have this brought up, for no apparent reason. And this time it was because MJ was more perceptive than male characters, and about the person she has a crush on.

You're asking a political question that has no answer or particular reason to be suspected in a non-political thread.
That's fine occasionally, but this particular subject is especially rampant in gaming or movie related topics, and is unproductive as it never leads anywhere.

You'd imagine people would get this out of their system the first 500 times they made this accusation/posed this question for a game/movie.
If not, make a thread about it in the politics section please. Try to keep that out of the entertainment sections from now on, unless there's a proper case to be made for it.

Last edited by Hiku - on 21 July 2019

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Snoorlax said:
pokoko said:
"Because "Spider-Man doesn't want to be Spider-Man just Peter Parker" again"

That's literally one of the most basic elements of the "Spider-Man" comic books. That was the overriding theme for decades. A hero who doesn't want to be a hero but wrestles constantly with the words of his uncle, that with great power comes great responsibility. That's Spider-Man.

And what happens at the end? He accepts his responsibility and understands that he's partly to blame for his uncle's death and moves on as a Spider-Man.

The end?  The very ideal of the Spider-Man character, the defining element for literally decades and decades, especially during his college years, was that Peter Parker wanted a normal life with a normal career but being Spider-Man always got in the way.  He was supposed to be the opposite of the Superman type character, where the "Clark Kent" guise is the fake element and the "superhero" is the real persona.  That's why Spider-Man resonated with so many people in the first place.  It's why he never fit in with groups like the Avengers. 

Spider-Man is Peter Parker with a mask on.  

You should probably check out the Superman films.  That sounds more like what you want in a character.



Don't worry, Tom Holland will grow older, and with it, out of school. Also, remember the Stinger of the movie:

Spoiler!
J. Jonah Jameson is declaring Misterio a true hero and Spiderman a villain. So now, he'll have to handle that problem, too. And he probably will soon start his photographer career by the looks of it.


Snoorlax said:
Jpcc86 said:

Considering how incredibly well received the Home "duology" is in terms of both critical and commercial success, i'd absolutely question your criteria of "terrible writing", cause its clearly not the case.

Either way I dont care, the best version of the character IMO is the high schooler. I dont want to see the married Peter Parker.

Star Wars Sequels are both well received critically and commercially, do the fans care about that? Nope.

If you want terrible writing then watch the DCEU.

Fixed that for you

pokoko said:
Snoorlax said:

And what happens at the end? He accepts his responsibility and understands that he's partly to blame for his uncle's death and moves on as a Spider-Man.

The end?  The very ideal of the Spider-Man character, the defining element for literally decades and decades, especially during his college years, was that Peter Parker wanted a normal life with a normal career but being Spider-Man always got in the way.  He was supposed to be the opposite of the Superman type character, where the "Clark Kent" guise is the fake element and the "superhero" is the real persona.  That's why Spider-Man resonated with so many people in the first place.  It's why he never fit in with groups like the Avengers. 

Spider-Man is Peter Parker with a mask on.  

You should probably check out the Superman films.  That sounds more like what you want in a character.

Yeah, I can remember from my dad's silver/bronze age comics that he's always at Morton's fork. No matter what he's doing, he can't possibly please everybody, and some will suffer from it. Uncle Ben, Gwen Stacy and her dad died due to Parker's being forced to choose. And those painful choices did stick, as they stayed dead, unlike most in comicbooks.

The scene before the final battle in Homecoming was exactly what Parker was about all that time: He has to sacrifice all the time and make tough decisions:

Spoiler!
Go to the prom with his dream girl, knowing fully well that she'll dump him forever if he doesn't, or catch the villain, who is incidentally also the father of his love?

A similar thing happened in this movie:

Spoiler!
He gave Misterio Tony's glasses, and with them, full control over his drones, as he felt the burden was too much for him, that he was too young for such a responsibility. The deaths and destructions in London are the result of this choices.

Spiderman is all about choices and what we make with and about them.



Darc Requiem said:
The young neighborhood superhero that is always getting roped into things "beyond his depth" is when Spiderman was his most popular. You seem to want a more adult Spiderman, but that isn't when he had his best comic book runs. Juggling his academic, social, and superhero life is what has always been a core tenant of his character. The high school through college era Spiderman is what they seem to be going for. Once he gets beyond college, starts working, and get married, the character seems to lose his luster for a lot of people. It is part of the reason characters like Spiderman (Miles Morales) and Spider-Gwen have taken off. Those characters essentially go back to the young era of the original Spiderman's career and allow for the telling the types of stories that lead to his popularity.

Adult Spider-Man does just fine.  Matter of fact, while the comics had him graduate from high school by the 3rd year of the run in the mid-60s, he hasn't been a college student either for over 40 years at this point.  Longer than most of us have been alive I'd wager and he's continued as Marvel's flagship character all the while.  Heck, he was married for longer than he was in school.

Honestly, I don't think Spider-Man ever worked all that well as a high school character.  As much as they keep going back to it, no one really has nostalgia for the high school era.  The comics didn't really hit their stride until he got to college and introduced Gwen, Mary Jane, and Harry along with the classic storylines that surrounded them.

By that point the "beyond his depth" Spider-Man was already gone and he was a seasoned crime fighter.  Not really sure it was ever a big part of the comics in the first place.



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Hiku said:

You'd imagine people would get this out of their system the first 500 times they made this accusation/posed this question for a game/movie.

If not, make a thread about it in the politics section please. Try to keep that out of the entertainment sections from now on, unless there's a proper case to be made for it.

You're the one making this into a political case, i've just pointed it out as criticism towards the movie and the character of MJ and how unrealistic it is when nobody else but MJ can easily make the connection. I don't care if you agree/disagree but it seems to me like you are saying criticisms that you don't like are not allowed in the movie threads now?

Secondly, if you really believe mainstream movies these days that are supposed to be just "fun and entertaining" aren't filled with SWJ and political undertones and some of us are just exaggerating then you really need to check yourself or you're just ignoring it. I don't care if women are the hero or the strongest, i do have a problem if they don't make sense especially in movies that i like, like Star Wars or Spider-Man.



pokoko said:
Snoorlax said:

And what happens at the end? He accepts his responsibility and understands that he's partly to blame for his uncle's death and moves on as a Spider-Man.

The end?  The very ideal of the Spider-Man character, the defining element for literally decades and decades, especially during his college years, was that Peter Parker wanted a normal life with a normal career but being Spider-Man always got in the way.  He was supposed to be the opposite of the Superman type character, where the "Clark Kent" guise is the fake element and the "superhero" is the real persona.  That's why Spider-Man resonated with so many people in the first place.  It's why he never fit in with groups like the Avengers. 

Spider-Man is Peter Parker with a mask on.  

You should probably check out the Superman films.  That sounds more like what you want in a character.

Okay. I repeat.

He accepts his responsibility and understands that he's partly to blame for his uncle's death and moves on as Spider-Man.



Bofferbrauer2 said:
Snoorlax said:

Star Wars Sequels are both well received critically and commercially, do the fans care about that? Nope.

If you want terrible writing then Read the Spider-Man comics and watch the DCEU.

Fixed that for you

pokoko said:

The end?  The very ideal of the Spider-Man character, the defining element for literally decades and decades, especially during his college years, was that Peter Parker wanted a normal life with a normal career but being Spider-Man always got in the way.  He was supposed to be the opposite of the Superman type character, where the "Clark Kent" guise is the fake element and the "superhero" is the real persona.  That's why Spider-Man resonated with so many people in the first place.  It's why he never fit in with groups like the Avengers. 

Spider-Man is Peter Parker with a mask on.  

You should probably check out the Superman films.  That sounds more like what you want in a character.

Yeah, I can remember from my dad's silver/bronze age comics that he's always at Morton's fork. No matter what he's doing, he can't possibly please everybody, and some will suffer from it. Uncle Ben, Gwen Stacy and her dad died due to Parker's being forced to choose. And those painful choices did stick, as they stayed dead, unlike most in comicbooks.

The scene before the final battle in Homecoming was exactly what Parker was about all that time: He has to sacrifice all the time and make tough decisions:

Spoiler!
Go to the prom with his dream girl, knowing fully well that she'll dump him forever if he doesn't, or catch the villain, who is incidentally also the father of his love?

A similar thing happened in this movie:

Spoiler!
He gave Misterio Tony's glasses, and with them, full control over his drones, as he felt the burden was too much for him, that he was too young for such a responsibility. The deaths and destructions in London are the result of this choices.

Spiderman is all about choices and what we make with and about them.

Thank you for your input but this is about Spider-Man not the DCEU.



After seeing screenshots for Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse, I checked the movie out.

I wasn't only pleasantly surprised, but I was blown away. If they made the MCU Spider-Man with this combination of heart, action, charm, and freshness, I could be behind a young Spider-Man. But now, I am pretty much sick of the reboots and high school stories.

Also, Spider-Man: Into the Spider-Verse should be in the poll. It's the best Spider-Man movie, imho, but it doesn't get the type of attention, because it's animated, and it's main protagonist is not the original Spider-Man (although his relationship with the Peter Parker iteration is central to the plot so we get the best of both worlds). Blows away the duologies. And it's got more polish, more character development, and less cringe than the Raimi films even though that trilogy was phenomenal. It's just that good.



Or you could just make a movie about one of the 5 million other superheroes that are more mature?



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