Quantcast
Should Nintendo use Unreal Engine 4 and Unity in more of their games?

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Should Nintendo use Unreal Engine 4 and Unity in more of their games?

mZuzek said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

I have to admit, I couldn't really remember if the game was 60fps or 30fps and I just assumed it must be 30fps (because of Kirby Star Allies ironically, lol)! 

It is definitely one of the best looking games on Switch, but I do have to wonder if using a Nintendo engine would have made it much smoother. Not just in resolution, but also in development time. Yoshi, as a fairly standard 2D platformer with a somewhat quirky concept, really shouldn't have needed a year-long delay. 

From what I've read, it has a dynamic resolution that never reaches even 720p, on docked mode. But the framerate maintains a stable 60fps. Of course, I can't base anything off my experience, because I couldn't care less about Yoshi.

Yeah that's why I said that it needed an improvement in resolution. It actually is pretty detailed aside from that but the resolution suffers. 



Around the Network

Yoshi is a great game to play with the little ones via coop. If anything it is an example of why resolution is overrated, given yoshi looks great.

I game on a 65 inch tv and had digital foundry never ran an in depth analysis, I would have never known it had resolution "issues." 

Art style matters, not pixel count.



MTZehvor said:
Unreal Engine is kind of garbage, so...ideally no. At least not for anything that demands high framerate/graphical fidelity.

Not well informed enough about Unity to say for it.

Unreal is very capable.   Dragon Ball FighterZ is UE4 (and works wonderfully on Switch too), Dragon Quest XI is as well.  So is Kingdom Hearts III.  And a number of other games.

AngryLittleAlchemist said:
Mar1217 said:

Most people honestly were baffled by how good it looked, so much that before Digital Laundy video, people thought it was probably somewhere 720p-900p,lol.

I have to admit, I couldn't really remember if the game was 60fps or 30fps and I just assumed it must be 30fps (because of Kirby Star Allies ironically, lol)! 

It is definitely one of the best looking games on Switch, but I do have to wonder if using a Nintendo engine would have made it much smoother. Not just in resolution, but also in development time. Yoshi, as a fairly standard 2D platformer with a somewhat quirky concept, really shouldn't have needed a year-long delay. 

Again though, I think it probably makes sense to use UE4 when it's a third party developer making a Nintendo title. I'm not sure why they don't use Nintendo engines because you'd think Nintendo would supply them with everything they need such as engine experts, and I imagine there are fairly regular checks on third party devs to make sure they're making their games properly (MP4 being an example). Maybe it just makes more sense to use one of the better third party engines and not to hog resources from Nintendo, as I imagine the studios can do the majority of the work themselves if they aren't use a proprietary engine they might have less experience with.

Well, don't forget Woolly World had the same development struggles and it used a bespoke engine rather than a third party one.  Good Feel just aren't fast devs.



It really depends on how mature the in-house tools are for a set game. For certain titles and genres, Nintendo have some specific needs that would probably be better suited to the custom tools that they've already developed in-house. The whole point of third-party engines is that a lot of functionality is in-place so you don't have to play around with it as much. If they already have that functionality in-house then there is no need use UE4 or Unity, in-fact they could be a hindrance if you have to make extra modifications for a specific game. For a new game/genre that's completely fresh, then a third-party engine could help speed up development.

Take Bioware as an example of a developer using a third-party (OK, not entirely third-party, but not developed in-house at Bioware) engine that's not appropriate to their needs. Their last few games have taken forever to develop and have been sub-par by their standards. A lot of that is because they used the Battlefield engine and had to do a load of custom work to make it suitable for their RPGs.



Unreal Engine 4 is awful on home consoles but I imagine it works better on Switch's hardware setup and for Nintendo's case as well so why not ?



Around the Network

I don't know one single game which uses UE4 and runs in 60fps or even stabile 30fps on Switch. Abzu, Snake Pass, Octopath Traveler had bad and countless framerate droppings, Rime was almost unplayable. So.... no. If Nintendo don't get their Yoshi game run in constant 60fps at 576p, I think it's almost impossible to use this engine properly on Switch.



Digital Foundry suggested the Link's Awakening remake may have been made in Unreal Engine 4. I think Grezzo did advertise for staff with Unreal experience back in late 2017, when they were likely recruiting for the Link's Awakening game. Link's Awakening looks gorgeous, but one issue every preview mentioned was frame-rate drops in the game's overworld, which fits with other UE4 games on Switch.



siebensus4 said:
I don't know one single game which uses UE4 and runs in 60fps or even stabile 30fps on Switch. Abzu, Snake Pass, Octopath Traveler had bad and countless framerate droppings, Rime was almost unplayable. So.... no. If Nintendo don't get their Yoshi game run in constant 60fps at 576p, I think it's almost impossible to use this engine properly on Switch.

You also have to keep in mind, a lot of early UE4 games on Switch were developed with an earlier version of the engine, Snake Pass was even developed before the Switch had full UE4 support. Thus, problems do creep up with hardware as new and unique as the Switch. But, I'd say things will get better. Dragon Quest XI for example, looks gorgeous on Switch, even with its visuals toned down from PS4, and it seems to run at a consistent frame-rate.

Scoobes said:
Take Bioware as an example of a developer using a third-party (OK, not entirely third-party, but not developed in-house at Bioware) engine that's not appropriate to their needs. Their last few games have taken forever to develop and have been sub-par by their standards. A lot of that is because they used the Battlefield engine and had to do a load of custom work to make it suitable for their RPGs.

Blame EA for that one. They've mandated every title they publish to use Frostbite for some god-forsaken reason. But EA seems to forget that an engine desinged for a Shooter, doesn't necessarily translate to other genres.



siebensus4 said:
I don't know one single game which uses UE4 and runs in 60fps or even stabile 30fps on Switch. Abzu, Snake Pass, Octopath Traveler had bad and countless framerate droppings, Rime was almost unplayable. So.... no. If Nintendo don't get their Yoshi game run in constant 60fps at 576p, I think it's almost impossible to use this engine properly on Switch.

pretty sure dragonal fighterz is 1080p 60fps on switch and it's unreal engine 4



Nuvendil said:
MTZehvor said:
Unreal Engine is kind of garbage, so...ideally no. At least not for anything that demands high framerate/graphical fidelity.

Not well informed enough about Unity to say for it.

Unreal is very capable.   Dragon Ball FighterZ is UE4 (and works wonderfully on Switch too), Dragon Quest XI is as well.  So is Kingdom Hearts III.  And a number of other games.

Both DQ and KH can only hit 30 FPS consistently on consoles to my knowledge. KH's "unlocked" mode often has serious frame dropping problems on standard consoles; Pro and X handle it fine but standard PS4 and XBO have lots of documented issues, and that's with hitting relatively tame resolution standards of 900 and 720p respectively. And the Switch is technically less impressive than either base XBO or PS4.

This isn't to say that it's impossible to make good looking/well performing games with Unreal (Arc did a fantastic job with DBFZ), but all the evidence in the world points to it being a substantial handicap if you're aiming to make games with high resolution output or high framerate. A reasonable point of comparison imo would be looking at Devil May Cry 4, which ran on MT Framework, and going to the DmC: Devil May Cry reboot, which used Unreal. DmC launched in 2013 and had numerous problems with textures popping in/out, could only manage 30 FPS on consoles, and frequently fell below even that on PS3. Conversely, DMC4 ran on MT framework and was locked at 60 FPS with no such texture problems despite launching five years earlier.

One of the big problems is that UE (especially UE4) is very resource hungry, and devs need to put in more effort on optimization to make sure that extra assets aren't going to tank performance. Optimization is important for all games, but especially so for Unreal titles, and it's an extra layer of work/chance for things to go wrong, especially if your system is (relatively) underpowered like the Switch.