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Why can't Dems presidential hopefuls pull this much people for any of their rallys? <20,000+

Forums - Politics Discussion - Why can't Dems presidential hopefuls pull this much people for any of their rallys? <20,000+

o_O.Q said:

"There was nothing valid about your image."

well come on now, there is, socialists constantly claim that there are no real world examples of socialism, whether you agree or disagree with this you should at least be able to acknowledge that this is a thing

What I do know is that some people such as yourself always turn discussions that have nothing to do with that, into an argument about the definition of socialism. In order to imply that America will turn into those countries you listed if they adopt one more socialistic program out of the many they already have.

This started because someone called Democrats "communists", because they want universal healthcare like every other developed democracy on the planet.

"Socialism is an extremely broad term."

socialism as its defined is the public ownership of resources, the abolition of private property and the formation of a stateless society... people include each of these descriptions to varying degrees but ultimately no matter what they all agree that the central idea is public ownership

how does this not describe public ownership?

It's a very broad term because there are many different kinds of socialistic models. I'm not arguing that the definition you're citing doesn't apply here. That's fine.
Just that you shouldn't use that to draw a correlation between a healthcare system proposed by the Democrats, and a system where the government owns essentially everything. Because you know they're trying to do what every other developed democracy is doing.

The point of that image you posted is to mischaracterize the discussion. That it isn't "We want to do what Canada are doing", but rather "That's socialism, and no country has managed to do socializm. You wanna eat rats like Venezuela?"

"That Bernie wants private health insurance to be relegated to elective procedures."

he says he wants private health insurance to be eliminated


Sanders: "That means boldly transforming our dysfunctional system by ending the use of private health insurance, except to cover non-essential care like cosmetic surgeries"

That's how he specified it when asked.

which I did not do, I never made a comparison, what I said is that this is clearly socialism

the image as I explained above was to describe a certain trend where real world examples are denied constantly, it has nothing to do with comparing healthcare across nations and if you read my comment you'd realise that

The discussion has very much, if not everything, to do with the healthcare debate. Because that's the major reason for why people are calling Democrats "communists" and "socialists" (in a negative connotation, not the rest-of-the-industrialized-world connotation) here.

The first posts that started the discussion you responded to did that. And then you, by arguing a definition of the term, drew a correlation to the countries you listed.

Which is off-topic and irrelevant. What is relevant is that what he said fits the definition of a social democracy like some of the countries I listed.
And you know that's what he's referring to. So it's pretty clear what your intention with that off-topic discussion is.

⚠️⚠️

So no more discussions about the definition of Socialism or Venezuela, Cuba, Cambodia, etc in this thread.

This is over now. Move on or be moderated.

Last edited by Hiku - on 30 June 2019

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Azuren said:
Machiavellian said:

There really isn't a difference.  I mean you can make all the excuses you want and call it a difference but that is pretty much what it is.  You chose something that has no meaning in a discussion and then tried to use it as some lofty reason to dismiss an opinion.  You have no clue about the username but you made an assumption on just that.  Now you are trying to parade that opinion as if it's based on anything but the bias you wanted to use in the first place.  Since the username is what I use for all forums I am registered to, why would you believe I made this username for political post.  I have had this username probably longer then you have been on this earth but it is fun to see you try to defend this bias nature of yours.

There really is a difference between marginalized groups and your username, but again: I wouldn't expect someone who would choose the name Machiavellian to represent any good faith arguments. The mere act of conflating a username with nationality, sex, or gender is fairly indicative of that, so thanks for proving my point.

Yeah, just face it you found something to discriminate someone with and you jump right for it.  People who are quick to discriminate others always look for some fallacy they can use to dismiss something.  You have shone a classic pattern of doing just that.  I am sure you walk down the street judging people without ever saying a word to them.  You make the perfect hero for Trump and would fit quite nicely within his administration.  You should look for a job, I am sure he is hiring with so many positions open. 

Also, you should know just in case you forgot it was you who brought up the whole username laughing point in the first place.  I like how you bring something as stupid as a username into a discussion then try to get all high and mighty when its thrown back in your face as the reflection of your own prejudice rises with each post.



Machiavellian said:
Azuren said:

There really is a difference between marginalized groups and your username, but again: I wouldn't expect someone who would choose the name Machiavellian to represent any good faith arguments. The mere act of conflating a username with nationality, sex, or gender is fairly indicative of that, so thanks for proving my point.

Yeah, just face it you found something to discriminate someone with and you jump right for it.  People who are quick to discriminate others always look for some fallacy they can use to dismiss something.  You have shone a classic pattern of doing just that.  I am sure you walk down the street judging people without ever saying a word to them.  You make the perfect hero for Trump and would fit quite nicely within his administration.  You should look for a job, I am sure he is hiring with so many positions open. 

Also, you should know just in case you forgot it was you who brought up the whole username laughing point in the first place.  I like how you bring something as stupid as a username into a discussion then try to get all high and mighty when its thrown back in your face as the reflection of your own prejudice rises with each post.

There you go again, conflating immutable characteristics and relationship statuses with things people actively choose, like usernames.

Reply again. Keep proving me right. Keep digging your heels into a machiavellian tactic while telling me I'm just discriminating you based on your username.

User was Warned for flaming due to this post - cycycychris

Last edited by cycycychris - on 30 June 2019

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Azuren said:
Machiavellian said:

Yeah, just face it you found something to discriminate someone with and you jump right for it.  People who are quick to discriminate others always look for some fallacy they can use to dismiss something.  You have shone a classic pattern of doing just that.  I am sure you walk down the street judging people without ever saying a word to them.  You make the perfect hero for Trump and would fit quite nicely within his administration.  You should look for a job, I am sure he is hiring with so many positions open. 

Also, you should know just in case you forgot it was you who brought up the whole username laughing point in the first place.  I like how you bring something as stupid as a username into a discussion then try to get all high and mighty when its thrown back in your face as the reflection of your own prejudice rises with each post.

There you go again, conflating immutable characteristics and relationship statuses with things people actively choose, like usernames.

Reply again. Keep proving me right. Keep digging your heels into a machiavellian tactic while telling me I'm just discriminating you based on your username.

The funny thing is that he is right about you despite not knowing much about you.



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Azuren said:
Machiavellian said:

Yeah, just face it you found something to discriminate someone with and you jump right for it.  People who are quick to discriminate others always look for some fallacy they can use to dismiss something.  You have shone a classic pattern of doing just that.  I am sure you walk down the street judging people without ever saying a word to them.  You make the perfect hero for Trump and would fit quite nicely within his administration.  You should look for a job, I am sure he is hiring with so many positions open. 

Also, you should know just in case you forgot it was you who brought up the whole username laughing point in the first place.  I like how you bring something as stupid as a username into a discussion then try to get all high and mighty when its thrown back in your face as the reflection of your own prejudice rises with each post.

There you go again, conflating immutable characteristics and relationship statuses with things people actively choose, like usernames.

Reply again. Keep proving me right. Keep digging your heels into a machiavellian tactic while telling me I'm just discriminating you based on your username.

This username thing you keep harping on is about the dumbest, most fruitless point I've read on these forums. Congratulations for that I guess. Reported two of the more recent posts because it's annoying and seems pretty off topic but I guess the mods disagree. 



...

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@Machiavellian and @Azuren 

Its time to drop your discussion, its going no where and its turning into nothing but both of you flaming each other. Not to mention we have already asked Azuren 2 days ago to drop the user names comparisons through PM. anymore on this will result in bans, its time to stop responding to each other.

Last edited by cycycychris - on 30 June 2019

     

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https://www.empower-yourself-with-color-psychology.com/personality-color-orange.html

Personality Color Orange

You thrive on human social contact and social gatherings, bringing all types together.

With orange as your favorite color, you are warm, optimistic, extroverted and often flamboyant.You are friendly, good-natured and a generally agreeable person.

You are assertive and determined rather than aggressive - having a personality color orange means you are more light-hearted and less intense than those who love red.

As a personality color orange you enjoy partying and socializing and planning all types of social events - orange people are the life of the party, the uninhibited performer! You are often the loud talker in a group.

While you are charming and sociable you do tend to be a show-off.

You get great satisfaction from helping others and they find you inspiring with your vitality and positive energy.

You are tolerant and accepting of others just the way they are.

You are a people person, motivated by what others may or may not think and always trying to keep up with the Jones'. You need people around you - being alone for too long makes you depressed and you then allow negativity to engulf you.

You are a free spirit who doesn't like to be tied down - you are not always loyal in your relationships and find it difficult to commit.

You live your life based on your 'gut reactions'.

You are an adventurer - you love the outdoor life, camping, climbing mountains and indulging in adventurous sports such as sky diving and hang gliding. You are the daredevil, always looking towards your next challenge, your next great adventure.

You enjoy being physically active, particularly in the outdoors, whether it's simply going for a walk, or competing in high level sporting competitions.

You are full of life, always on the go, determined and competitive, always looking for new challenges - and this can lead to restlessness and impatience with others who do not have this need.

Lovers of orange like to take risks in many areas of their life, particularly in the physical areas. They prefer to explore their outer world rather than their inner world.

You may be lousy at housekeeping as it is not that important to you - you love having fun too much and don't like the mundane - a little dust on the mantelpiece is not that important to you. However you love to cook.

You move on easily from life's setbacks.

Patience is not one of your virtues and you can be quite forceful and domineering over others when under stress.

You can be indecisive, inconsistent and unpredictable.

You may be an unkind practical joker.

When operating from a negative perspective, a personality color orange can become aloof, egotistical, self-centered and uncaring.

When feeling fearful, orange lovers feel it in their abdomen, as though it is tied in knots.

Doesn't nail everything but I don't know how you can't see Trump in there.



The Canadian National Anthem According To Justin Trudeau

 

Oh planet Earth! The home of native lands, 
True social law, in all of us demand.
With cattle farts, we view sea rise,
Our North sinking slowly.
From far and snide, oh planet Earth, 
Our healthcare is yours free!
Science save our land, harnessing the breeze,
Oh planet Earth, smoke weed and ferment yeast.
Oh planet Earth, ell gee bee queue and tee.

irstupid said:
o_O.Q said:

Love that photo. Sums it up perfectly.

Every like ten years we hear of some new "Socialist golden child" and the media and left point and praise it and say that is how it shoudl be done and it's the best country in the world.

Then 10 years later that very country is in a crisis, a total dictatorship, fleeing immigrants, ect. That place all of a sudden is "not socialism" but some new country that is doing it is the new golden child. 

Do you mind providing links showing us on the left 'praising' and saying that is 'how it should be done here' and it's 'the best country in the world' regarding Cambodia, Cuba, East Germany, North Korea, USSR, Ukraine, Venezuela?



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