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Game engines you especially like/don't like

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curl-6 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Yeah, I actually knew that. Its like. UE2.5 with a lot of modifications. Ironically the end result is something that just like a UE3 game.

But I would imagine there were some benefits going the route they did.

A very early version of the concept was in development for the original Xbox using UE2; it was probably easier and cheaper to keep their established baseplate and bolt new techniques and technologies onto it than restart it with UE3.

Based on how great the game looks, I can't imagine much remained from an original Xbox tech. Also, Xbox support was pretty much dead by 2004 in my opinion.

I guess it makes sense to stick with UE2.5 if they were really comfortable with the engine. Also, the early days of UE3 seemed like a struggle. I think I'm more curious why did Splinter Cell games stuck with UE2.5 even in 2013. I would have never guessed that was UE2.5 and it looks great considering.



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I have played 150 hours of odyssey on xbox one x due to 100% completion and had zero fps issue or any bugs. Popup happens in all open world games. Even witcher 3 and rdr 2 had it. Cant be helped on consolez. I rather have a stable fps with those issues . Bugs too happens in all open world.games. at least its not game breaking like bethesda ones 😂.

Their engine much like far cry can do native 4k res and stable frame rate. Amazing visuals and one best open world.games in terms of story and graphics at 4k out there.

Sure  dark souls engine has improved but they still have frame pacing issue which plagued bloodbourne. You would think they would have fixed it for sekiro lol.

Just cause maybe better optimized but the graphics in jc4 looks like 3 which is alright a tad on the ugly side.

Wished rage 2 used a better engine as playing it at 1080p 60fps on x is shameful at best. 

 

Mr Puggsly said:

dane007 said:
For consoles the worst engines are bethesda own engines, dark souls engine and just causee engine. The best one for me is farcry and assassin creed engine and wolfenstein engine

I believe the FromSoftware's (Dark Souls) engine improved very much with the 8th gen. Last gen was really bad.

Just Cause 4 is actually really well optimized on the CPU side, thus fixing the major problems in JC3.

I think Rage 2 actually uses the Just Cause engine, or at least some of their tech. Same developer either way.

The Assassin's Creed engine is sufficient more than "best." There is frame rate issues regardless of console. There is significant pop in, bugs, just weird open world jank. I really notice this because I play every game in the series and X1X hasn't addressed much of what annoys me albeit much sharper and better performing.

The id Tech 6 engine has been very impressive, that's what runs Wolfenstein II and Doom. While Doom Eternal will be using id Tech 7.



Mr Puggsly said:
curl-6 said:

A very early version of the concept was in development for the original Xbox using UE2; it was probably easier and cheaper to keep their established baseplate and bolt new techniques and technologies onto it than restart it with UE3.

Based on how great the game looks, I can't imagine much remained from an original Xbox tech. Also, Xbox support was pretty much dead by 2004 in my opinion.

I guess it makes sense to stick with UE2.5 if they were really comfortable with the engine. Also, the early days of UE3 seemed like a struggle. I think I'm more curious why did Splinter Cell games stuck with UE2.5 even in 2013. I would have never guessed that was UE2.5 and it looks great considering.

Probably not much left from the early build in terms of graphics, but it's amazing how long legacy code can hang around in an engine; I read a Treyarch dev during the 7th gen say the COD engine circa 2009 still contained remnants from the original Doom and Wolfenstein 3D.

And yeah, Blacklist's use of UE2 as late as 2013 was quite an interesting oddity, especially as, yeah, it looks damn good considering. It's a similar situation to how this year's Mortal Kombat 11 still runs on a heavily modified UE3. A lot of the time when devs have years worth of work invested in their own customized version of an older engine they can be loathe to part with it simply cos it saves them so much time and money to have a lot of their work already in place from past games.



I like the source engine. It's kinda old, but it was buttery smooth from the very beginning and the dev tools are a pleasure to use.

I dislike Unreal Engine 4 with a passion. Working with it is really clunky and most, if not all games based on it have loading times from hell.



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curl-6 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Based on how great the game looks, I can't imagine much remained from an original Xbox tech. Also, Xbox support was pretty much dead by 2004 in my opinion.

I guess it makes sense to stick with UE2.5 if they were really comfortable with the engine. Also, the early days of UE3 seemed like a struggle. I think I'm more curious why did Splinter Cell games stuck with UE2.5 even in 2013. I would have never guessed that was UE2.5 and it looks great considering.

Probably not much left from the early build in terms of graphics, but it's amazing how long legacy code can hang around in an engine; I read a Treyarch dev during the 7th gen say the COD engine circa 2009 still contained remnants from the original Doom and Wolfenstein 3D.

And yeah, Blacklist's use of UE2 as late as 2013 was quite an interesting oddity, especially as, yeah, it looks damn good considering. It's a similar situation to how this year's Mortal Kombat 11 still runs on a heavily modified UE3. A lot of the time when devs have years worth of work invested in their own customized version of an older engine they can be loathe to part with it simply cos it saves them so much time and money to have a lot of their work already in place from past games.

In regard to UE3, I think I would have liked to seen more developers using that over UE4.

Arkham Knight, Outlast 2 and Mortal Kombat 11 are actually some of the best looking games this gen and run at a high resolution. UE4 though, its really a mixed bag and has games running at 720p on a base X1. It seems to me UE3 would have been sufficient for numerous UE4 games, would have delivered comparable visuals with better resolutions and likely better load times.

The premium consoles do see significant improvments on premium consoles, but sometimes its just for 1080p like on the PS4 Pro. There are exceptions though, I consider Gears 4, Crackdown 3, Fortnite and Days Gone impressive. I'm sure there are other technically notable games using UE4.

On a side note, it possible moving a game from UE3 to UE4 isn't too difficult. However, the Batman remasters showed a simple port would have been better. While Gears of War: Ultimate is basically a great port and engine "upgrade" with improved visuals. Probably could have been 60 fps if they stuck with UE3 though.



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the-pi-guy said:

Frostbite Engine sounds particularly bad.

vivster said:

The whole premise of the thread is bad. Engines are nothing more than tools. Every major engine can do things well if the programmers are skilled enough and smart enough to use the engines for genres they are built for.

I mean I could say I hate Unity because there are people out there using it for visual novels instead of Renpy, but that's hardly Unity's fault. There are some great Unity games out there. That's like saying I hate hammers because someone hit me with one once.

I do like Renpy btw. It can be quite simple but also amazingly complex. Even in its default settings it produces proper results. But I'm sure if done right almost every engine could produce something similar, probably not as conveniently though.

Mostly agree.  Kind of don't.  

I agree because a developer can usually modify a game engine.  Game engines themselves don't usually limit the developer from having a certain look/feel, so in theory it doesn't really make sense to ask consumers what they think of a game engine.

On the other hand, developers might limit themselves to features already present in a game engine, so it is possible that users could tell what game engine is being used based off that.  

It is possible to have a bad set of tools.  It sounded like the Frostbite Engine wasn't particularly flexible and any feature had to be implemented by some other team.

A hammer is a bad tool when you try to screw in a light bulb. All you said comes back down to developers using the wrong tool for their job. If a developer is forced to use a certain engine then that's mostly out of budget constraints. Of course you'll get a bad result if you use a cheap tool to make quality art. But cheap tools are perfectly fine for simpler projects.



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OdinHades said:
I like the source engine. It's kinda old, but it was buttery smooth from the very beginning and the dev tools are a pleasure to use.

I dislike Unreal Engine 4 with a passion. Working with it is really clunky and most, if not all games based on it have loading times from hell.

The load times of UE4 are awful! I gave that a mention in my previous post.

That has really become apparent in fighting games (SFV, Tekken 7, SCVI), I literally get bored just waiting for a fight to begin and lose interest. Meanwhile MK X/11 and Injustice 2 load quickly thanks to their engine.

Load times are actually a lot faster on the X1X, probably thanks to the superior CPU speed. Frankly, if you're gonna play UE4 games consider a premium console.



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Mr Puggsly said:
Pemalite said:

Dragon Age: Inquisition being the only exception it seems.

****

For me. I dislike the Unreal Engine... Mostly because during the 7th gen every developer was using it for a title... And because of so many games using it, games started to look samey and have a similar feel with how they controlled and played.

Plus Unreal Engine games tend not to push the PC hard, especially during the 7th gen. We want FoV sliders, we want better visuals.

I kinda agree with your thoughts on UE3 last gen. But there was also a feeling that any game using UE3 is gonna look pretty good. Most notably, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Batman, Gears of War, Guilty Gear Xrd, Enslaved and plenty of other games looked great or had a unique presentation in spite of using the same engine.

I can see your complaint about PC, but at that time pushing PC graphics wasn't really a focus. I mean outside of EA, Ubisoft and random studios like CD Projekt.

Mass Effect 1 looked brilliant on Unreal Engine 3 at the time... Same with Mass Effect 2, Especially on 360. - The engine wasn't regarded as archaic by that point.
But by the time we got to Mass Effect 3 the engine limitations were starting to become readily apparent with blurry textures, skyboxes with limited resolution,  that sort of thing... Still a highly artistic game, but the engine was certainly holding it back compared to say... What Frostbite could deliver, especially on PC.

curl-6 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I kinda agree with your thoughts on UE3 last gen. But there was also a feeling that any game using UE3 is gonna look pretty good. Most notably, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Batman, Gears of War, Guilty Gear Xrd, Enslaved and plenty of other games looked great or had a unique presentation in spite of using the same engine.

I don't disagree with your point, but fun fact; Bioshock (and Bioshock 2) actually run on Unreal Engine 2, not 3.

Unreal Engine 2.5. But it was modified and added a ton of new effects to water, lighting and shadowing. - Helped rewrite some shaders for Bioshock back in the day to enable backwards compatibility on older GPU's just like with Oblivion.

In theory Bioshock 1 and 2 could have been ported to the Original Xbox as the engine was capable of running on that hardware really well.



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Pemalite said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I kinda agree with your thoughts on UE3 last gen. But there was also a feeling that any game using UE3 is gonna look pretty good. Most notably, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Batman, Gears of War, Guilty Gear Xrd, Enslaved and plenty of other games looked great or had a unique presentation in spite of using the same engine.

I can see your complaint about PC, but at that time pushing PC graphics wasn't really a focus. I mean outside of EA, Ubisoft and random studios like CD Projekt.

Mass Effect 1 looked brilliant on Unreal Engine 3 at the time... Same with Mass Effect 2, Especially on 360. - The engine wasn't regarded as archaic by that point.
But by the time we got to Mass Effect 3 the engine limitations were starting to become readily apparent with blurry textures, skyboxes with limited resolution,  that sort of thing... Still a highly artistic game, but the engine was certainly holding it back compared to say... What Frostbite could deliver, especially on PC.

curl-6 said:

I don't disagree with your point, but fun fact; Bioshock (and Bioshock 2) actually run on Unreal Engine 2, not 3.

Unreal Engine 2.5. But it was modified and added a ton of new effects to water, lighting and shadowing. - Helped rewrite some shaders for Bioshock back in the day to enable backwards compatibility on older GPU's just like with Oblivion.

In theory Bioshock 1 and 2 could have been ported to the Original Xbox as the engine was capable of running on that hardware really well.

Mass Effect 3's underwhelming presentation might be more reflective of Bioware than the engine. Frostbite delivers great visuals but primarily just when DICE is using it for Battlefield games. Also, the Battlefield games tend to treat PC as the lead especially during the 7th gen.

I think the OG Xbox could have handled Bioshock in some form. Just look at the iOS version of Bioshock, that looks much worse than games like Doom 3, Half Life 2 and Riddick on the OG Xbox. What I was really saying is the project likely changed very much over what might have been planned for 6th gen hardware, it just kept the same engine. That's why UE is so popular though, it certainly does scale.



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Pemalite said:

Unreal Engine 2.5. But it was modified and added a ton of new effects to water, lighting and shadowing. - Helped rewrite some shaders for Bioshock back in the day to enable backwards compatibility on older GPU's just like with Oblivion.

In theory Bioshock 1 and 2 could have been ported to the Original Xbox as the engine was capable of running on that hardware really well

I don't doubt they could have; speaking in purely mechanical terms Bioshock 1/2 weren't highly complex games in terms of having huge levels with lots of moving parts or tons of characters on screen, all you'd need to do was massively cut back on graphical fidelity and maybe break up the levels with loading screens like in Doom 3. The original Xbox ran a port of Half-Life 2 after all.

Still, I'm glad they came to the 7th gen instead as the increased graphical power allowed for a more atmospheric experience. The beautiful, creepy, haunting visuals were a big part of what made Bioshock so incredible, as such I can't help but feel they couldn't have lived up to their proper potential on 6th gen hardware.

Mr Puggsly said:
curl-6 said:

Probably not much left from the early build in terms of graphics, but it's amazing how long legacy code can hang around in an engine; I read a Treyarch dev during the 7th gen say the COD engine circa 2009 still contained remnants from the original Doom and Wolfenstein 3D.

And yeah, Blacklist's use of UE2 as late as 2013 was quite an interesting oddity, especially as, yeah, it looks damn good considering. It's a similar situation to how this year's Mortal Kombat 11 still runs on a heavily modified UE3. A lot of the time when devs have years worth of work invested in their own customized version of an older engine they can be loathe to part with it simply cos it saves them so much time and money to have a lot of their work already in place from past games.

In regard to UE3, I think I would have liked to seen more developers using that over UE4.

Arkham Knight, Outlast 2 and Mortal Kombat 11 are actually some of the best looking games this gen and run at a high resolution. UE4 though, its really a mixed bag and has games running at 720p on a base X1. It seems to me UE3 would have been sufficient for numerous UE4 games, would have delivered comparable visuals with better resolutions and likely better load times.

The premium consoles do see significant improvments on premium consoles, but sometimes its just for 1080p like on the PS4 Pro. There are exceptions though, I consider Gears 4, Crackdown 3, Fortnite and Days Gone impressive. I'm sure there are other technically notable games using UE4.

On a side note, it possible moving a game from UE3 to UE4 isn't too difficult. However, the Batman remasters showed a simple port would have been better. While Gears of War: Ultimate is basically a great port and engine "upgrade" with improved visuals. Probably could have been 60 fps if they stuck with UE3 though.

While I agree that UE3 has shown some excellent results on current gen hardware, (Outlast II especially) I'd also say UE4 has produced some beautiful games like Hellblade and Yoshi's Crafted World.