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Digital Foundry believes they may have found PS5's chipset

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shikamaru317 said:
HollyGamer said:

SO you contradicted your own original post??? 

How so? If AMD can manage to pull off a 1.5x improvement again, that would put Navi 10 at 10.6 tflops, which is within the 10-12 tflop range that Digital Foundry says to expect for PS5 in the video. If they can pull off a 1.6x improvement, which they have never done before to my knowledge, but might be possible since they have been working on Navi for nearly 3 years since Polaris released, that would put Navi 10 at 11.4 tflops (very close to the 11.1 tflop 48 compute unit number in the video). 

All I'm saying is, keep your expectations in check. Better to be pleasantly surprised if AMD does pull off a big improvement for Navi 10 over it's predecessor, than to be disappointed because you are expecting high end performance numbers from a mid-range chipset. 

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/radeon_navi_gpu_specifications_leak/1

This also confirm Navi 10 will able to achieve 1.8 teraflop LOL. So it aligned with Digital Foundry .

Like I said i don't fully believe final consumer PS5 will be 14,7 TF, probably 12 to 13 , because  Digital Foundry analisis said that. Based on Price leak also it will not be expensive, also it has been confirmed by AMD Navi 10 will be a new mainstream GPU.  All GTX 1080 and Vega 64 will be a new mainstream GPU standard 

Navi 10 = GTX 1080 + 15 % is actually believable , what else do you expect ? 



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HollyGamer said:
shikamaru317 said:

How so? If AMD can manage to pull off a 1.5x improvement again, that would put Navi 10 at 10.6 tflops, which is within the 10-12 tflop range that Digital Foundry says to expect for PS5 in the video. If they can pull off a 1.6x improvement, which they have never done before to my knowledge, but might be possible since they have been working on Navi for nearly 3 years since Polaris released, that would put Navi 10 at 11.4 tflops (very close to the 11.1 tflop 48 compute unit number in the video). 

All I'm saying is, keep your expectations in check. Better to be pleasantly surprised if AMD does pull off a big improvement for Navi 10 over it's predecessor, than to be disappointed because you are expecting high end performance numbers from a mid-range chipset. 

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/radeon_navi_gpu_specifications_leak/1

This also confirm Navi 10 will able to achieve 1.8 teraflop LOL. So it aligned with Digital Foundry .

Like I said i don't fully believe final consumer PS5 will be 14,7 TF, probably 12 to 13 , because  Digital Foundry analisis said that. Based on Price leak also it will not be expensive, also it has been confirmed by AMD Navi 10 will be a new mainstream GPU.  All GTX 1080 and Vega 64 will be a new mainstream GPU standard 

Navi 10 = GTX 1080 + 15 % is actually believable , what else do you expect ? 

There is nothing in that article about how many CU's Navi 10 will have, or how many tflops. It says that Navi 10 will have a 1.8 ghz clock rate, the exact same as the AMD Gonzalo chip, but without knowing the CU count you can't determine the tflops. 

What that article does say is this:

"With reference pricing of $259, RX Vega 56/GTX 1080 (tier) performance would give Radeon a huge advantage over Nvidia in the mid-range of the GPU market, easily surpassing their Turing-based GTX 1660 Ti, which has an MSRP of $279."

OC3D is expecting Vega 56/GTX 1080 tier performance from Navi 10 in other words. Vega 56 is a 10.5 tflop GPU, which falls almost exactly in line with the 1.5x improvement over Polaris 30 I said to expect for Navi 10. 



Unless AMD has somehow massively improved their GCN architecture with Navi, I find it ver, very hard to believe that it will reach 1.8GHz on something as limited by airflow as a home console.

So far, their fastest graphics processor based on the GCN architecture is the Radeon VII, based on Vega 20 and made on 7nm, with a base clock of 1,400MHz and a boost clock of 1,750MHz. And that thing needs three fans to cool its 295W TDP.

So, as I said, unless AMD has done magic with Navi, I don't see how PS5 can have a 1.8GHz GPU.



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

shikamaru317 said:
HollyGamer said:

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/radeon_navi_gpu_specifications_leak/1

This also confirm Navi 10 will able to achieve 1.8 teraflop LOL. So it aligned with Digital Foundry .

Like I said i don't fully believe final consumer PS5 will be 14,7 TF, probably 12 to 13 , because  Digital Foundry analisis said that. Based on Price leak also it will not be expensive, also it has been confirmed by AMD Navi 10 will be a new mainstream GPU.  All GTX 1080 and Vega 64 will be a new mainstream GPU standard 

Navi 10 = GTX 1080 + 15 % is actually believable , what else do you expect ? 

There is nothing in that article about how many CU's Navi 10 will have, or how many tflops. It says that Navi 10 will have a 1.8 ghz clock rate, the exact same as the AMD Gonzalo chip, but without knowing the CU count you can't determine the tflops. 

What that article does say is this:

"With reference pricing of $259, RX Vega 56/GTX 1080 (tier) performance would give Radeon a huge advantage over Nvidia in the mid-range of the GPU market, easily surpassing their Turing-based GTX 1660 Ti, which has an MSRP of $279."

OC3D is expecting Vega 56/GTX 1080 tier performance from Navi 10 in other words. Vega 56 is a 10.5 tflop GPU, which falls almost exactly in line with the 1.5x improvement over Polaris 30 I said to expect for Navi 10. 

Then also "  Tum Apisak "  leak that mentioned by Digital Foundry and Adored TV guy, they  agree about the performance of navi 10 will be around  Vega 64 + 15% , While Digital foundry said 1,8 Ghz with 64 CU  will be around 14,7 teraflop, 60 Cu will be around 13,8 teraflop, 56 Cu will be 12 teraflo etc etc until 32 CU. All Navi price will be around 430 USD to 130 USD. 

As in fact I am agree with your post "12 teraflop" but i am slightly more optimist that PS5 will be around 13 teraflop (60 CU) from 64 CU disable.  



HollyGamer said:
shikamaru317 said:

How so? If AMD can manage to pull off a 1.5x improvement again, that would put Navi 10 at 10.6 tflops, which is within the 10-12 tflop range that Digital Foundry says to expect for PS5 in the video. If they can pull off a 1.6x improvement, which they have never done before to my knowledge, but might be possible since they have been working on Navi for nearly 3 years since Polaris released, that would put Navi 10 at 11.4 tflops (very close to the 11.1 tflop 48 compute unit number in the video). 

All I'm saying is, keep your expectations in check. Better to be pleasantly surprised if AMD does pull off a big improvement for Navi 10 over it's predecessor, than to be disappointed because you are expecting high end performance numbers from a mid-range chipset. 

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/radeon_navi_gpu_specifications_leak/1

This also confirm Navi 10 will able to achieve 1.8 teraflop LOL. So it aligned with Digital Foundry .

Like I said i don't fully believe final consumer PS5 will be 14,7 TF, probably 12 to 13 , because  Digital Foundry analisis said that. Based on Price leak also it will not be expensive, also it has been confirmed by AMD Navi 10 will be a new mainstream GPU.  All GTX 1080 and Vega 64 will be a new mainstream GPU standard 

Navi 10 = GTX 1080 + 15 % is actually believable , what else do you expect ? 

Also, I just found this in a PC Gamer article about Navi:

"Looking at the Vega 64 vs. Radeon VII core size, we can get at least a reasonable estimate of what can be done. Vega 10 (Vega 64) at 14nm is a 486mm^2 die with 12.5 billion transistors, Vega 20 (Radeon VII) at 7nm is a 331mm^2 die with 13.2 billion transistors. That's 32 percent smaller with 6 percent more transistors. With similar scaling, AMD could end up with a 200mm^2 die with 40-48 CUs (2560 to 3072 streaming cores). Toss in higher clockspeeds and lower power consumption, with more memory bandwidth thanks to GDDR6, and the top Navi 10 part could be competitive with RTX 2070."

PC Gamer says they are expecting between 40 and 48 CU's for Navi 10. Based on the scale in Digital Foundry's video, that would be 9.2 tflops for 40 CU's and 11.1 tflops for 48 CU's. So yeah, I wouldn't expect more than 11.1 tflop for PS5 if I was you, unless Sony decides to wait on Navi 20's release in 2020 instead of using Navi 10. 



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shikamaru317 said:
HollyGamer said:

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/gpu_displays/radeon_navi_gpu_specifications_leak/1

This also confirm Navi 10 will able to achieve 1.8 teraflop LOL. So it aligned with Digital Foundry .

Like I said i don't fully believe final consumer PS5 will be 14,7 TF, probably 12 to 13 , because  Digital Foundry analisis said that. Based on Price leak also it will not be expensive, also it has been confirmed by AMD Navi 10 will be a new mainstream GPU.  All GTX 1080 and Vega 64 will be a new mainstream GPU standard 

Navi 10 = GTX 1080 + 15 % is actually believable , what else do you expect ? 

Also, I just found this in a PC Gamer article about Navi:

"Looking at the Vega 64 vs. Radeon VII core size, we can get at least a reasonable estimate of what can be done. Vega 10 (Vega 64) at 14nm is a 486mm^2 die with 12.5 billion transistors, Vega 20 (Radeon VII) at 7nm is a 331mm^2 die with 13.2 billion transistors. That's 32 percent smaller with 6 percent more transistors. With similar scaling, AMD could end up with a 200mm^2 die with 40-48 CUs (2560 to 3072 streaming cores). Toss in higher clockspeeds and lower power consumption, with more memory bandwidth thanks to GDDR6, and the top Navi 10 part could be competitive with RTX 2070."

PC Gamer says they are expecting between 40 and 48 CU's for Navi 10. Based on the scale in Digital Foundry's video, that would be 9.2 tflops for 40 CU's and 11.1 tflops for 48 CU's. So yeah, I wouldn't expect more than 11.1 tflop for PS5 if I was you, unless Sony decides to wait on Navi 20's release in 2020 instead of using Navi 10. 

Then also "  Tum Apisak "  leak that mentioned by Digital Foundry and Adored TV guy, they  agree about the performance of navi 10 will be around  Vega 64 + 15% , While Digital foundry said 1,8 Ghz with 64 CU  will be around 14,7 teraflop, 60 Cu will be around 13,8 teraflop, 56 Cu will be 12 teraflo etc etc until 32 CU. All Navi price will be around 430 USD to 130 USD. 

As in fact I am agree with your post "12 teraflop" but i am slightly more optimist that PS5 will be around 13 teraflop (60 CU) from 64 CU disable.  

PS4 pro die is about 325 mm^2  APU size while for the GPU 235 mm^2.   It hit the jackpot , I believe it will be more than 48 CU, 56 CU  (12 teraflop ) is possible. 

From your source https://www.pcgamer.com/amd-navi-specs-release-date-price-and-everything-we-know/ : "  If Navi does end up competing with the RTX 2080, I expect the price will start closer to $450-$500—but without ray tracing support or Tensor cores. " also the same source  "Navi 20 (a variant of which is likely to find its way into the PlayStation 5) will be where AMD adds ray tracing hardware, and it will replace the current Vega and Radeon VII cards, but it likely won't be available until 2020. "

And PS5 APU will be ready in Q3 2020 https://www.digitimes.com/news/a20190416PD205.html

It's actually also aligned with my previous source https://youtu.be/7mJCOSXe_zc?t=781 which is Navi 20 that cost 430 USD.

So yeah 12 to 13 Teraflop is my opinion based on these leak and analysis. 

Last edited by HollyGamer - on 20 April 2019

When I was looking at the leak i thout it's garbage. Right now after the reavel I  think the info is spot on. At the end if it is 13-14 tf for only 50 $ (449) more then PS4 price that's  some black voodo magic from Sony. The other interesting thing  that i thout was crazy is  GTA 6 exclussive deal. Right now afer the huge rumor about Sony buying Take Two i think there might be some truth in their a partnership. Fo sure there is no buy-out but some kind of deal. If there is smoke there is always a fire.



I posted that chip before, as Gonzalo was rumored to be the Chip for the next gen consoles.

However, if the 95W TDP is correct, this won't be it, that's just gonna be a higher-end APU (all Ryzen APU to date were 65W or less).

With 95W, even in 7nm, that wouldn't be enough to even compete with the PS4 Pro. This chip could reach 2.5-3TFlops, far below even the 4.2TFlops of the PS4 Pro



Bofferbrauer2 said:
I posted that chip before, as Gonzalo was rumored to be the Chip for the next gen consoles.

However, if the 95W TDP is correct, this won't be it, that's just gonna be a higher-end APU (all Ryzen APU to date were 65W or less).

With 95W, even in 7nm, that wouldn't be enough to even compete with the PS4 Pro. This chip could reach 2.5-3TFlops, far below even the 4.2TFlops of the PS4 Pro

Yeah, the 95 watts seems too low for sure. Sure it's a 7nm chipset, two die shrinks down from the 16nm Xbox One X chipset, but I don't see how they could get the power usage down from 175 watts on Xbox One X to 95 watts on PS5, just from 2 die shrink's, while increasing the tflops from 6 to 10-12, with a more powerful CPU as well. Something seems off there for sure. Maybe the 95 watts is for the CPU in the APU only, with an extra 150 watts from the GPU (Navi 10 is rumored to have a 150 watt TDP)? 

Last edited by shikamaru317 - on 20 April 2019

shikamaru317 said:

Yeah, the 95 watts seems too low for sure. Sure it's a 7nm chipset, two die shrinks down rom the 16nm Xbox One X chipset, but I don't see how they could get the power usage down from 175 watts on Xbox One X to 95 watts on PS5, just from 2 die shrink's, while increasing the tflops from 6 to 10-12, with a more powerful CPU as well. Something seems off there for sure. Maybe the 95 watts is for the CPU in the APU only, with an extra 150 watts from the GPU (Navi 10 is rumored to have a 150 watt TDP)?

One of the millions of rumours was that the base clock was 1GHz with a boost max of 1.8GHz. There is no way an AMD gpu at 1.8GHz blows 95 Watts only. At 1Ghz, it is entirely possible for the gpu.