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Forums - Sales Discussion - PS5>XB4>NS units sold next gen

Bofferbrauer2 said:
mZuzek said:

I bought the 32GB, Wind Waker bundle. Came with a Wii Sensor Bar, but definitely not a Wiimote.

That's odd, I bought the original 32GB Bundle with Nintendoland, and that one had a Wiimote. Hence why I thought all Wii U came with a Wiimote, too.

I'm looking at my deluxe set 32GB Nintendo Land launch bundle box and there is no wiimote included. 

Includes:

Wii U Console

Wii U GamePad

Wii U AC Adapter

Wii U GamePad AC Adapter

HDMI Cable

Sensor Bar

Wii U GamePad Cradle

Wii U GamePad Stand

Wii U Console Stand

Nintendo Land Game Disc

The only way you got a Wiimote with your Wii U would be if the store you bought it at included one separately but I can guarantee that North American deluxe bundles did not have Wiimotes inside the bundle box.

Last edited by sethnintendo - on 06 May 2019

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sethnintendo said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

That's odd, I bought the original 32GB Bundle with Nintendoland, and that one had a Wiimote. Hence why I thought all Wii U came with a Wiimote, too.

I'm looking at my deluxe set 32GB Nintendo Land launch bundle box and there is no wiimote included. 

Includes:

Wii U Console

Wii U GamePad

Wii U AC Adapter

Wii U GamePad AC Adapter

HDMI Cable

Sensor Bar

Wii U GamePad Cradle

Wii U GamePad Stand

Wii U Console Stand

Nintendo Land Game Disc

The only way you got a Wiimote with your Wii U would be if the store you bought it at included one separately but I can guarantee that North American deluxe bundles did not have Wiimotes inside the bundle box.

I wish I had my box around here, but my (European) Version clearly had a Wiimote. I did buy a separate Wiimote, too, but that one was of a different color.



How well PS5 and X2 sell will largely depend on their launch prices, exclusive library, and quality of life/OS features. If either of them launch at $500+, don't expect the same turn out as before in 2013 - especially in regards to PS4.

If Sony returns with multiple SKU, $600 MSRP for the PS5 like in 2006 again - they're f**ed. I think they learned their lesson but who knows....



The only reason why it is perplexing to some that the Switch is regarded as current generation rather than next generation system is because they can't countenance the possibility that it will compete with the majority of it's life against the PS4/X1 rather than against the PS5/X? so if the rumors of a late 2020 release are true then for the Switch to declare itself as truly next generation, it'll have to hold out solely until the end of the first half of 2024 before a new successor arrives ...

If Switch's successor doesn't launch by 2021, we will have to ask why Nintendo is granting Sony and Microsoft such a long headstart. Why do they allow Sony and Microsoft to establish a large installed base before they launch their own gen 9 console?

It's because they realize that the Switch or it's successor won't ever serve as a true opponent to the PS4/X1 or let alone the next systems from Sony or Microsoft. It's not like either Sony or Microsoft have to force Nintendo's hands to release a new system by 2021 since they're headed into a direction where Nintendo itself can NEVER follow because of the fact obvious to everyone by now that they've abandoned competing against home consoles ... 

For once, the paths between portables and home systems will diverge so the experiences between them will never be the same and at most Nintendo will only serve as an indirect competitor against Sony or Microsoft from here on out ... 



RolStoppable said:

Looks like you didn't follow the conversation. The Dreamcast competed most of its life against the PS1 and N64 and was discontinued before the GC and Xbox launched. You may use that as a starting point for your argument and explain why you consider the Dreamcast a gen 5 console.

I don't recall the Switch being a signal to exit the market like the Dreamcast was. Do you believe that Nintendo will cut loose that soon as well in that case too ? 

RolStoppable said:

You are also confusing your opinion with fact. Nintendo hasn't abandoned competiton with home consoles. The only thing they did was abandon the idea to make a console that is about playing PC games on a console instead of a PC, but if Nintendo's history is reviewed, then that interpretation of the purpose of a console was never theirs to begin with. If all consoles had to always be the same, then Sony and Microsoft would have to be condemned for turning consoles into a dumbed down PC experience, because that direction wasn't something that Atari, Nintendo and Sega pursued. Obviously, Sony and Microsoft had to choose what works for them, including the decisions to leave the portable console market entirely to Nintendo.

Nintendo games continue to be played on TVs all around the world. When a Nintendo game is played, it means neither the PS and Xbox will be on, because the TV is already occupied.

Considering the Switch is hardly putting a dent on either the PS4 or X1 in it's sales, just about anyone would think that they've made an exit and a quiet one at that. What is considered to be a 'PC game' or a 'console game' is at best ambiguous in large part so neither Sony or Microsoft's interpretation of it is an issue ... 

Going by the last line of your logic, PC is about as much of a competitor to home consoles like the Switch is because it can be played on TV! Think about that for a moment ... 



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RolStoppable said:

It's interesting where you are going with this.

1. Is that supposed to mean that the Dreamcast is gen 6 because it was Sega's last console, so Switch could only be gen 9 if it was Nintendo's last console? That contradicts your previous assertion that Switch can't be gen 9 because you assume that it will compete against the PS4 and XB1 for most of its life.

2. It's the nature of blue ocean products that they don't cut significantly into the sales of other products. But this goes both ways and I doubt anyone would argue that Sony or Microsoft made an exit when the PS5 and XB4 can't put a dent into Switch sales. I didn't say that Sony and Microsoft's direction is an issue; it's you who wants to pretend that there's something wrong with what Nintendo does and therefore it should count as exit from the home console market.

As for PCs being able to connect to a TV, in practical terms they are only used that way by a tiny minority, read notably less than 1% of users. The same holds true for the ability of smart devices to connect to a TV. As such, none of those aforementioned devices are comparable to Switch when it comes to practical usage, because the majority of Switch consoles are used to play video games on a TV.

Let's cut to the chase, rol ... 

1. Just because Sega announced the discontinuation of the Dreamcast did not mean that it immediately in effect stopped competing against the PS2 thereafter. There were nearly 2 million unsold units and it was very much on shelves well into the holidays of that year as well. It's time that you face the music, rol. Nobody else aside from you and a couple of others recognize the Switch as being a truly next generation system. The NPD Group or Sony/Microsoft doesn't identify the Switch as a next generation system and neither do the rest of the industry as well. A new generation is not defined as the "Nintendo competition cycle" as you would like to believe but it is defined as an "industry-wide competition cycle". The second generation kick started a race between the Fairchild Channel F and the Atari 2600. Similarly, a new race started between the SG-1000 and the NES which defined the 3rd generation. For the 4th generation, when the TurboGrafx-16 coincided with the release of Genesis it signaled the beginning of a new generation as well. For the rest, the 5th gen started with 3DO/Jaguar, 6th gen sparked with the release of Dreamcast/PS2, with 7th gen we had DS/PSP, and last at the 8th gen the 3DS/Vita marked the start of this current generation. As a consequence of all this when the new systems release between Sony and Microsoft, nobody else is going to mistake the Switch as being their true competitor because what defines a new generation is a matter of public perception at hand which is why you keep being in utter denial about the possibility of the Switch in all very high likelihood being an 8th generation system ... (it's beautiful how when the whole industry determines whenever, wherever, however, or whatever for itself it creates cognitive dissonance within you

2. Except the problem with your theory is that the Switch left a few boxes unticked to be clearly deemed as "blue ocean" so the Switch is about as much of a "blue ocean" as the Windows platform is both of which are just straight monopolies. 'Direction' is irrelevant as you'll soon later figure out ... 

"As for PCs being able to connect to a TV, in practical terms they are only used that way by a tiny minority, read notably less than 1% of users." Lawl, you're resorting to a double standard. I could've just used Google Stadia as an example because it can also be connected and played on the TV as well since nearly 100% of it's users can do so then you'll just introduce another standard by reacting with "b-b-but but it's not hardware like the Switch!" all because you keep making exceptions for your favourite corporation ...  



Holy crap, why is it so hard for some to grasp that Switch is a 9th gen console? Sure, it will be 3 years that it has "competed" with the PS4 and XBO, but it will most likely have 4+ years of competing with the PS5 and XB2. Nintendo has also stated that they plan on riding out Switch for as long as they can. This most likely means a upgraded version, a la the Pro. And really, Switch would have probably arrived a year later had the Wii U not turned out so poorly.

Sadly, it seems some silly people on Wikipedia decided to label it 8th gen, too.  So, Nintendo has 3 8th gen consoles?  Ridiculous.  So, are people really going to try to say that the span of time for a beginning of a gen is now over 5 years long?  That's pretty much a freaking generation in itself.  Previously, it was only ~2-3 years.

Last edited by thismeintiel - on 06 May 2019

I guess the part im having a hard time understanding is how there is any correlation between relative power and console sales.



bowserthedog said:

I guess the part im having a hard time understanding is how there is any correlation between relative power and console sales.

Usually the highest powered consoles would sell the least.  It was true till this gen with PS4. 



RolStoppable said:

1. You say that the Dreamcast counts as gen 6 because it competed with the PS2 for a short time, but Switch can't be considered gen 9 despite the blatantly obvious expectation that it will compete with the PS5 and XB4 for much longer than the Dreamcast competed with the PS2. Your other point is that generations would cease to exist if Nintendo were the only console manufacturer left. If Sony hadn't exited the handheld market and launched a Vita successor in 2016 when it was due, then we would already have two consoles in gen 9 and you wouldn't be confused. In your argument you recognize that the DS and PSP, and the 3DS and Vita started a new generation, so you should realize that the successor to the 3DS (which the Switch is, because it's not only the successor to the Wii U) constitutes the start of a new generation.

I know you realize all that, because all of this is an act of yours. You do not really believe what you post.

2. If you think a few boxes have been left unticked, you should actually mention what they are.

It's pointless if you bring up hypotheticals when I am talking about practical terms. A proper counter-argument would be to disprove that the majority of Switch consoles are used to play video games on a TV. But that's something that you can't do, so your initial point that Switch doesn't compete with other home consoles doesn't hold water.

1. This isn't my ruling, it's the industry's ruling so if they consider Dreamcast to be 6th gen and the Switch to be 8th gen then so be it. I don't believe the industry uses the absolute length of competition metric like you seem to think but they use a relative length of competition as the comparison metric ... 

@Bold The DS WITH PSP and the 3DS WITH VITA both constituted a new generation. A sole release of a new system alone like the Switch DOES NOT constitute a new generation. For there to be a new generation, there needs to exist a new competition cycle as well and since a new system alone can't trigger this then the Switch in that case joins the existing competition cycle with 8th gen systems like the PS4/X1 ... 

This might change in the future if Nintendo decides not to kill the Switch early by say 2023 but for now the Switch will be viewed as a late entrant to the 8th generation or things might not change at all since since they could as easily delay the new systems by another year since bringing upon a new generation is at their mercy ... (my belief does not matter in this instance) 

RolStoppable said:

2. If you think a few boxes have been left unticked, you should actually mention what they are.

It's pointless if you bring up hypotheticals when I am talking about practical terms. A proper counter-argument would be to disprove that the majority of Switch consoles are used to play video games on a TV. But that's something that you can't do, so your initial point that Switch doesn't compete with other home consoles doesn't hold water.

2. Well for two things, the Switch ISN'T creating an uncontested market OR creating new demand for the most part since these things were inherited by Nintendo's previous incumbent system which was the 3DS so the Switch like any other are just old regular monopolies such as Windows but I suspect you might end up being delusional enough to argue otherwise ... 

How was my previous example the PC in ANY way hypothetical ? Because of your flawed logic, you had cover for it with a double standard such as "X% of users must use these features to be counted" but like I said before favouritism for a corporation does some weird things just as you seem detest nationalism for much of the same ...