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GoT season 8 final episode 6 tonight. (spoiler discussion) Fin. The end... for ever.

Forums - General Discussion - GoT season 8 final episode 6 tonight. (spoiler discussion) Fin. The end... for ever.

I'm...

Hyped. 24 55.81%
 
Mildly interested. 11 25.58%
 
Not bothered. 5 11.63%
 
/indifferent/not watched/other in comments. 3 6.98%
 
Total:43

Moving this discussion to the next episode... who do people think is going to be on the Iron Throne by the end?

Given the fact that many story arcs seem to be coming full circle (Mad Targaryen on the Throne again, Jaime going back to Cersei, Arya looking like a little girl again), I'm going to go with Gendry Baratheon, who ends up in a loveless political marriage with Sansa but spends the next 20 years pining over Arya, and drinks and whores himself into a fat King surrounded devious schemers. And Podrick will be his Hand...

I'm joking... but it could happen!

Oh, and Ghost will come back to piss on Jon's corpse... and possibly the Throne for good measure. Seriously, just pet him FFS!



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KiigelHeart said:

I'm on phone so no quotes, sorry.

No one left to fear her? It's just a one city after all. Doesn't Westeros have like many kingdoms? Now there's definitely reason to fear her. For a moment her dragons looked vulnerable.

And yes I still say she sees enemies everywhere. Obviously she won't tell Jon, the rightful heir, that. Her options were pretty much to accept the surrender which would likely lead Jon taking the throne or choose the fear and become a tyrant. Of course I don't think she had a clear plan, she hasn't had one for a while. She's been portrayed to be driven by the hunger for power and anger for a good while.

She executed Varys without emotion. Tyrion plead her to stop the attack if she heard the bells but you could tell she wouldn't accept it. And Robert Baratheon said the world would burn if Dany came to Westeros :P There was no need for her to go full HEERE'S JOHNNY at any point, we've seen her slowly descenting into madness.

There's plenty of other poorly written plotlines or retconning in latest seasons and yeah everything feels a bit rushed. This one was fine though. Predictable, but fine.

edit. Oh and that Sansa example is a bad one. Completely different characters. There's a reason why so many viewers including myself have been thinking Dany is being corrupted by power and going mad for many seasons. Nobody expects anything like this from Sansa. 

I hope that's not a reply to me, because none of that, aside from "Sansa is a completely different character" addressed anything I said.
And I agree with that. That was just pointing out why going through things unrelated to killing innocent women and children does not set up a character to do so. Hints towards possibly going down that path are just that. Nothing in Daenerys character suggested she would kill innocent people after they surrendered.

Take all the time you need to reply to my post properly. No worries. But I would appreciate a proper reply at some point since I took the time to make one for you.

Last edited by Hiku - on 15 May 2019

KiigelHeart said:

I'm on phone so no quotes, sorry.

No one left to fear her? It's just a one city after all. Doesn't Westeros have like many kingdoms? Now there's definitely reason to fear her. For a moment her dragons looked vulnerable.

And yes I still say she sees enemies everywhere. Obviously she won't tell Jon, the rightful heir, that. Her options were pretty much to accept the surrender which would likely lead Jon taking the throne or choose the fear and become a tyrant. Of course I don't think she had a clear plan, she hasn't had one for a while. She's been portrayed to be driven by the hunger for power and anger for a good while.

She executed Varys without emotion. Tyrion plead her to stop the attack if she heard the bells but you could tell she wouldn't accept it. And Robert Baratheon said the world would burn if Dany came to Westeros :P There was no need for her to go full HEERE'S JOHNNY at any point, we've seen her slowly descenting into madness.

There's plenty of other poorly written plotlines or retconning in latest seasons and yeah everything feels a bit rushed. This one was fine though. Predictable, but fine.

edit. Oh and that Sansa example is a bad one. Completely different characters. There's a reason why so many viewers including myself have been thinking Dany is being corrupted by power and going mad for many seasons. Nobody expects anything like this from Sansa. 

@bolded

Looking back I don't remember her showing any emotion when executing people going right back to Season 1 when her brother died in a most brutal fashion.

She has the ability to switch off all emotion and de-humanize someone if they don't follow her.



Scoobes said:
Moving this discussion to the next episode... who do people think is going to be on the Iron Throne by the end?

I already know, but I'm going to say what I was thinking disregarding that information, whether that actually will happen or not, a few seasons ago back when I thought trying to think about this logically was a good idea.

I thought someone (probably Jon) would destroy the Iron Throne, because so many bad things have come from it, and having another Targaryan sitting on it, even if they are half Stark, wouldn't be the 'lesson learnt' from all of this.

Last edited by Hiku - on 15 May 2019

Why does the whole town explode when Misses flies her dragon over it and breathes fire on the STONE buildings (less than a second per STONE house)?



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drkohler said:
Why does the whole town explode when Misses flies her dragon over it and breathes fire on the STONE buildings (less than a second per STONE house)?

It was previously established that the fire from dragons could destroy stone buildings. Remember Harrenhal?

This was all that was left after Aegon Targaryen and his two sisters attacked Harrenhal during the War of Conquest https://gameofthrones.fandom.com/wiki/Burning_of_Harrenhal

If you want a non-lore reason though, the city was destroyed so quickly to save on CGI budget. It's a common technique in tv shows, for instance in Star Trek Deep Space 9, during the Dominion War, none of the ships are shown to have shields during the battle sequences, allowing them to be destroyed in seconds. This was done to cut down on the budget. 



Hiku said:
KiigelHeart said:

One of the better episodes of the season. I have no idea why people think Dany's snapping was too sudden. It's been hinted and her character developed to it for many seasons.

Not that she would kill innocent people.
She had killed enemies, and traitors who refused to yield. There's a long way between that and focusing on melting innocent women and children while giving Cercei (the real enemy) time to escape. 

Foreshadowing is not the same as having a proper and satisfying conclusion.

Depends on how you define innocent, enemy or traitor. If we look back to Essos for instance, after the siege of Meereen she indiscriminately and randomly picks 160+ of the Masters to be crucified. We justify it because they were slavers and because it's presented as a liberation with the brutality of the slaver children fresh in our minds beforehand. But as we see in later episodes some of the Masters treated their slaves well and would not have been involved in those actions, but to her, it's black and white.

Given her narcissism which has been on display for many seasons now, who she's see's as an enemy is also fluid and especially as her most trusted advisors (who typically calm her more ruthless side) are now dead I really don't see this dark side of her as a particularly rapid turn of events. 



KiigelHeart said:

One of the better episodes of the season. I have no idea why people think Dany's snapping was too sudden. It's been hinted and her character developed to it for many seasons.

"The more the better"

Thi is the approach the writers took on this one.
You know, like when Michael Bay made the first Transformers movie and thought: 'You know what? People love explosions! yeah, if we put more explosions people will love the movies even more!"

So these writers sat and said:

- "You know what? People love to be shocked. What can we do to shock them even more? I mean, we have already beheaded our seemingly main character. Then we slaughtered our new seemingly main characters while stabbing a pregnant lady in the guts. And then we burned a little girl on the stake. I mean, what could we possibly do that would top that?"

- "Well, we could have Dany attack the Red Carpet, killing in the process hundreds of the civilians taking shelter in there"

-"Nahh.. We NEED MORE"

- "Ok, how about after ringing the bells and the city surrenders, Cersei gives the order to activate the traps with wildfire, killing most of Dany's troops, causing Dany to completely lose it"

-"That sounds cool. But not shocking enough. We NEED MORE"

But it turns out the more is not always better. Just like you, I was totally expecting Dany to snap, but when it happened I was like: "Really? this is the best you came up with?. Sorry but to me the whole scene seemed so cartoonish that I just couldn't stop laughing at it.



Scoobes said:
Hiku said:

Not that she would kill innocent people.
She had killed enemies, and traitors who refused to yield. There's a long way between that and focusing on melting innocent women and children while giving Cercei (the real enemy) time to escape. 

Foreshadowing is not the same as having a proper and satisfying conclusion.

Depends on how you define innocent, enemy or traitor. If we look back to Essos for instance, after the siege of Meereen she indiscriminately and randomly picks 160+ of the Masters to be crucified. We justify it because they were slavers and because it's presented as a liberation with the brutality of the slaver children fresh in our minds beforehand. But as we see in later episodes some of the Masters treated their slaves well and would not have been involved in those actions, but to her, it's black and white.

Given her narcissism which has been on display for many seasons now, who she's see's as an enemy is also fluid and especially as her most trusted advisors (who typically calm her more ruthless side) are now dead I really don't see this dark side of her as a particularly rapid turn of events. 

Yeah, but for slave owners I think they made her views on them pretty clear. Even someone who treats their slaves well are still robbing them of their freedom. It wasn't just the mistreatment of slaves she was against, but the whole system.

This was illustrated when she didn't mistreat the unsullied either, but still left the choice to them if they wanted to follow her or not.

Slave owners are a pretty far cry from babies.

Last edited by Hiku - on 15 May 2019

chakkra said:

KiigelHeart said:

One of the better episodes of the season. I have no idea why people think Dany's snapping was too sudden. It's been hinted and her character developed to it for many seasons.

"The more the better"

Thi is the approach the writers took on this one.
You know, like when Michael Bay made the first Transformers movie and thought: 'You know what? People love explosions! yeah, if we put more explosions people will love the movies even more!"

So these writers sat and said:

- "You know what? People love to be shocked. What can we do to shock them even more? I mean, we have already beheaded our seemingly main character. Then we slaughtered our new seemingly main characters while stabbing a pregnant lady in the guts. And then we burned a little girl on the stake. I mean, what could we possibly do that would top that?"

- "Well, we could have Dany attack the Red Carpet, killing in the process hundreds of the civilians taking shelter in there"

-"Nahh.. We NEED MORE"

- "Ok, how about after ringing the bells and the city surrenders, Cersei gives the order to activate the traps with wildfire, killing most of Dany's troops, causing Dany to completely lose it"

-"That sounds cool. But not shocking enough. We NEED MORE"

But it turns out the more is not always better. Just like you, I was totally expecting Dany to snap, but when it happened I was like: "Really? this is the best you came up with?. Sorry but to me the whole scene seemed so cartoonish that I just couldn't stop laughing at it.

Nah man, I don't like or watch Transformer movies and stuff like that. I thought it was good writing that she snapped after the city surrendered. When I watched and the bells rang I was a bit baffled that after her scenes with Jon and Tyrion she would just take the city without killing civilians. She was obviously going crazy and Cercei did not surrender. She did threathen to burn the city down.

What I liked is that when she started killing they didn't show her anymore. Even though I was expecting her to snap it left the viewer as stunned as Jon, Tyrion and even Cercei. They were predicting it but hoping for the best. We don't know what's going on with her and what happens next. 

Your examples might have worked too but it would be a little straightforward. It wasn't supposed to be yet another moral choice for Dany to accept civilian casualties among enemy soldiers, we've been past that. And Cercei with another surprise trap..meh