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Bandorr said:
The_Yoda said:

I hate the way people respond like that. It requires constant scrolling.  Although it is cleaner.

That was an interesting Snopes article. Although it makes some equal points as well. "Trump is in the center of the photograph at the head of the table, everyone pictured is dressed neatly in suit and tie, the subjects are all looking into the camera and appear to be emotionally composed, and the table curiously contains a bunch of colorful ethernet cables that don’t appear to be connect to anything."

So staged as in "not natural" as opposed to "staged because he wasn't there". Thank you for the article.

It was the last time BECAUSE of trump. BECAUSE of his attitude toward the kurds.  Instead of protecting them, he let Turkey run over them. Which endangered the mission. It was rushed because of that.  We had them take down their barriers against Turkey because it would help with the raid.  They did it, we didn't hold our part of the deal.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/10/donald-trump-baghdadi-whimpering

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-officials-had-no-clue-where-he-got-whimpering-detail-in-his-baghdadi-raid-account

Those both cover that people had no clue why he was saying that, or where he was getting that. Adding to it that there was no sound.  I don't see them mentioning that they only had an overhead view, but I can't remember which article said that.

What is my source on what? You'll need to be more specific.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/27/trump-did-not-brief-pelosi-and-other-top-congressional-leaders-on-baghdadi-raid.html

That covers them not notifying the House of 8/Pelosi.

JWeinCom is the one that posted the link to the snopes article so he deserves the thanks for that.  With what you quoted from it makes sense but I would point out our conference tables look the same way with spare Ethernet cables coming out of hubs spaced throughout the table so it's inclusion seems a little ignorant.

You will get no argument from me that we screwed the very people that were a large part of getting the intelligence for the raid. Baghdadi was getting ready to move which also played a part in the timing of the raid not just the pull out of the troops.  

The whimpering thing could be an embellishment although both (slightly slanted) articles also elude to a possibility of how he could have come by the information ... that said I'd go with embellishment, thanks for the links.

This has more information than most of the articles I'd read.  I didn't get through all of it but you might find it interesting  :https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/27/politics/bagdhadi-inside-the-raid-timeline/index.html

Lastly letting Russia know we were going to be moving through their airspace does not seem like a horrible idea.



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The_Yoda said:
Bandorr said:

I hate the way people respond like that. It requires constant scrolling.  Although it is cleaner.

That was an interesting Snopes article. Although it makes some equal points as well. "Trump is in the center of the photograph at the head of the table, everyone pictured is dressed neatly in suit and tie, the subjects are all looking into the camera and appear to be emotionally composed, and the table curiously contains a bunch of colorful ethernet cables that don’t appear to be connect to anything."

So staged as in "not natural" as opposed to "staged because he wasn't there". Thank you for the article.

It was the last time BECAUSE of trump. BECAUSE of his attitude toward the kurds.  Instead of protecting them, he let Turkey run over them. Which endangered the mission. It was rushed because of that.  We had them take down their barriers against Turkey because it would help with the raid.  They did it, we didn't hold our part of the deal.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/10/donald-trump-baghdadi-whimpering

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-officials-had-no-clue-where-he-got-whimpering-detail-in-his-baghdadi-raid-account

Those both cover that people had no clue why he was saying that, or where he was getting that. Adding to it that there was no sound.  I don't see them mentioning that they only had an overhead view, but I can't remember which article said that.

What is my source on what? You'll need to be more specific.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/27/trump-did-not-brief-pelosi-and-other-top-congressional-leaders-on-baghdadi-raid.html

That covers them not notifying the House of 8/Pelosi.

JWeinCom is the one that posted the link to the snopes article so he deserves the thanks for that.  With what you quoted from it makes sense but I would point out our conference tables look the same way with spare Ethernet cables coming out of hubs spaced throughout the table so it's inclusion seems a little ignorant.

You will get no argument from me that we screwed the very people that were a large part of getting the intelligence for the raid. Baghdadi was getting ready to move which also played a part in the timing of the raid not just the pull out of the troops.  

The whimpering thing could be an embellishment although both (slightly slanted) articles also elude to a possibility of how he could have come by the information ... that said I'd go with embellishment, thanks for the links.

This has more information than most of the articles I'd read.  I didn't get through all of it but you might find it interesting  :https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/27/politics/bagdhadi-inside-the-raid-timeline/index.html

Lastly letting Russia know we were going to be moving through their airspace does not seem like a horrible idea.

I can be find with the Russia thing.. although it is weird they are arguing we didn't actually kill (insert name I can't remember/spell). More objecting to them not informing the people they were suppose to.

The CNN article looks good. Thanks.



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Bandorr said:
The_Yoda said:

-snip

I can be find with the Russia thing.. although it is weird they are arguing we didn't actually kill (insert name I can't remember/spell). More objecting to them not informing the people they were suppose to.

The CNN article looks good. Thanks.

Hadn't seen that some were denying the kill.  I was under the impression they took DNA samples from the walls of the tunnel post cablooey.  Similar to the tests to confirm Bin Laden was himself in that particular raid.

I can understand your objection to not informing who should have been informed.  If Trump was legitimately worried about a leak botching the mission I wonder if it would have been possible to sequester them in a fashion until the raid was over.  That said such an action could set a bad precedent.



It's possible this might have been mentioned and discussed already because I haven't been to this thread in some time now and lack the energy to scroll back many pages to find out, but in case it hasn't been, thought I'd highlight the fact that President Trump's recent appearance at the World Series (where he broke with a century-old tradition by refusing to throw out the first pitch) was met with loud booing, followed by chants of "LOCK..HIM..UP! LOCK..HIM..UP!" from the 41,000 attendees. At one point, some of the attendees unfurled a banner reading "IMPEACH TRUMP!" Even Fox News struggled to spin the scene in his favor, with one of their commentators arguing that the baseball fans in the audience should be "held accountable" for disrespecting the president, whatever that means.

I think that's probably the first time Trump has ever stepped outside his bubble of support. Seriously, like every public appearance he makes is either just with the press or in a safe space like a campaign rally where only supporters are allowed in. For perhaps the first time in his political career, he finally stepped outside that bubble to occupy the same space as a whole bunch of real, normal people, not screened for political allegiance, to learn, probably for the first time, that he's not actually popular and well-loved after all. You can see the shock and horror take over his face as he eventually discovers that he's the one being booed in the footage. I think getting a brief taste of what most people think of him was probably the healthiest thing he's done his entire tenure so far.

Last edited by Jaicee - on 02 November 2019



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

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Jaicee said:

It's possible this might have been mentioned and discussed already because I haven't been to this thread in some time now and lack the energy to scroll back many pages to find out, but in case it hasn't been, thought I'd highlight the fact that President Trump's recent appearance at the World Series (where he broke with a century-old tradition by refusing to throw out the first pitch) was met with loud booing, followed by chants of "LOCK..HIM..UP! LOCK..HIM..UP!" from the 41,000 attendees. At one point, some of the attendees unfurled a banner reading "IMPEACH TRUMP!" Even Fox News struggled to spin the scene in his favor, with one of their commentators arguing that the baseball fans in the audience should be "held accountable" for disrespecting the president, whatever that means.

I think that's probably the first time Trump has ever stepped outside his bubble of support. Seriously, like every public appearance he makes is either just with the press or in a safe space like a campaign rally where only supporters are allowed in. For perhaps the first time in his political career, he finally stepped outside that bubble to occupy the same space as a whole bunch of real, normal people, not screened for political allegiance, to learn, probably for the first time, that he's not actually popular and well-loved after all. You can see the shock and horror take over his face as he eventually discovers that he's the one being booed in the footage. I think getting a brief taste of what most people think of him was probably the healthiest thing he's done his entire tenure so far.

I find this take utterly fascinating.  What do you kind of 'support bubble' do you think he's stepped into whenever he's attending a WH press conference.  There's potential $ and fame to be made for a journalist who matches Trump's level of narcissism, even if that harms their journalistic credibility.  

And what kind of general crowd do you think you're actually pulling for World Series tickets in a D.C. stadium?  Your average nosebleed seat likely ran around a thousand dollars.



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Jumpin said:

But lets just focus on the long held American obsession of giving comedians such a big place in politics.



coolbeans said:

I find this take utterly fascinating.  What do you kind of 'support bubble' do you think he's stepped into whenever he's attending a WH press conference.  There's potential $ and fame to be made for a journalist who matches Trump's level of narcissism, even if that harms their journalistic credibility.  

And what kind of general crowd do you think you're actually pulling for World Series tickets in a D.C. stadium?  Your average nosebleed seat likely ran around a thousand dollars.

What I mean is that Trump really seems to generally live in a world where he appears to only supporters on the one hand (like his staff, who he can fire if they disagree with him, or his rallies where only supporters are allowed in) or else at press events. My point being that this dynamic doubtless leaves him with the impression that it's only the press that dislikes him and real, ordinary people love him. Now he has discovered otherwise.

As to people who attend the World Series, it's worth pointing out that said tickets are priced high for a reason: because they're highly sought after. Baseball has been traditionally known as "the American past time". It seems weird to suggest that baseball fans aren't normal Americans.



Immersiveunreality said:
Jumpin said:

But lets just focus on the long held American obsession of giving comedians such a big place in politics.

To be fair, Bill Maher is not a comedian with a big place in politics. He's a comedian who makes politics a big part of his comedy, and this isn't an American thing, it's a Western culture thing that dates all the way back to ancient Greece.

But even if he were a politician, why not? The US has done much worse considering their current President is literally a reality TV/Pro wrestling personality.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Jumpin said:
Immersiveunreality said:

But lets just focus on the long held American obsession of giving comedians such a big place in politics.

To be fair, Bill Maher is not a comedian with a big place in politics. He's a comedian who makes politics a big part of his comedy, and this isn't an American thing, it's a Western culture thing that dates all the way back to ancient Greece.

But even if he were a politician, why not? The US has done much worse considering their current President is literally a reality TV/Pro wrestling personality.

Good, but current date i would tell you that it seems like  American comedians put much more focus on politicians compared to other countries.

I do not know if Bil Maher does not have a big place in politics because he talks about it so often.

Second bolded: Because it is not constructive in my opinion and in first place it is mostly low tier comedy,like Trevor noahs atempts it is almost lazy.