That's the thing though, I hate those cameras. That is government surveillance. And I'm not just talking about vehicular homocide or traffic violations, I'm talking someone robbed you, but you caught the license plate of the getaway car, or some weirdo is stalking you, so you report his license plate number, stuff like that. It goes so much further than the crimes done directly with the vehicle. Even if you like those cameras, they can't be installed outside the city, so crimes done in the countryside would be easier to commit, all you'd have to do is avoid stoplights and take back roads. If cops have a suspect and know that the suspect drives a certain make, model, and color, they can look out for those cars, but if they don't also know the license plate number, they'd have to stop or stalk every car that looked like that. With the license plate number, they can just look for a car that fits the description, check the license plate number, and only stop them if it's the right car. With how dependent we are on cars, it's hard to do without them. It's not a perfect solution, obviously, but it's an excellent tool for law enforcement to have.

Now obviously not all of this logic applies to gun registrations, but we kind of got sidetracked. Some of it does apply though, and what the worst that happens? It's not like they'd put GPS trackers on your guns, they'd just know the serial number of the gun you owned. You already need a license, what's the big deal about registering a number too? Would make it easier to match murder weapons to suspects, and easier to hold people accountable if they allow their guns to fall into the hands of a murderer. This isn't a camera in your home we're talking about, or data on phone calls you're making, it's just a single number in a database. Not Big Data, and not even really surveillance. The only time that number would be used by the government to surveil you is if your gun is used in a crime, which doesn't affect law abiding citizens at all. It's literally just a tool that would help law enforcement stop outlaws, as opposed to making life difficult for law abiding gun owners. It's an ideal first step for gun control, as it just helps law enforcement, well, control guns, you know, as opposed to actually restricting the right to bear arms. I really think the whole gun registry idea would be a lot more popular if it was framed in a better way. This really is probably the easiest step forward we could take in such polarized times, aside from maybe closing the background check loophole.

License plates are literally how they get traced...

1. How is that illegal? Aren't there also voter registries and a registry of licensed drivers?

4. Some hobbies cost money, there is no reason why a dangerous hobby like playing with guns shouldn't be expensive and heavily regulated. The freedom of owning a cheap gun does not trump the freedom of not getting shot. Without trying to sound bigoted, poor people are the last people I would like to make it easier for to own guns.

6. Correct. the limit should be 2.

9. Depends on the crime. If it was a violent crime, not having the right to own a gun anymore seems like a good idea. Call it extra punishment for being an asshole.

10./11. It is fair to assume that if someone is willing to break the law by owning an illegal firearm, he's also willing to break the law otherwise. For example by using the gun inappropriately.

If I believe gun owners correctly, they will only use their firearms for sport, which makes it a hobby. There are no special protections for hobbies. Owning a weapon designed for mass killing isn't a right, it's a privilege and people should pay for that privilege like every other person for their hobbies. At this point fucking drones are more regulated than guns.

A colleague of mine is a fan of guns and he uses them for sport. I'm pretty sure here in Germany all of these policies are in effect and that is absolutely fine. Fans of guns will jump these hoops for their hobby and everyone else will feel a lot safer.

So far, between the two mass shootings we've heard about over the weekend here in the U.S., we've heard much less about the Dayton, Ohio shooter, Connor Betts, because that one doesn't fit the narrative. It turns out that Betts was a member of a "pornogrind" metal band that released albums with titles like "6 Ways of Female Butchery", "Preteen Daughter Pu$$y Slaughter", "Live Snuff Porn Vol. 1", and "Tilt Bench for Gynecology or Total Rape". He had also twice been suspended from high school for hit lists he had made, including a "kill list" for boys and a "rape list" for girls.

Here's the really fun part though: in addition to being a raging misogynist who appears to have been motivated to kill by hatred of women above all, he was ALSO a self-described anti-fascist online activist who railed against Nazis and, yes, gun violence! (i.e. He was an Antifa type, ideologically speaking.) Yerrrrrp!!!

(Link)

I guess I would mean to highlight here that these shootings, and particularly misogynistic attitudes, are hardly exclusive to the political right wing, as our media frankly has been portraying them.

No matter what giant list of measurements you can come with. The only real solution is banning all guns from public purchase and ownership. This is maybe very offensive to some Americans, but deep down you know that that is the only real solution. How can there even be a debate about background checks or small solutions after Sandy Hook is beyond me.

yea, being a racist/anti-semite/homo-and transphobe/mysogynist isn't exclusive to the far right wing, but the far right ideology attracts a disproportionate amount of them

Yeah I get that but if there were no more registration plates since there are camera that could be used to track people car crimes would still be able be solved. But it's really not a big deal since registration plates are already a thing. I just don't want more government intervention into people's personal life. Mass shooters get caught if they have not already committed suicide so I don't see the need for a gun registry unless the shooter stole the gun and the police want to return it to the rightful owner. But even in these cases there are other ways this cna be done.

If there were none people can still be traced since there are camera everywhere.

1. There are laws that prevent the government from registering guns to their owners.

4. Not all gun owners hunt though. Some keep it for protection and we can't assume that every gun owner can afford a mental health check up. If someone is poor they should be able ot own a gun if a rich person can. It's wrong to not want them to especially when you consider that poor people are more likely to live in dangerous neighborhoods and are more prone to danger.

8. There should be no limit.

9. Even if it was a violent crime the person served their time and should be able to go back to how life was before their crime. Laws and policies restricting former criminals access and rights to certain things don't help anyone. It just causes resentment among these people and could lead to them committing another crime. If we stopped treating former criminals like they're second class citizens we would be a much safer country.

10/11. Not in all cases.

Wait, how exactly do you think tracing people with cameras works? You think there are so many cameras that it can trace a criminal from when they leave their garage, all the way to the crime, and back home again? There are not that many cameras. The plates are a necessary part of that. They see your plates in the camera, and look you up that way. If the plates were not there, they'd need enough cameras to trace the car to its home in order to identify the owner. That's just not feasible. You'd need a genuine surveillance state, and I would hope you would rather have the plates than a straight up surveillance state...

No i'm not saying trace the person to their home and back. There's a sufficient amount of cameras already that can help find someone. If they stopped at a store/gas station and they probably drove by a street camera etc.

Yeah i'd rather have plates than a surveillance state.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/08/06/dayton-ohio-shooting-governor-mike-dewine-gun-changes/1930220001/ Ohio's governor has proposed expansions to current gun control laws in the state.