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Forums - Politics Discussion - Official 2020 US Election: Democratic Party Discussion

LurkerJ said:

Here's how it goes:
- Send a woman to attack Bernie baselessly
- He and his fan base defends Bernie
- Sexist bastards!
- rinse, repeat

Crooked Hillary and the not so native American aren't even using the correct labels to attack him. Bernie is a sexist? PUH LEASE. I have heard more credible criticism towards Bernie coming from the right. For real, someone like Tucker Carlson has put up better arguments against Bernie than these people. 

And she refuses to endorse anyone because "it's too early"... well you're basically endorsing anyone who's not Bernie, but you're either too dumb to see it or just plain crooked. 

It's very disgusting how Hillary and the media completely erase the voices of the women, especially the women of color, in our movement. Effectively perpetuating the sexism she concern trolls about Bernie supporters. I'm not male, I'm not a "bro" and I won't be silenced.



 

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Tbqh

Last edited by tsogud - on 21 January 2020

 

Bofferbrauer2 said:
uran10 said:

I just want to say one thing to this and that's that you're giving the republican party and even the dem party a bit too much credit imo. You're more spot on with the dems, but I'd honestly call them more of a economically right wing party, while being culturally left wing (atleast on the surface), the republicans however, are legitimately far right wingers. I'm not talking everyday republicans walking the streets, the citizens. I'm talking look at their elected members. Outside of Rand Paul (who is pretty bad on domestic issues), and Mike Lee, the rest of the party is well...... yea.

Well, right wing is pretty narrow and pretty far to the right already. Just look at Germany for instance: AFD is right-wing, but not far-right, that would be the NPD. However, there's a very substantial overlap between the two. In fact, right wing parties are most often far-right with some more centrist policies thrown in and with the most blatant racism, xenophobia and the like curbed down a notch to not face legal troubles or other kinds of backlash. And in that regard, I consider this the perfect description of the GOP right now.

As for the Democrats, they include pretty much everything that's on the left from the GOP, so everything from center-left to left wing. But the establishment Democrats are pretty much all centrists to center-right, even culturally for the most part (it just looks much more like left wing since it's left from the GOP) and they are those who have been shaping most of the party until now. Bernie, the squad, millennials and Gen Z however are for the most part way to the left of where the Democratic party is right now, and are trying to pull the party more and more to the left. And that pull will continue over the next years.

Well, just as we have this discussion about the positioning of US political parties, it looks like AOC has entered the chat:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYTtaStPlsc



All this blabbing about whether the Republican party is "right" or "right wing" or "far right" or extreme or whatever is pointless semantics. As is the talk about the Democratic party. We're here to discuss the Democratic primary. Like it or not, the Republican party IS worse than the Democratic party, for the simple fact that the Republicans are a threat to the USA continuing to be a democracy, and the Democrats are not. Like it or not, the Republicans are so far to the right from the center that bipartisan action doesn't happen anymore, almost at all, even between supposed "moderate Republicans" and supposed "conservative Democrats". Like it or not, the Democratic party is what's known as a "big tent" party that attracts a wide ideological spectrum. It has politicians that are decidedly to the right of the center, all the way well into the left, and everything in between, and from a perspective of global democracies, I'd say it hovers in the center to right-of-center, but that doesn't matter because we aren't "global democracy", we're one country, and what passes for our elected left exists entirely within the Democratic party, though they definitely don't control it. Their influence is rising, and that's due to the failures of the centrists, failures the centrists refuse to own, which just discredits them further and contributes to the further rise of the left in their party. It isn't a leftwing party yet, but it will probably become one in the future. We're just here to decide if it makes a big shift to the left now, or kicks that can down the road some more, but the demographics aren't on the centrists side, nor are the policy successes.



I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html



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HylianSwordsman said:
I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html

Not to sound like a broken record, but this is yet another clickbait unfair characterization of Biden.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/01/17/opinion/joe-biden-nytimes-interview.html

"And you may recall, the criticism I got for meeting with the leaders in Silicon Valley, when I was trying to work out an agreement dealing with them protecting intellectual property for artists in the United States of America. And at one point, one of the little creeps sitting around that table, who was a multi- — close to a billionaire — who told me he was an artist because he was able to come up with games to teach you how to kill people, you know the ——

CW: Like video games.

Yeah, video games. And I was lectured by one of the senior leaders there that by saying if I insisted on what Leahy’d put together and we were, I thought we were going to fully support, that they would blow up the network, figuratively speaking. Have everybody contact. They get out and go out and contact the switchboard, just blow it up.

And then one of these righteous people said to me that, you know, “We are the economic engine of America. We are the ones.” And fortunately I had done a little homework before I went and I said, you know, I find it fascinating. As I added up the seven outfits, everyone’s there but Microsoft. I said, you have fewer people on your payroll than all the losses that General Motors just faced in the last quarter, of employees. So don’t lecture me about how you’ve created all this employment."

The "creeps" was a table full of Silicon Valley billionaires.

Last edited by Moren - on 21 January 2020

HylianSwordsman said:
I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html

Moren said:
HylianSwordsman said:
I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html

Not to sound like a broken record, but this is yet another clickbait unfair characterization of Biden.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/01/17/opinion/joe-biden-nytimes-interview.html

"And you may recall, the criticism I got for meeting with the leaders in Silicon Valley, when I was trying to work out an agreement dealing with them protecting intellectual property for artists in the United States of America. And at one point, one of the little creeps sitting around that table, who was a multi- — close to a billionaire — who told me he was an artist because he was able to come up with games to teach you how to kill people, you know the ——

CW: Like video games.

Yeah, video games. And I was lectured by one of the senior leaders there that by saying if I insisted on what Leahy’d put together and we were, I thought we were going to fully support, that they would blow up the network, figuratively speaking. Have everybody contact. They get out and go out and contact the switchboard, just blow it up.

And then one of these righteous people said to me that, you know, “We are the economic engine of America. We are the ones.” And fortunately I had done a little homework before I went and I said, you know, I find it fascinating. As I added up the seven outfits, everyone’s there but Microsoft. I said, you have fewer people on your payroll than all the losses that General Motors just faced in the last quarter, of employees. So don’t lecture me about how you’ve created all this employment."

The "creeps" was a table full of Silicon Valley billionaires.

I agree. In fact, I think Kokatu had a great article on that matter: https://kotaku.com/unsolved-mystery-which-game-industry-exec-did-joe-bide-1841073390

When you read the article, you can see that not Biden was originally talking about games teaching about killing people, but the artist. They muse that the artist in question was probably John Riccitiello, then CEO of EA. That guy is an artist, alright! A con artist, to be precise! No wonder he creeped Biden out.

I don't like Biden, but I had misinformation and misrepresentation even more. So I just had to set this straight again.



Moren said:
HylianSwordsman said:
I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html

Not to sound like a broken record, but this is yet another clickbait unfair characterization of Biden.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/01/17/opinion/joe-biden-nytimes-interview.html

"And you may recall, the criticism I got for meeting with the leaders in Silicon Valley, when I was trying to work out an agreement dealing with them protecting intellectual property for artists in the United States of America. And at one point, one of the little creeps sitting around that table, who was a multi- — close to a billionaire — who told me he was an artist because he was able to come up with games to teach you how to kill people, you know the ——

CW: Like video games.

Yeah, video games. And I was lectured by one of the senior leaders there that by saying if I insisted on what Leahy’d put together and we were, I thought we were going to fully support, that they would blow up the network, figuratively speaking. Have everybody contact. They get out and go out and contact the switchboard, just blow it up.

And then one of these righteous people said to me that, you know, “We are the economic engine of America. We are the ones.” And fortunately I had done a little homework before I went and I said, you know, I find it fascinating. As I added up the seven outfits, everyone’s there but Microsoft. I said, you have fewer people on your payroll than all the losses that General Motors just faced in the last quarter, of employees. So don’t lecture me about how you’ve created all this employment."

The "creeps" was a table full of Silicon Valley billionaires.

Yeah, you do sound like a broken record. Always apologizing for Biden and claiming bias, just like you accuse Bernie fans of doing.

From the article:

As for which game executive Biden was referring to as a creep, Kotaku has some theories about who the person might be, including EA's then-CEO John Riccitiello.

Also from the article:

Biden has expressed his distaste for video games in the past. During 2013, while he was vice president, he proposed an additional tax on violent media, including violent games. Despite numerous studies showing no link between violent video games and real-life violent crimes, we've seen several politicians suggesting extra taxes be added to the titles.



Bofferbrauer2 said:
HylianSwordsman said:
I feel this is relevant to both this thread and this forum:

https://www.techspot.com/news/83623-joe-biden-calls-game-developers-little-creeps-who.html

Moren said:

Not to sound like a broken record, but this is yet another clickbait unfair characterization of Biden.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/01/17/opinion/joe-biden-nytimes-interview.html

"And you may recall, the criticism I got for meeting with the leaders in Silicon Valley, when I was trying to work out an agreement dealing with them protecting intellectual property for artists in the United States of America. And at one point, one of the little creeps sitting around that table, who was a multi- — close to a billionaire — who told me he was an artist because he was able to come up with games to teach you how to kill people, you know the ——

CW: Like video games.

Yeah, video games. And I was lectured by one of the senior leaders there that by saying if I insisted on what Leahy’d put together and we were, I thought we were going to fully support, that they would blow up the network, figuratively speaking. Have everybody contact. They get out and go out and contact the switchboard, just blow it up.

And then one of these righteous people said to me that, you know, “We are the economic engine of America. We are the ones.” And fortunately I had done a little homework before I went and I said, you know, I find it fascinating. As I added up the seven outfits, everyone’s there but Microsoft. I said, you have fewer people on your payroll than all the losses that General Motors just faced in the last quarter, of employees. So don’t lecture me about how you’ve created all this employment."

The "creeps" was a table full of Silicon Valley billionaires.

I agree. In fact, I think Kokatu had a great article on that matter: https://kotaku.com/unsolved-mystery-which-game-industry-exec-did-joe-bide-1841073390

When you read the article, you can see that not Biden was originally talking about games teaching about killing people, but the artist. They muse that the artist in question was probably John Riccitiello, then CEO of EA. That guy is an artist, alright! A con artist, to be precise! No wonder he creeped Biden out.

I don't like Biden, but I had misinformation and misrepresentation even more. So I just had to set this straight again.

Dude, my article LINKS your article. The quote you're referring to is in BOTH ARTICLES. The quote, direct from Biden, in both articles, is "who told me he was an artist because he was able to come up with games to teach you to kill people". I don't know if you're just having trouble parsing the nuance of the English language, but Biden is NOT saying that the "artist" was the one who said that games teach you to kill people. He's implying that the guy told him he was an artist because games are art, and Biden dismissed that notion because BIDEN feels that games teach people to kill people. I read both articles. There's NOTHING to suggest that it was the video game executive who said games teach people to kill people. So before you accuse me of "misinformation" or "misrepresentation", try reading a little more carefully, and if you still don't get it, I can only assume it's a language barrier.



Yikes. "The nuance of the English language" "language barrier". I expected that from other not-so-good users here @HylianSwordsman, not from you.

I really think this gaming thing is nowhere near the big deal you're making it out to be. The context is that Biden was attacking the arrogance of Silicon Valley billionaires. The interview was not about gaming, or gaming as a form of art. I don't believe EA CEOs are artists (as a matter of fact, I don't believe EA games are art) so this is a pretty odd hill to die on.

Last edited by Moren - on 21 January 2020