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ZhugeEX "Xbox One sales around 41m"

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Ganoncrotch said:
curl-6 said:

It'd be kinda a bad call to keep the 'Xbox One' name as it has negative connotations. And even if they did keep the name for their next gen system, if it was an all new system and the games no longer came to the base Xbone, then it wouldn't be the same sales clump regardless of what it was called. I mean Wii U wasn't clumped together with the Wii.

The WiiU wasn't grouped to the Wii because the Wii cannot play any WiiU games.

The Xbox1 featuring forwards compatibility which allowed it's users to play severely downgraded versions of a Xbox2 game would still have the same software library, I mean... these machines are getting closer to PC all the times, it can't be too far off to simply have PCesque settings to turn down resolution and kill some of the effects, I mean you look at something like Overwatch on the PC, the Minimum specs to play that includes a GTX460 while there is people who would claim their eyes would bleed on anything less than a 1080TI that doesn't take from the fact that a game which can potentially run at 4k/300FPS (300fps is the limit I've hit at 1080p, not sure why) but yeah... the same game can be experienced on a PC with a Graphics card which can be bought for £15 https://uk.webuy.com/product-detail/?id=sgranvigtx4602&categoryName=pci-express-graphics-cards&superCatName=computing&title=nvidia-geforce-fermi-gtx-460-768mb

For comparison sake, that's a game which runs on a card which is 1/8th the power of what some would consider part of the PC master race, close to a decade old card, which launched 5 years before Overwatch, still capable of playing the game.

I just mean... the Xbox 2 will not be 8x the power of the X1 so the older machine should be able to provide a similar experience to what a GTX460 user would enjoy with Overwatch compared to someone on a 1080TI

It's extremely unlikely though that the base Xbox One is going to be forwards compatible with the next Xbox, it is already struggling to run current gen multiplats like Assassin's Creed Odyssey and Just Cause 4. For that kind of cross-compatibility would require that Xbox Two would be severely held back. Graphics may scale, but CPU side less so, especially given how slow and weak the Jag in the Xbone was... in 2013.



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curl-6 said:
Ganoncrotch said:

The WiiU wasn't grouped to the Wii because the Wii cannot play any WiiU games.

The Xbox1 featuring forwards compatibility which allowed it's users to play severely downgraded versions of a Xbox2 game would still have the same software library, I mean... these machines are getting closer to PC all the times, it can't be too far off to simply have PCesque settings to turn down resolution and kill some of the effects, I mean you look at something like Overwatch on the PC, the Minimum specs to play that includes a GTX460 while there is people who would claim their eyes would bleed on anything less than a 1080TI that doesn't take from the fact that a game which can potentially run at 4k/300FPS (300fps is the limit I've hit at 1080p, not sure why) but yeah... the same game can be experienced on a PC with a Graphics card which can be bought for £15 https://uk.webuy.com/product-detail/?id=sgranvigtx4602&categoryName=pci-express-graphics-cards&superCatName=computing&title=nvidia-geforce-fermi-gtx-460-768mb

For comparison sake, that's a game which runs on a card which is 1/8th the power of what some would consider part of the PC master race, close to a decade old card, which launched 5 years before Overwatch, still capable of playing the game.

 

I just mean... the Xbox 2 will not be 8x the power of the X1 so the older machine should be able to provide a similar experience to what a GTX460 user would enjoy with Overwatch compared to someone on a 1080TI

It's extremely unlikely though that the base Xbox One is going to be forwards compatible with the next Xbox, it is already struggling to run current gen multiplats like Assassin's Creed Odyssey and Just Cause 4. For that kind of cross-compatibility would require that Xbox Two would be severely held back. Graphics may scale, but CPU side less so, especially given how slow and weak the Jag in the Xbone was... in 2013.

Or it would require the cloud computing which was promised to the X1 back after it launched with clearly lacking hardware. By the time the next Xbox rolls around the cloud could be ready to rain those bonus xbox360s into the base model X1!

remember that... good times.



Fancy hearing me on an amateur podcast with friends gushing over one of my favourite games? https://youtu.be/1I7JfMMxhf8

Ganoncrotch said:
curl-6 said:

It's extremely unlikely though that the base Xbox One is going to be forwards compatible with the next Xbox, it is already struggling to run current gen multiplats like Assassin's Creed Odyssey and Just Cause 4. For that kind of cross-compatibility would require that Xbox Two would be severely held back. Graphics may scale, but CPU side less so, especially given how slow and weak the Jag in the Xbone was... in 2013.

Or it would require the cloud computing which was promised to the X1 back after it launched with clearly lacking hardware. By the time the next Xbox rolls around the cloud could be ready to rain those bonus xbox360s into the base model X1!

remember that... good times.

Lulz. Seriously though, if Xbone is already beginning to struggle with current gen games I can't see it being forwards compatible with the next gen Xbox, especially when the leap in CPU power in likely to be gargantuan given how weak Jaguar was and how far Ryzen has improved over it in the intervening years.



curl-6 said:
Ganoncrotch said:

Or it would require the cloud computing which was promised to the X1 back after it launched with clearly lacking hardware. By the time the next Xbox rolls around the cloud could be ready to rain those bonus xbox360s into the base model X1!

remember that... good times.

Lulz. Seriously though, if Xbone is already beginning to struggle with current gen games I can't see it being forwards compatible with the next gen Xbox, especially when the leap in CPU power in likely to be gargantuan given how weak Jaguar was and how far Ryzen has improved over it in the intervening years.

I think the X will be compatible for a few years and MS will us their cloud services to help with computing. Probably only for their first party games tho while third parties will stay on last gen for the first 2 years.



jason1637 said:
eva01beserk said:

I dont doubt that they will have a much better Gen. With more studios you get more games and no matter the quality of said games, more is always better. But thats not my argument. Is that is foolish to believe that thouse new smal teams are gona come out swiging with major exclusives "GOW" caliber right out the gate. Im saying it wont be untill like at least mid gen untill thouse new guys bring out anything good. At the begining aside from the big 3 halo gears and forza, all we will see is fodder to build up gamepass.

GOW 4 is 2018s GOTY and considered to be one of Sonys best games. It will be hard for them to deliver a game of that quality but it's not as foolish to think that their new studios could deliver on something like that.

Undead, inXile, and compulsion games probably won't but the other new studios are capable.

Playground Games lowest reviewed game is Forza Horizon 1 at 85 and their last 2 games scored in the 90s. They have the talent to make a GOW 4 caliber Gable game.

Ninja Theory made Hellblade with a small budget while developing multiple games for other publishers. Now they have the funds and creative freedom to do whatever they want.

Obsidean devevloped Fallout New Vegas which is considered by many to be the best Fallout game. They have lots of talented devs and the Outer Worlds look promising.

And yeah the Initiative has been hiring some of the industries best. They even have quite a few people that worked on GOW XD.

Im not saying that MS new studios will create a GOW caliber game though but some of their studios are definitely capable of doing so.

Again, im not saying they they will always be mediocre devs, they sure have the potential, what im saying is that counting on GOW quaity games from the new studios at the begining of the gen is ridiculous. Their experience studios like 343 might, theres no doubt they have a shot. Even the new ones could with some time, wich is what im saying, dont expect big things right off the bat with the new studios. It probably wont be their first game thats a runaway success. ANd I did say it in the first post, ninja theory is their most likely candidate. I would even say they have a better chance than 343 and playground.



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

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eva01beserk said:
jason1637 said:

GOW 4 is 2018s GOTY and considered to be one of Sonys best games. It will be hard for them to deliver a game of that quality but it's not as foolish to think that their new studios could deliver on something like that.

Undead, inXile, and compulsion games probably won't but the other new studios are capable.

Playground Games lowest reviewed game is Forza Horizon 1 at 85 and their last 2 games scored in the 90s. They have the talent to make a GOW 4 caliber Gable game.

Ninja Theory made Hellblade with a small budget while developing multiple games for other publishers. Now they have the funds and creative freedom to do whatever they want.

Obsidean devevloped Fallout New Vegas which is considered by many to be the best Fallout game. They have lots of talented devs and the Outer Worlds look promising.

And yeah the Initiative has been hiring some of the industries best. They even have quite a few people that worked on GOW XD.

Im not saying that MS new studios will create a GOW caliber game though but some of their studios are definitely capable of doing so.

Again, im not saying they they will always be mediocre devs, they sure have the potential, what im saying is that counting on GOW quaity games from the new studios at the begining of the gen is ridiculous. Their experience studios like 343 might, theres no doubt they have a shot. Even the new ones could with some time, wich is what im saying, dont expect big things right off the bat with the new studios. It probably wont be their first game thats a runaway success. ANd I did say it in the first post, ninja theory is their most likely candidate. I would even say they have a better chance than 343 and playground.

But Obsidean, Playground are not new studios. MS have bought them but they have been around for a few years and have made highly acclaimed games. The Intiative is a new studio composed of some of the most talented devs there are. It would be underestimating them to say they don'thave the potential to back something big. 

At the start of the gen I dont expect Playgrounds Fable, Obsideans next game, and The Intiatives game to drop but when they do I think they have potential to be really good.



Intrinsic said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

I do believe that Switch is 9th gen and it has a 30M+ lead.  Yes.

But I would like to understand

 

  1. what you mean exactly by "technology"?  
  2. What generation would you put the Wii into?

 

 

  1. At the core of every generation is the technology that drives the software (games) development. This can be game engines (UE4 8th gen, UE3 7th gen, Unity, Frostbyte engine, RE Engine......etc). Those engines literally determine which platforms gets games and which ones don't. So now the NS supports most of those engines but the WiiU doesnt support them hence the NS shares its games library with the PS4/XB1.

    There of course is also tech stuff like memory amount. You have t be within a certain range of RAM t even remotely be able to run games from a given generation. The NS has about 2.5/3GB of ram which is about half of what the PS4/XB1 has But then games are ported down to run at half the rez using half the quality f the assets from their PS4/XB1 iterations s it can work. That will be impossible when porting a game designed to run n a system with 16GB-20GB of ram available to it down t one with like 3GB of ram.

  2. Thats simple..... 7th gen right along the PS3/360. 

 

I don't understand.  What you said in point #1 doesn't seem to lead to your conclusion in point #2.  Could you explain how you see the Wii's technology placing it in 7th gen?



curl-6 said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

When Sony released the PS2, the PS1 continued to sell with very long legs.  It's gravy train did not end when the PS2 released.
When Sony released the PS3, the PS2 continued its gravy train continued for a long time.
The PS4 is a very solid console like the PS1 and the PS2.  It will have strong legs even after the PS5 releases, regardless if it comes out in 2019 or a later year. 

What Sony needs to be worried about is the PS5.  The PS2 was the best selling console of all time and that did not help the PS3 one bit.  The PS4 is very solid, but that will not help the PS5 one bit.  The longer they wait to release the PS5, the harder time it will have in the marketplace.  The Switch already has a head start that is two years old and growing.  Are they going to let Microsoft have a head start too?  How much are they going to cripple the PS5 before it even launches?

Switch is in a different niche and won't impact PS5, just like it isn't impacting PS4. And letting MS go first has advantages for Sony; it lets them see Xbox's hand and work to counter it by making sure the PS5 is superior.

I see.  So you don't think that Nintendo and Sony are competing anymore?  For example, the DS never really competed with the PS3 and the 3DS never competed with the PS4.  Now that Nintendo only has one console, you think it isn't competing with Sony anymore at all?  Or do you even think the Wii U was competing with PS4?  I definitely think the Wii U and PS4 were competing. 



The_Liquid_Laser said:
curl-6 said:

Switch is in a different niche and won't impact PS5, just like it isn't impacting PS4. And letting MS go first has advantages for Sony; it lets them see Xbox's hand and work to counter it by making sure the PS5 is superior.

I see.  So you don't think that Nintendo and Sony are competing anymore?  For example, the DS never really competed with the PS3 and the 3DS never competed with the PS4.  Now that Nintendo only has one console, you think it isn't competing with Sony anymore at all?  Or do you even think the Wii U was competing with PS4?  I definitely think the Wii U and PS4 were competing. 

If Switch was directly competing with Playstation, Switch's success would've resulted in PS4 sales slumping; that hasn't happened. Similarly, PS5 won't take sales away from Switch. 



curl-6 said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

I see.  So you don't think that Nintendo and Sony are competing anymore?  For example, the DS never really competed with the PS3 and the 3DS never competed with the PS4.  Now that Nintendo only has one console, you think it isn't competing with Sony anymore at all?  Or do you even think the Wii U was competing with PS4?  I definitely think the Wii U and PS4 were competing. 

If Switch was directly competing with Playstation, Switch's success would've resulted in PS4 sales slumping; that hasn't happened. Similarly, PS5 won't take sales away from Switch. 

Untrue. 

The Wii launched to great success.  It didn't hamper the sales of the PS2 at all.  The hardware power levels of the Wii and PS2 were much closer than the Wii and PS3, in fact.  But the Wii was breaking sales records at the same that the PS2 was having extremely strong legs.  This is very much like the relationship between the Switch and PS4.

On the other hand the Wii WAS impacting PS3 sales.  Wii was breaking sales records and PS3 was majorly struggling for its first few years.  Wii was not competing with PS2, but it was competing with PS3.  The Wii was not competing with the Playstation brand as a whole.  It was competing with a very specific console, the PS3 and the PS3 alone.z

This is what people should expect when the PS5 launches.  The Switch is not competing with the PS4, but it is competing with the PS5.  PS5 is going to struggle just like the PS3 struggled.  And the PS4 is not hampered by the Switch's success just like the PS2 was not hampered by the Wii's success.