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The best Original Xbox Box Mini device would actually just be a Xbox One S (or X)

Forums - Microsoft Discussion - The best Original Xbox Box Mini device would actually just be a Xbox One S (or X)

Mr Puggsly said:
John2290 said:
There would be no games to put on it or at least no iconic exclusives. It would comprise of Halo CE and Project Gothem racing... what else would there be that would feed on anyone's nostalgia. MS simply don't have a strong legacy.

Much like the PS1 Mini, there would be a reliance on 3rd party software.

But a few 1st party games... Halo 1 and 2 (could be done via MCC), Fable, Voodoo Vince (either original or port), Blinx games, Crimson Skies and Bruteforce. Never played them but the Mech Assault games are praised.

I agree that isn't an amazing or big list, but outside of a few good 1st party games the Xbox was made great by 3rd party games. That's a much longer list I could produce.

Knights of the Old Republic, Oddworld: Munch's Odyssey/Stranger's Wrath, Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay, Jade Empire, Ninja Gaiden, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Conker: Live and Reloaded, Doom 3, Fuzion Frenzy, Jet Set Radio Future, Dead or Alive 3, Unreal Championship

All Xbox exclusives.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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Pemalite said:
Mr Puggsly said:

I get your logic of the CPU architecture, if what you're suggesting was the case the X1 would get perfect performance in all OG Xbox BC games. But that's not the case, uncapped games still struggle to stay at 60 fps. So the emulation process is still very CPU intensive on the vastly superior CPU of X1 or even X1X. The X1X does get better performance and that's very likely from the extra CPU power.

To be fair, Xbox 360 emulation is better than OG Xbox emulation on the Xbox One, Microsoft simply has invested more time and effort into their Xbox 360 emulator.

OG Xbox emulation is also very lightly threaded... It's the same issue with the Playstation 2 vs Playstation 3 emulation on PC, the Playstation 3 doesn't need 50x more CPU time than the Playstation 2 emulator because it will simply throw more threads at the problem... And because of PS3's emphasis on more threads, there is less issue in keeping tick rates/sync perfect across the board as heavily threaded games tend to be less reliant on those.

Mr Puggsly said:

You don't need an expensive CPU to emulate PS2, Gamecube, or Wii, but it does need to be a powerful or modern CPU to run all games well, especially if you want to improve visuals.

It doesn't need to be a powerful CPU. It just needs to be a CPU with the appropriate instructions, Intel for example (Haswell and newer) have a TSX instruction which can boost performance by 30% or more in some emulators.

When it comes to boosting visuals, that can fall entirely on the GPU for the most part... And let's face it. Even today's cheapest of the cheapest GPU's is superior to the Geforce 3/4 hybrid in the Original Xbox.


Mr Puggsly said:

Hypothetically, they could just use the same Xbox One APU, maybe a couple GB of memory and 32-64GB of storage for the games. Adding wifi would only be for downloading games, adding a DVD drive is possible but would make it more expensive. I think in the end though you still get a device that will be at least $99 so little profit, vastly inferior overall, and wouldn't have online Halo. That's why I don't want to cater to the masses only willing to spend $99, it would be junk compared to a X1. Go get a SNES or PS1 mini if that's all you have to spend.

They could cut off the ESRAM as well, which accounts for a large proportion of the SoC's transistor budget.


Mr Puggsly said:

Fuck price, $199 isn't that bad and you get a much more capable product. If you just wanna play old Xbox games it does that and very well, but if you consider playing 7th gen and 8th gen content (maybe finish the fight with Halo 3), it does that too. That's the great thing about the X1, its kinda like the best of all Xbox consoles in one machine. That becomes more true as the BC list grows.

Price is a big factor in these nostalgia fueled boxes... Microsoft could theoretically sell the OG Micro consoles at a loss... And profit from extra digital game sales.

I hear ya, optimization matters. Either way the current OG Xbox emulator MS has works well and does so on existing Xbox One specs.

You keep comparing specs like OG Xbox's GPU, earlier you were talking architecture. But the emulation process is much more resource intensive.

Again, maybe a final revision of the base Xbox One could make a lot of tweaks that also bring the price down.

I don't think there would be a big profit selling games on a device dedicated solely to playing OG Xbox games. If anything, sell the Xbox One at a lost and hope for profits there. More potential there from subscription services and vastly superior library.



Recently Completed
Crackdown 3
for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

John2290 said:
There would be no games to put on it or at least no iconic exclusives. It would comprise of Halo CE and Project Gothem racing... what else would there be that would feed on anyone's nostalgia. MS simply don't have a strong legacy.

There is tons.
Fable, Morrowind, Ninja Gaiden, Conker, Blinx, Forza, Jet Set Radio, Otogi... And more.

Halo, Fable, Forza, Project Gotham have to be on there... That would be like releasing a Playstation Classic without Spyro and Crash Bandicoot or a SNES Classic without Super Mario World, Super Metroid and Donkey Kong.

Mr Puggsly said:

I hear ya, optimization matters. Either way the current OG Xbox emulator MS has works well and does so on existing Xbox One specs.

Could be allot better though. And will get allot better... It's still very early days for Original Xbox backwards compatibility.

Mr Puggsly said:

You keep comparing specs like OG Xbox's GPU, earlier you were talking architecture. But the emulation process is much more resource intensive.

When it comes to the Original Xbox, there is less emulation, more repacking and abstraction going on, that's what I am trying to say.
Emulation tends to be more of a requirement when you deviate from the hardwares ISA. I.E. PowerPC on the 7th gen consoles.

The Original Xbox is x86 like the PC and the Xbox One remember.

Mr Puggsly said:

Again, maybe a final revision of the base Xbox One could make a lot of tweaks that also bring the price down.

Well. Only so far you can take that.

 

Mr Puggsly said:

I don't think there would be a big profit selling games on a device dedicated solely to playing OG Xbox games. If anything, sell the Xbox One at a lost and hope for profits there. More potential there from subscription services and vastly superior library.

We are probably never going to agree at this point about this particular issue. I just don't see the current Xbox One as being cheap enough to hit the $100 price point or less that make these Nostalgia fueled boxes desirable by the masses.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

zorg1000 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Much like the PS1 Mini, there would be a reliance on 3rd party software.

But a few 1st party games... Halo 1 and 2 (could be done via MCC), Fable, Voodoo Vince (either original or port), Blinx games, Crimson Skies and Bruteforce. Never played them but the Mech Assault games are praised.

I agree that isn't an amazing or big list, but outside of a few good 1st party games the Xbox was made great by 3rd party games. That's a much longer list I could produce.

Knights of the Old Republic, Oddworld: Munch's Odyssey/Stranger's Wrath, Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay, Jade Empire, Ninja Gaiden, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Conker: Live and Reloaded, Doom 3, Fuzion Frenzy, Jet Set Radio Future, Dead or Alive 3, Unreal Championship

All Xbox exclusives.

I want to avoid falling in some argument about who made the exclusive, did they stay exclusive, etc.

If you simply look at the Xbox library as a whole, its pretty strong and you gave some of the best examples.



Recently Completed
Crackdown 3
for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Pemalite said:   
Mr Puggsly said:

I don't think there would be a big profit selling games on a device dedicated solely to playing OG Xbox games. If anything, sell the Xbox One at a lost and hope for profits there. More potential there from subscription services and vastly superior library.

We are probably never going to agree at this point about this particular issue. I just don't see the current Xbox One as being cheap enough to hit the $100 price point or less that make these Nostalgia fueled boxes desirable by the masses.

Agreed, I don't see the X1 hitting $99 ever. I think $199 is where its staying and maybe $149 for holidays at this point. In the end, we don't need an inferior device to play Xbox games. The X1 gets the job done and they should push that.



Recently Completed
Crackdown 3
for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

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Mr Puggsly said:
Pemalite said:   

We are probably never going to agree at this point about this particular issue. I just don't see the current Xbox One as being cheap enough to hit the $100 price point or less that make these Nostalgia fueled boxes desirable by the masses.

Agreed, I don't see the X1 hitting $99 ever. I think $199 is where its staying and maybe $149 for holidays at this point. In the end, we don't need an inferior device to play Xbox games. The X1 gets the job done and they should push that.

Should state that my $99 point is AUD. Not USD. - Probably be more like $70 USD.
A lower end device that is only going to play Original Xbox games is fine.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--