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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - UPDATED: Xbox to offer All Access

Azzanation on 24 August 2018

hunter_alien said:

In all fairness VGC is mostly about UNIT sales, and not generated revenue tracking. Unit sales can be considered a pretty decent metric and same goes for revenue/active user numbers as well. The best is to combine these and try to see the whole picture.

Not taking into account unit sales will result in just as skewed overall market understanding as the one you are complaining about.

OT: it was expected and it seems to be the natural direction that MS takes as of late. They want to offer the services as a one-size-fits-all aproach. Luckily, it seems that as of next gen they will be able to sweeten the deal with some good exclusives as well.

I come to VGChartz for gaming news and curious for gaming figures, however lets be honest here, these so called figures that some come here for turn what is suppose to be a meaningless stat and turn it into a major flaw with a product and do nothing but downplay products that are not number one on the sales charts. I look at the industry as a whole, I never cared the PS3 was the least selling system for most of last gen, I never cared the WiiU was the least selling console this gen and I surely don't care the X1 is the least selling console now. 

I know how businesses are run and some need to move past basic barbaric sales numbers and need to start looking at the bigger picture. Its all about the money and this gen money is sourced from many types or avenues not just physical hardware sales like in the past.

As for these services, this is where MS see the money, not how many consoles they sell. In fact its these type of services like GamePass and Play Anywhere that diminish there very own physical game sales and it seems that doesn't bother MS at all, so its clear that MS (A company that knows how to make money) are heading in this direction. Weather its successful next gen will wait and see, as for this gen it seems to be working for them.



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Azzanation on 24 August 2018
CGI-Quality said:The money made and the sales numbers earned matter. You're lying to yourself if you deny that. Can't tout your Business 101 card and have that viewpoint. 

Bottom line, this is a sales site (on its own, might I add - no other site attempts to do what VGChartz does). Those who work hard to bring the numbers do so with as much diligence and accuracy as they can. Sometimes, they miss the mark, but that's okay. They adjust when/where appropriate.

I respect this site and the work going in, I never said sales don't matter, I come here for figures and news. I am pointing out those who just use sales to downplay other products. Money is money and the business is changing. Its good to know the base of a systems sales but lets keep in mind that digital is a thing, gaming services like Netflix is a thing, companies are starting to not announce hardware sales is a thing, games are becoming Play Anywhere titles is a thing, Streaming is becoming a thing. We need to start looking at the whole picture and not just "This product sucks because it hasn't outsold its direct competitor" nonsense.



DonFerrari on 24 August 2018
Azzanation said:

hunter_alien said:

In all fairness VGC is mostly about UNIT sales, and not generated revenue tracking. Unit sales can be considered a pretty decent metric and same goes for revenue/active user numbers as well. The best is to combine these and try to see the whole picture.

Not taking into account unit sales will result in just as skewed overall market understanding as the one you are complaining about.

OT: it was expected and it seems to be the natural direction that MS takes as of late. They want to offer the services as a one-size-fits-all aproach. Luckily, it seems that as of next gen they will be able to sweeten the deal with some good exclusives as well.

I come to VGChartz for gaming news and curious for gaming figures, however lets be honest here, these so called figures that some come here for turn what is suppose to be a meaningless stat and turn it into a major flaw with a product and do nothing but downplay products that are not number one on the sales charts. I look at the industry as a whole, I never cared the PS3 was the least selling system for most of last gen, I never cared the WiiU was the least selling console this gen and I surely don't care the X1 is the least selling console now. 

I know how businesses are run and some need to move past basic barbaric sales numbers and need to start looking at the bigger picture. Its all about the money and this gen money is sourced from many types or avenues not just physical hardware sales like in the past.

As for these services, this is where MS see the money, not how many consoles they sell. In fact its these type of services like GamePass and Play Anywhere that diminish there very own physical game sales and it seems that doesn't bother MS at all, so its clear that MS (A company that knows how to make money) are heading in this direction. Weather its successful next gen will wait and see, as for this gen it seems to be working for them.

Yes you don't care about sales, but are always talking about it. You care about revenue but can't show sources. Very comfortable position where you can deny all you don't want to see.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

COKTOE on 24 August 2018
Azzanation said:
CGI-Quality said:The money made and the sales numbers earned matter. You're lying to yourself if you deny that. Can't tout your Business 101 card and have that viewpoint. 

Bottom line, this is a sales site (on its own, might I add - no other site attempts to do what VGChartz does). Those who work hard to bring the numbers do so with as much diligence and accuracy as they can. Sometimes, they miss the mark, but that's okay. They adjust when/where appropriate.

I respect this site and the work going in, I never said sales don't matter, I come here for figures and news. I am pointing out those who just use sales to downplay other products. Money is money and the business is changing. Its good to know the base of a systems sales but lets keep in mind that digital is a thing, gaming services like Netflix is a thing, companies are starting to not announce hardware sales is a thing, games are becoming Play Anywhere titles is a thing, Streaming is becoming a thing. We need to start looking at the whole picture and not just "This product sucks because it hasn't outsold its direct competitor" nonsense.

Really? I bet I could find posts where you not only said exactly that, but defended that idea in follow up posts. Do you think I could find such a post?

Last edited by COKTOE - on 24 August 2018

- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

LudicrousSpeed on 24 August 2018
PotentHerbs said:
LudicrousSpeed said:

Good, don’t take them serious. Laugh and move on, they’re petty.

This is a good move for MS.

However, you also have the same MS fans, defending everything MS does. Power was irrelevant, first party was irrelevant, Japanese games were irrelevant, until MS supported these gaming mediums, and their fans flip flopped on the topic. Sony fans did this too, but many of them also criticized Sony, instead of turning a blind eye to their short comings. Only if we could dig up old threads... 

Oh sure. 

Sony will never charge for online.

Indie games don’t matter.

Downloadable games don’t count. 

Rumble is not important.

Power is extremely important, until Scorpio, now it’s irrelevant. 

Etc etc. You’re talking about fans flip flopping to suit their favorite toy maker, which happens all the time on every site, but doesn’t have anything to do with what I said or what I was replying to.



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chakkra on 24 August 2018

*Customers will be able to pay around $22 per month and net themselves an Xbox One S, Xbox Live, and Xbox Game Pass for two years. Around $35 will net them an Xbox One X.

It will be interesting to see how much this affects the Xbox family sales. 

I think it will help it to keep sales up YoY, not only this year but next year as well.



PotentHerbs on 25 August 2018
LudicrousSpeed said:
PotentHerbs said:

This is a good move for MS.

However, you also have the same MS fans, defending everything MS does. Power was irrelevant, first party was irrelevant, Japanese games were irrelevant, until MS supported these gaming mediums, and their fans flip flopped on the topic. Sony fans did this too, but many of them also criticized Sony, instead of turning a blind eye to their short comings. Only if we could dig up old threads... 

Oh sure. 

Sony will never charge for online.

Indie games don’t matter.

Downloadable games don’t count. 

Rumble is not important.

Power is extremely important, until Scorpio, now it’s irrelevant. 

Etc etc. You’re talking about fans flip flopping to suit their favorite toy maker, which happens all the time on every site, but doesn’t have anything to do with what I said or what I was replying to.

Sure it does.

Why should I take MS fans on this site, who constantly deflect and defend, any more serious than you take Sony fans on this site, who constantly downplay?

All sides have down players. But no other fan base on this site, is as nonchalant as MS fans, when it comes to gaming criticisms. 

BTW, a lot of people expected Sony to charge for online.

I don't remember people discounting indie/ downloadable games. Games like Flower & Limbo were constantly cited in list wars back in PS360 days. 

Last edited by PotentHerbs - on 25 August 2018

Azzanation on 25 August 2018
CGI-Quality said:

You complain about a handful of those who "use sales to downplay other products". It is a pointless thing to fret about. Plus, if sales are of no consequence to you, why call them "meaningless stats"? Really, your first paragraph in the quote contradicts this sudden shift.

As far as companies not announcing sales, that would only be Microsoft and they are only not doing so because of their distance to the competition. But, like Nintendo and Sony, they know how important marketshare is. Again, that is Business 101.

I think i made my intentions quite clear with my last post. The issue here is people think i say Sales mean nothing when i clearly state its not the Be all, End all to a business especially when we are talking about a buisness model focusing on online and services more and more. Iv always stated Sales are good, but the way people act as if its everything especially when companies find different ways to profit.

Yes sale figures to me is a meaningless stat, its nice to know but it does nothing to the way i game or decide what to buy. Maybe if i am into shares ill care more. 

When more and more companies start investing heavily within the online services you will start seeing more and more not mention sales figures, unless its to downplay there oppisition.

COKTOE said:
Azzanation said:

I respect this site and the work going in, I never said sales don't matter,

Really? I bet I could find posts where you not only said exactly that, but defended that idea in follow up posts. Do you think I could find such a post?

Please do, find me a post where i stated sales dont matter without me stating in the same post/thread that sales are good to have. Again its not everything. It seems what gets said gets misread.

Besides why are we posting OT in this thread, how about PM me instead. Makes things easier.

Last edited by Azzanation - on 25 August 2018

Bofferbrauer2 on 25 August 2018
Azzanation said: 

https://www.windowscentral.com/xbox-all-access

*Customers will be able to pay around $22 per month and net themselves an Xbox One S, Xbox Live, and Xbox Game Pass for two years. Around $35 will net them an Xbox One X.

For those who don't want to take out their calculators, it's 528$ total for the ONE S + XBL + GamePass, and 840$ for an ONE X + XBL + GamePass.

In other words, buying them separately seems a better deal to me, especially for the ONE X or when there's some discount.

Last edited by Bofferbrauer2 - on 25 August 2018

The Nintendo eShop rating Thread: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=237454 List as Google Doc:  https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1aW2hXQT1TheElVS7z-F3pP-7nbqdrDqWNTxl6JoJWBY/edit?usp=sharing

The Steam/GOG key gifting thread: https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread/242024/the-steamgog-key-gifting-thread/1/ 

Free Pc Games thread: https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread/248138/free-pc-games/1/

Azzanation on 25 August 2018
Bofferbrauer2 said:
Azzanation said: 

https://www.windowscentral.com/xbox-all-access

*Customers will be able to pay around $22 per month and net themselves an Xbox One S, Xbox Live, and Xbox Game Pass for two years. Around $35 will net them an Xbox One X.

For those who don't want to take out their calculators, it's 528$ total for the ONE S + XBL + GamePass, and 840$ for an ONE X + XBL + GamePass.

In other words, buying them separately seems a better deal to me, especially for the ONE X or when there's some discount.

That's the catch with these types of business models. Buying a product on a plan will always cost you more in the long run. Much like buying a Phone on a Plan, EG - actual Phone is worth $800 but the deal adds up to more than $1200 over 2 years. (Depending on the plan you are with)

As for All Access, I can see where the market is, probably more focused on Uni/College students who cannot afford to outright pay $400+ on a console and add even more for the games. 

$35 a month for a X and 100s of games that will be free via GamePass doesn't sound like much money considering what you are getting, but MS will make there money in the long run by earning close to twice the amount on 1 console purchase over two years etc.