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Is the United States really a developed country?

Forums - Politics Discussion - Is the United States really a developed country?

numberwang said:
pastro243 said:

I think it's more of a cultural thing, the gun issue 

Gun violence is highest in urban, densely populated areas and it overwhelmingly a gang problem.

The five most dangerous counties (all Democrats) have 68% of all murders. According to a 2013 PEW Research Center survey, the household gun ownership rate in rural areas was 2.11 times greater than in urban areas... Despite lower gun ownership, urban areas experience much higher murder rates.

https://crimeresearch.org/2017/04/number-murders-county-54-us-counties-2014-zero-murders-69-1-murder/

Mexico has 5x the murder rate of the US, but strict gun control, again a gang problem foremost.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

I thought we were comparing to UK going by the post I quoted, which has also highly populated areas (last poster said it was the reason police didn't have to use guns)

On US murder rate, it's still pretty high compared to other developed countries. Hell, even countries from south america have lower rates such as Chile, and Argentina and Ecuador have comparable rates



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pokoko said:

Comparing the US to small nations with a fraction of the population is kind of silly.  The magnitude of issues is nowhere near the same order.  Even comparing different parts of the US to each other isn't a simple task.

Aeolus451 said:
What a nonsensical opinion to have. Of course, it's a developed country. Alot of the things you used as examples (murders, poor education, slums) of an undeveloped country were in areas that have been under lefty control for a loooong time. 😹

Right, like the Republicans have been able to fix anything.  lololo

Both parties have had their chances and both need to be held responsible.  I can't even imagine the viewpoint that would give either a party a passing grade.

Actually, they tend to do when they're running the show for awhile. 



Aeolus451 said:
pokoko said:

Comparing the US to small nations with a fraction of the population is kind of silly.  The magnitude of issues is nowhere near the same order.  Even comparing different parts of the US to each other isn't a simple task.

Right, like the Republicans have been able to fix anything.  lololo

Both parties have had their chances and both need to be held responsible.  I can't even imagine the viewpoint that would give either a party a passing grade.

Actually, they tend to do when they're running the show for awhile. 

Especually on the state level. There is a lot of good republican policy there, they get shit done. Federal republicans are laughable. Federal and state democrats are exactly the same, they blame others.



pastro243 said: I thought we were comparing to UK going by the post I quoted, which has also highly populated areas (last poster said it was the reason police didn't have to use guns)


On US murder rate, it's still pretty high compared to other developed countries. Hell, even countries from south america have lower rates such as Chile, and Argentina and Ecuador have comparable rates

The US objectively has a violence problem.

Fortunately, its predominately in concentrated areas and much of is gang related. That means we know where much of the problem is but we just ignore it because dealing with it would mean imprisoning the downtrodden.

If we simply dealt with gangs more seriously, we could cut our murder rate down significantly. But we don't, its actually become a political issue. Kinda like how they try to hide immigrant violence in Europe.



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Ka-pi96 said:
numberwang said:

Mississippi has an average household income of 40K which is higher than many western European nations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_income

Source for median household income in western European nations?

Edit: Even if you do have a source (which I doubt), household income is not a good one to compare wealth by. It could mean people there are wealthier than in a place with lower household income, it could also just mean that the people there are too poor to be able to move out of their family homes and therefore there are a lot less households and thus obviously a higher average income per household. If you want to make a fairer comparison, look for the average wage per person, rather than per household.

Why would you assume that such data is not available in developed countries? Spain and Italy for example are far below 40K hh income. Family structure only comes into play if there are multiple bread winners and I don't think the situation is so fundamentally different in US or western Europe. 

http://www.pewglobal.org/2017/04/24/middle-class-fortunes-in-western-europe/st_2017-04-24_western-europe-middle-class_0-02/

Last edited by numberwang - on 13 July 2018

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Ka-pi96 said:
RaptorChrist said:

I've lived in the Chicago-land area for my entire life, which is one of the largest cities in America.

With more than 7 billion people in the world, I oftentimes find myself wondering how I got so lucky to be born with so many natural advantages (white, American, male). I try not to take these things for granted, as there are many less fortunate individuals that struggle to make ends meat.

I believe that most would agree (although some would not like to admit it) that many people who live in other parts of the world are envious of Americans. With so many people from all over the world immigrating to the US, I would imagine that many people know somebody in their life who has moved here. And in many cases, that person who moved to the US was maybe less deserving than you.

And knowing that said person is now making more money and living a more successful life than you, despite maybe having a less desirable job, can feel unfair. Thus, people form negative opinions of the US and latch onto any negative press. In fact, hearing people say negative things about the US makes you feel a little bit better about your own situation.

It's common for people to dislike something that they themselves cannot be a part of. We see this everywhere.

"I own a PS4. I hate Xbox."
"I don't make a lot of money. I don't care about material things."
"I live in Europe. I don't like the US."

The United States is the most influential country on Earth.

Edit: Not trying to offend anyone here. I have no hard feelings for these individuals and can completely understand their frustration.

A lot of that is simply wrong. A lot of the people here who are discussing this are Canadian or European. I can assure you we're not envious, and we can make just as much money and be just as successful as Americans, except it's actually easier for us because we don't have to pay a fortune for education

Except you guys pay a lot more in taxes, so your education isn't exactly free. Also, how come Europe or Canada doesn't have their Silicon Valley or Hollywood? They have film studios and tech companies, but not like the US. Is it because it is far easier to be an entrepreneur in America because of the lower taxes and fewer regulations or are there other reasons? We got Google, Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, IBM, Intel, Nvidia, AMD, Facebook, Twitter and a lot more. We've got most of the major film studios and most of the major music labels. Then when you look at the music industry, the NFL and NBA, you realize that the US has more wealthy black people than any other nation on Earth? In fact, I remember reading somewhere that if you added up all the wealth of the entire black population of the United States, you would have the 14th largest economy in the world. Why is this? What is it that we were able to get right that you guys weren't? 



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Jon-Erich said:
Ka-pi96 said:

A lot of that is simply wrong. A lot of the people here who are discussing this are Canadian or European. I can assure you we're not envious, and we can make just as much money and be just as successful as Americans, except it's actually easier for us because we don't have to pay a fortune for education

Except you guys pay a lot more in taxes, so your education isn't exactly free. Also, how come Europe or Canada doesn't have their Silicon Valley or Hollywood? They have film studios and tech companies, but not like the US. Is it because it is far easier to be an entrepreneur in America because of the lower taxes and fewer regulations or are there other reasons? We got Google, Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, IBM, Intel, Nvidia, AMD, Facebook, Twitter and a lot more. We've got most of the major film studios and most of the major music labels. Then when you look at the music industry, the NFL and NBA, you realize that the US has more wealthy black people than any other nation on Earth? In fact, I remember reading somewhere that if you added up all the wealth of the entire black population of the United States, you would have the 14th largest economy in the world. Why is this? What is it that we were able to get right that you guys weren't? 

I definitely agree that the United States is more innovative. Canadian cinema is such a joke that most people can't even name one Canadian movie. I also think the US has more freedom of speech than in Canada. But the social services are very poor in the United States than Canada, and if you're not well of Canada is better.



HomokHarcos said:
Jon-Erich said:

Except you guys pay a lot more in taxes, so your education isn't exactly free. Also, how come Europe or Canada doesn't have their Silicon Valley or Hollywood? They have film studios and tech companies, but not like the US. Is it because it is far easier to be an entrepreneur in America because of the lower taxes and fewer regulations or are there other reasons? We got Google, Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, IBM, Intel, Nvidia, AMD, Facebook, Twitter and a lot more. We've got most of the major film studios and most of the major music labels. Then when you look at the music industry, the NFL and NBA, you realize that the US has more wealthy black people than any other nation on Earth? In fact, I remember reading somewhere that if you added up all the wealth of the entire black population of the United States, you would have the 14th largest economy in the world. Why is this? What is it that we were able to get right that you guys weren't? 

I definitely agree that the United States is more innovative. Canadian cinema is such a joke that most people can't even name one Canadian movie. I also think the US has more freedom of speech than in Canada. But the social services are very poor in the United States than Canada, and if you're not well of Canada is better.

The point I am making is that the US does a much better job of lifting people out of poverty that a lot of other developed nations. As far as the social services are concerned, that may very well be a cultural issue. The US seems to do better when there is less government involved. With healthcare, cost wasn't very much of a problem until the federal government became more involved in healthcare about 50 years ago. With education, the United States had some of the best public schools in the world up until the 1970s. That is because public education was run mostly by local and state governments. When the federal government became more involved by establishing the department of education, the quality of education dropped quickly. With higher education, it was very affordable until the government got involved in the student loan business. It has been going up ever since. I can't speak for Canada and Europe so much, but in the US, it seems like every time the federal government becomes more involved in something, they screw it up.



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Yes America is a developed nation but yes it also suffers from extreme levels of wealth inequality



Russia is also considered as developed countries (G8 countries). I'm pretty sure they also had high crime rate, high poverty is some areas, religious, high income inequality, homicide rate higher than US.