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PQube cancels Omega Labyrinth Z western release on PS due to disagreement with Sony over sexual content

Forums - Gaming Discussion - PQube cancels Omega Labyrinth Z western release on PS due to disagreement with Sony over sexual content

Hiku said:
This type of game is common in Japan (which is why it got released in Japan) but some western countries like USA are fairly conservative about nudity and sex.
You can show a man getting his head blown off with a shotgun, but not boobs.

Because gun violence is equatable to the sexualisation of children?

 



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estebxx said:
BraLoD said:

Rubbing them is not new indeed.

Rubbing a pair of breasts to make a crystal in the shape of a sausage between them until it eventually gets large and all white... yeah, that's very damn new lol

LOL

Its just funny because lets be honest its not that different, i mean they were completely OK with games where you fondle little girls bodies (for whatever reason) with them moaning and everything but i guess the sausage in this one is where they draw the line.

At least the girl looked like a fully developed woman on this one.



twintail said:
Hiku said:
This type of game is common in Japan (which is why it got released in Japan) but some western countries like USA are fairly conservative about nudity and sex.
You can show a man getting his head blown off with a shotgun, but not boobs.

Because gun violence is equatable to the sexualisation of children?

No obviously not. Murder is usually significantly worse than consensual sexualized interactions. Whether in fiction, or in real life.
Some western countries, USA in particular, draws the line differently for what is acceptable when it comes to violence vs sex in a general sense.
Meaning even if the person is 18 years old or 32, depending on the medium, they'll show 50 000 people getting murdered before they show 1 nipple.

Now because this game has some characters that look young it's even less surprising that they decided to do this.
There seems to be no source material confirmation on any ages though. And I don't know which particular characters you can have those raunchy interactions with, so I can't ascertain that anyone in these situations are below a certain age. But even if it's only with the older looking ones, or characters portrayed to be of age, I doubt it would matter to the ones who made this decision. If the girls would get brutally murdered instead though, I bet the game would be released in the west.

Last edited by Hiku - on 25 June 2018

irstupid said:
Nem said:
Silly to me. Just slap an 18+ rating. Adults get to decide wether they want it or not.

I don't care for such games, but it's sugestion, not the real thing. It's not porn. But whatever, i don't really care.

 Jim Ryan, head of global sales and marketing for PlayStation says “We have a contract with the people who go online with us, that we look after them and they are within the PlayStation curated universe,” says Ryan. “Exposing what in many cases are children to external influences we have no ability to manage or look after, it’s something we have to think about very carefully.”

Clearly you are not thinking of the children.

Funny, that the quote above is in regards to crossplay, when it works so much better for this current game.

The funny thing about this quote is that ppl always forget the part "Unfortunately, it's a commercial discussion between ourselves and other stakeholders, and I'm not going to get into the detail of that on this particular instance.". Jim Ryan already said that not doing cross-play with X1 was a financial one.

 

Hiku said:
twintail said:

Because gun violence is equatable to the sexualisation of children?

No obviously not. Murder is usually significantly worse than consensual sexualized interactions. Whether in fiction, or in real life.
Some western countries, USA in particular, draws the line differently for what is acceptable when it comes to violence vs sex in a general sense.
Meaning even if the person is 18 years old or 32, depending on the medium, they'll show 50 000 people getting murdered before they show 1 nipple.

Now because this game has some characters that look young it's even less surprising that they decided to do this.
There seems to be no source material confirmation on any ages though. And I don't know which particular characters you can have those raunchy interactions with, but even if it's only with the older looking ones, or characters portrayed to be of age, I doubt it would matter to the ones who made this decision. If the girls would get brutally murdered instead though, I bet the game would be released in the west.

The issue with this move has nothing to do with whether the characters are appropriately aged or not. its the fact that the dev and artist willingly decided to make some of them look like children and its that portrayal that is a problem.

The game has a PEGI rating and yet is banned in a few countries in EU, in addition to Australasia. At the end of the day while Sony having a role in stopping the game being released is problematic, its pretty obvious that they dont want to be involved in this issue in case things go south with its release. its being banned for inappropriate exploitation of characters that look underage. There might be other countries that are looking to ban it to and a release would not only be incredibly limited, but a release in connection with news outlets potentially making a fuss about the games content is not a position a company like Sony wants to be in.

If the girls would get brutally murdered instead though, I bet the game would be released in the west.

 I am curious, but what games of the last decade allow you to 'brutally murder' children looking characters?


and for people extrapolating this to other games... if those games are getting banned in multiple countries, or have similar content with similar aged looking characters then you can probably expect this to happen again. if neither of these 2 things happen then the game will still release. No reason to start fear mongering here.



twintail said: 
Hiku said:

No obviously not. Murder is usually significantly worse than consensual sexualized interactions. Whether in fiction, or in real life.
Some western countries, USA in particular, draws the line differently for what is acceptable when it comes to violence vs sex in a general sense.
Meaning even if the person is 18 years old or 32, depending on the medium, they'll show 50 000 people getting murdered before they show 1 nipple.

Now because this game has some characters that look young it's even less surprising that they decided to do this.
There seems to be no source material confirmation on any ages though. And I don't know which particular characters you can have those raunchy interactions with, but even if it's only with the older looking ones, or characters portrayed to be of age, I doubt it would matter to the ones who made this decision. If the girls would get brutally murdered instead though, I bet the game would be released in the west.

The issue with this move has nothing to do with whether the characters are appropriately aged or not. its the fact that the dev and artist willingly decided to make some of them look like children and its that portrayal that is a problem.

I mentioned that in bold.
And I referenced "older looking ones, or characters portrayed to be of age".
I brought up the info about their age missing because an anime character that looks like an adult to some people can look like a child to others. So I was wondering if there was an age reference in those cases.

What you originally quoted me on was the cultural differences between Japan and some western countries, that contributed to the decision of this being released in Japan, but not the west. I would not rule out more conservative views on sexual content in general as a contributing factor. We've seen many cases over the years where even mature looking video game characters get a different treatment in the west.
However, I think the main difference here may lie in the different age of consent. In Japan it's generally lower than in many western countries.  Which means the characters can generally look a bit younger in Japan than in some western countries, and it would still be ok.

If the girls would get brutally murdered instead though, I bet the game would be released in the west.

I am curious, but what games of the last decade allow you to 'brutally murder' children looking characters?

I didn't say 'you'.
I said "if the girls would get brutally murdered". And not every one of the girls look like a child. In this game it is 'you' (the player) who interacts with the girls. But it's still interesting how much more ok it is to show children looking characters get brutally murdered, than it is to show a nipple. If you want some examples of characters getting brutally murdered in video games, some of whom look like children, here are a few.

I'll link to the pictures rather than posting them to avoid spoilers for people who haven't played it. But it's in the Zero Escape series.
This character here is portrayed as rather childlike both in appearance and demeanor. https://i.imgur.com/74RnIx5.gif
Here's one of the several scenarios where you can find her lying in a pile of her own blood after being stabbed. https://i.imgur.com/raH6ucI.png

In another scenario, this other girl, who not only looks like a young child but is specifically stated to be 12 years old at the time, is burned alive inside of a giant incinerator.
https://i.imgur.com/CXFWDtm.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/DeADWAi.png
You don't get to see the body (because of the flames) in that particular scene, but in most other scenarios you do. https://i.imgur.com/8rRMj3X.png

The third game is especially graphic: https://imgur.com/vvzztFN
I just started the third one though, so I haven't had any of the children looking characters killed yet.

Dangan Ronpa is another game where children looking characters are murdered and executed in spectacular fashion.

Last edited by Hiku - on 26 June 2018

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twintail said:
Hiku said:
This type of game is common in Japan (which is why it got released in Japan) but some western countries like USA are fairly conservative about nudity and sex.
You can show a man getting his head blown off with a shotgun, but not boobs.

Because gun violence is equatable to the sexualisation of children?

 

 

It's a drawing and it's sugestion. Theres no depiction of children having sex. I don't know how one can make a case that this isn't ok but blowing heads off in gorish faction is ok. They are both not real. They are controller inputs and polygons or drawings. It makes no sense to take action against one and not the other. Theres no consistency in that position. Either they are both ok cause none of it is real (and tbh one sugests and the other one explicitly does it) or none is because they are representations of reality in entertainment. It's ridiculous. The reason is not to protect anyone. It's cause one sells millions and the other doesn't.

Nem said:
twintail said:

Because gun violence is equatable to the sexualisation of children?

 

 

It's a drawing and it's sugestion. Theres no depiction of children having sex. I don't know how one can make a case that this isn't ok but blowing heads off in gorish faction is ok. They are both not real. They are controller inputs and polygons or drawings. It makes no sense to take action against one and not the other. Theres no consistency in that position. Either they are both ok cause none of it is real (and tbh one sugests and the other one explicitly does it) or none is because they are representations of reality in entertainment. It's ridiculous. The reason is not to protect anyone. It's cause one sells millions and the other doesn't.

It doesn't have to be a depiction of a child having sex to be considered child pornography or at the very least child exploitation. Depictions of violence is not illegal, sexual depictions of children is.

There's no denying that the character in the middle here is a child:

This character is one of the specific reasons the UK's rating board gave for banning the game:

"The game is explicit in its setting within a “school” environment and the majority of the characters are young girls – one child is referred to as being a “first year” student and is seen holding a teddy bear. The game clearly promotes the sexualisation of children via the sexual interaction between the game player and the female characters."

I'd say the player having to touch and fondle a clearly underage character is very reasonable grounds for a ban. Violence on the screen and for real are very separate in our minds, sex is not, hence the majority of the world getting off on porn.



Predictions (Made July 2019)

LTD: PS4 - 130m, Switch - 110m, XBO - 52m       2019 : PS4 - 15m, Switch - 18.8m, XBO - 4.8m        2020: Switch - 22m (Peak Year)


Barkley said:
Nem said:

 

It's a drawing and it's sugestion. Theres no depiction of children having sex. I don't know how one can make a case that this isn't ok but blowing heads off in gorish faction is ok. They are both not real. They are controller inputs and polygons or drawings. It makes no sense to take action against one and not the other. Theres no consistency in that position. Either they are both ok cause none of it is real (and tbh one sugests and the other one explicitly does it) or none is because they are representations of reality in entertainment. It's ridiculous. The reason is not to protect anyone. It's cause one sells millions and the other doesn't.

It doesn't have to be a depiction of a child having sex to be considered child pornography or at the very least child exploitation. Depictions of violence is not illegal, sexual depictions of children is.

There's no denying that the character in the middle here is a child:

This character is one of the specific reasons the UK's rating board gave for banning the game:

"The game is explicit in its setting within a “school” environment and the majority of the characters are young girls – one child is referred to as being a “first year” student and is seen holding a teddy bear. The game clearly promotes the sexualisation of children via the sexual interaction between the game player and the female characters."

I'd say the player having to touch and fondle a clearly underage character is very reasonable grounds for a ban. Violence on the screen and for real are very separate in our minds, sex is not, hence the majority of the world getting off on porn.

No, that is not a child. It's a drawing.

This is a child.

 

Also, there's no fondling. There's moving the analog sticks.

 

See, i have trouble with this. People not being able to differentiate reality from games and then saying one is ok depicting murder but the other one isn't for depicting suggestion. It's completely arbitrary.

The real reason is but one. One ranks in millions and the other one doesn't. So, it's ok to antagonize one but not the other.

All i'm saying is that both have to be censored or none. Can't have it both ways and still holding the high ground flag. just not possible.

Last edited by Nem - on 26 June 2018

Nem said:

No, that is not a child. It's a drawing.

 

Also, there's no fondling. There's moving the analog sticks.

 

See, i have trouble with this. People not being able to differentiate reality from games and then saying one is ok depicting murder but the other one isn't for depicting suggestion. It's completely arbitrary.

It's a drawing of a child. That's why it's called a "depiction" because it's not real, doesn't mean it's ok.

The difference between violence and sex is that sex on screen and in real life illicits the same response, arousal. Violence on the screen and violence in real life does not illicit the same response.

Don't defend the sexual depiction of a child in a game designed to sexually arouse the player. It doesn't matter if it's a drawing or not, the game is saying "hey look it's a child, get off on this."



Predictions (Made July 2019)

LTD: PS4 - 130m, Switch - 110m, XBO - 52m       2019 : PS4 - 15m, Switch - 18.8m, XBO - 4.8m        2020: Switch - 22m (Peak Year)