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Dark Souls Switch delayed to Summer 2018

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Dark Souls Switch delayed to Summer 2018

nemo37 said:
ryuzaki57 said:
With the Valkyria, DQ delays and now this, it's clear that Switch versions are giving trouble to 3rd party developers/publishers pretty much everywhere. That Bamco's comment on Dark Souls is further evidence that it's difficult to have a PS4-based game run in handheld mode. Longer development means higher cost, and sales prospects for 3rd party games aren't that brilliant seeing COMG and recent records of Switch 3rd software sales, so ultimately that's lower margin for those companies. It will be interesting to see how they will react in 6 months/1 year.

With the exception of Dark Souls, much of the delays can be explained. DQ was chucked up to the version of the engine used not being compatible during the game's original development. Now that the engine is compatible they have move the game over from the older version of the engine to newer release. Similarly, it is likely that development on Valkyria 4 started later, considering Switch was still new when the game was in development.

While your statement about porting PS4-based games does hold up for more graphically intensive titles designed around PS4, the Dark Souls port is based on the last-gen versions of the game. In fact, DS for Switch is being handheld by completely different studio than the PS4/Xbox One versions. There have been several ports of PS3/Xbox360 era games already that run and look better on Switch than on those systems. Based on the PAX demo, where areas like blighttown, which the last gen consoles really struggled with, were running fine on Switch. This indicates that this is not a case of the system struggling to run the game, but it could have to do with other things (maybe the online component of the game, or perhaps it was a business decision based on Nintendo filling up May with first-party releases which Bamco did not want to compete with).

Finally, I don't think your argument regarding sales of third-party titles hold up. We have had games like Attack on Titan 2 that have done fairly well on Switch, and even some late ports like Xenoverse 2. The problem right now is that we have very few major third-party titles that have had simultaneous releases with Switch. We know very little about how such titles would perform on the system.

I think third party games can do well on Switch. As you said, there is noted successes on the Switch, despite a majority of the third party games being ports. Heck, Ultra Street Fighter II, which was a $40 port of a classic game and its HD remix version, sold above Capcom's expectations. Then you got Doom, Skyrim, Mario + Rabbids, and others that have found success on the Switch.

There is opportunity for developers to find success on the Switch, especially since its selling well and has different userbase to tap into compared to PS4/Xbone.



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AngryLittleAlchemist said:
Nuvendil said:

Well Final Fantasy hasn't touched a Nintendo platform with anything resembling a relevant release in...well over a decade?

That those games - a game no one believed would be allowed, an entry in a franchise never seen on a Nintendo console, and two ports believed to be impossible - beat Dragon Quext XI out the gate, now that's funny.  In a sad and tragic kinda way.  

And I personally have never believed conspiracy is behind any of this.  Incompetent management, lack of effort, or a complete lack of resources is usually where I put it.  I think Bandai falls in the last of those three with regards to this.  I get a feeling they farmed this out to the lowest bidder who had any skill to pull it off and we're seeing the fruits of that here.  I doubt anyone from From Software is even involved.  

Well just any game like Final Fantasy really. We've gotten a few titles but the third party support we got in the first year and few months was way different than what most expected. 

I'm not saying you literally believe in a conspiracy. I was just saying that we should always be skeptical to some degree of companies. 

Edit: Actually, I am curious how you can say that the developer of this port is lousy when they are working at a similar time frame to other third party developers, and Skyrim was also a 7th gen game?

What do you think people were expecting for Switch in its first year in terms of third party support?

As for saying the developer is lousy, that is interesting considering this delay only happened for the Switch version. Similar to what we heard about Dragon Quest XI.
Is the Switch version of Dark Souls handled by the same studio who are making the PS4/XBO versions? Or a different studio?

Last edited by Hiku - on 17 April 2018

I'll be more busy with the PS4 version then. Still can't wait till it releases though.



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KLXVER said:
That sucks. The Switch version will suffer from this.

This is not the first time it has happened. 



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Hiku said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

Well just any game like Final Fantasy really. We've gotten a few titles but the third party support we got in the first year and few months was way different than what most expected. 

I'm not saying you literally believe in a conspiracy. I was just saying that we should always be skeptical to some degree of companies. 

Edit: Actually, I am curious how you can say that the developer of this port is lousy when they are working at a similar time frame to other third party developers, and Skyrim was also a 7th gen game?

What do you think people were expecting for Switch in its first year in terms of third party support?

As for saying the developer is lousy, that is interesting considering this delay only happened for the Switch version. Similar to what we heard about Dragon Quest XI.
Is the Switch version of Dark Souls handled by the same studio who are making the PS4/XBO versions? Or a different studio?

Bandai farmed it out to a porting studio.  And I don't think they're lousy but I would bet my entire tax return on 3 things:

1) Bandai gave them the tiniest budget they could possibly get away with

2) Bandai has provided no assistance

3) the developer is probably bogged down with other projects.

We've heard for a while that these port studios have work rolling in like the tide because a number of publishers are interested in the Switch but NOT interested enough to habe their devs lift a finger to do any work on the Switch themselves.  So I would bet cash that some delays we see are due to these port houses being clogged but publishers being unwilling to put real resources behind these versions.

And also, Soulsbourne games don't have great engines, they are all a bit finnicky.  And handing over a finnicky engine to a porting house and just telling them to call you when it's done is basically leaving the future of that version in the capricious hands of fate.  

And I derive my cynicism also from Bandai's history of crap ports to platforms they are uncommitted to.  Numerous PC ports for a long time were incredibly bad.  Such as Tales of Symphonia which was a gimped version of the mediocre PS3 port of the gimped PS2 port of the GameCube original.  Their history, in short, does nothing at all to inspire confidence.



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Nuvendil said:
Hiku said:

What do you think people were expecting for Switch in its first year in terms of third party support?

As for saying the developer is lousy, that is interesting considering this delay only happened for the Switch version. Similar to what we heard about Dragon Quest XI.
Is the Switch version of Dark Souls handled by the same studio who are making the PS4/XBO versions? Or a different studio?

Bandai farmed it out to a porting studio.  And I don't think they're lousy but I would bet my entire tax return on 3 things:

1) Bandai gave them the tiniest budget they could possibly get away with

2) Bandai has provided no assistance

3) the developer is probably bogged down with other projects.

We've heard for a while that these port studios have work rolling in like the tide because a number of publishers are interested in the Switch but NOT interested enough to habe their devs lift a finger to do any work on the Switch themselves.  So I would bet cash that some delays we see are due to these port houses being clogged but publishers being unwilling to put real resources behind these versions.

And also, Soulsbourne games don't have great engines, they are all a bit finnicky.  And handing over a finnicky engine to a porting house and just telling them to call you when it's done is basically leaving the future of that version in the capricious hands of fate.  

And I derive my cynicism also from Bandai's history of crap ports to platforms they are uncommitted to.  Numerous PC ports for a long time were incredibly bad.  Such as Tales of Symphonia which was a gimped version of the mediocre PS3 port of the gimped PS2 port of the GameCube original.  Their history, in short, does nothing at all to inspire confidence.

I wonder then, why Nuntendo keeps getting them as partner for some of their projects with their IP's (Smash Bros, StarFox) ?



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Mar1217 said:
Nuvendil said:

Bandai farmed it out to a porting studio.  And I don't think they're lousy but I would bet my entire tax return on 3 things:

1) Bandai gave them the tiniest budget they could possibly get away with

2) Bandai has provided no assistance

3) the developer is probably bogged down with other projects.

We've heard for a while that these port studios have work rolling in like the tide because a number of publishers are interested in the Switch but NOT interested enough to habe their devs lift a finger to do any work on the Switch themselves.  So I would bet cash that some delays we see are due to these port houses being clogged but publishers being unwilling to put real resources behind these versions.

And also, Soulsbourne games don't have great engines, they are all a bit finnicky.  And handing over a finnicky engine to a porting house and just telling them to call you when it's done is basically leaving the future of that version in the capricious hands of fate.  

And I derive my cynicism also from Bandai's history of crap ports to platforms they are uncommitted to.  Numerous PC ports for a long time were incredibly bad.  Such as Tales of Symphonia which was a gimped version of the mediocre PS3 port of the gimped PS2 port of the GameCube original.  Their history, in short, does nothing at all to inspire confidence.

I wonder then, why Nuntendo keeps getting them as partner for some of their projects with their IP's (Smash Bros, StarFox) ?

Cause they have manpower and tallent.  It's not lack of those that leads to screwups with Bandai, it's lack of effort.



Jranation said:
KLXVER said:
That sucks. The Switch version will suffer from this.

This is not the first time it has happened. 

Ok. Whats your point?



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Nuvendil said:
Mar1217 said:

I wonder then, why Nuntendo keeps getting them as partner for some of their projects with their IP's (Smash Bros, StarFox) ?

Cause they have manpower and tallent.  It's not lack of those that leads to screwups with Bandai, it's lack of effort.

Yea, I think that is unfortunate, if what you're saying is likely true.

I know its asking a lot for a developer to put their bigger talents on Switch projects and rather than asking outside help to port stuff, but I want to see some effort in these games on Switch. I'm not asking for $50 million dollar projects with $100 million advertisements/promotions, all I ask for is your best effort, or at least competent effort, regardless if its a port or a new game. Games like WWE 2K18 shouldn't have to be released at the state it was when it launched. Sure, patches are a thing nowadays, but you have to at least make the game look and play competently at launch.