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Forums - Politics Discussion - Is David Hogg just a bully now? Uses followers to go on personal vendetta.

 

David Hoggs personal vendetta is...

Justified. I support it. 44 57.89%
 
Unjustified. I don't support it. 26 34.21%
 
I'm unsure. 1 1.32%
 
Other, comments... 5 6.58%
 
Total:76
contestgamer said:
super_etecoon said:
I've grown to understand that there are a lot of plain mean spirited people around here. No wonder people don't like Labo. It would warm your hearts too much.

Where? I havent seen any.

You have made several posts extolling the virtues of the "good old days" when poor people could be mistreated by those in power. Seems pretty mean spirited to me.  

Just checked the definition of mean spirited just to be sure and:

"mean-spir·it·ed
ˌmēnˈspirədəd/
adjective
adjective: mean-spirited; adjective: meanspirited
  1. inconsiderate and unsympathetic."
  2. Inconsiderate and unsympathetic is almost exactly the words I would use for the viewpoints you have put forth in this thread. 
Last edited by Torillian - on 01 April 2018

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VGPolyglot said:
Jon-Erich said:

I had to jump in here. You don't have a right to a good life for several reasons. The main reason is nobody owes you anything. It in order to be guaranteed a good life, that means that somebody somewhere is responsible for making that happen. They're not. You are. Second, everyone has different standards for what qualifies as a good life. In my opinion, most people who live in first world nations have good lives. Many of them just don't realize it. Even if it were somehow possible to provide every person on Earth a guarantee to a good life, how would that be measured? Third, it would actually be a bad thing if a good life was guaranteed rather than earned. Without struggle and sacrifice, nobody would have any appreciation for anything. People would simply expect the best of everything all the time without giving any consideration of what makes it possible for that to happen. Civilization would fall apart. That's kind of what's happening now, actually. We've had a good thing going for a while. We're getting bored and now things are starting to come undone.

That goes against the state claiming to care for the well-being of its citizens. People may have different standards for well-being, but there are still fundamental necessities that need to be met like food, water, shelter and social interaction. I'm also not saying that people shouldn't have to work, but they should be able to enjoy their work and find it fulfilling, and not have to constantly worry about losing their job and thus having their life thrust into turmoil.

The state merely exists to enforce the rule of law and in recent centuries, they are supposed to protect and defend the liberties of the individual. That is the purpose of the state. As for food, water, shelter and social interaction, if it was always the role of the state to provide those necessities, then we as a species would never have made it as far as we did. If you have a population of people who are too ignorant to figure out how to obtain these things, then you have a civilization that simply will not last. As for work, I'm sorry, but nobody owes you a job. You actually have to find one. As for finding a good job that you like, just like the standard of living, that is more of a preference issue than anything. Some people like working at McDonald's while others prefer something might require higher education. Then there are some people who simply want to work for themselves. Some people want to have responsibility and be a boss and some people don't. Some people (many of which who would probably agree with you) would love to have the authority of a boss without the responsibilities. I used to get a lot of those when I worked at Walmart. When or if you get fired, that is simply life. Sometimes it is your fault and sometimes it isn't. The truth is no matter what job you have, even if it is working for the government, that job may not always exist, but in an open and free market, another job will. For example, 30,000 people will lose their jobs because of Toys R Us closing down. That's bad news. The good news is if any of those people are still interested in that line of work, then there are many Toys R Us competitors that they can work for.



Check out my art blog: http://jon-erich-art.blogspot.com

Jon-Erich said:
VGPolyglot said:

That goes against the state claiming to care for the well-being of its citizens. People may have different standards for well-being, but there are still fundamental necessities that need to be met like food, water, shelter and social interaction. I'm also not saying that people shouldn't have to work, but they should be able to enjoy their work and find it fulfilling, and not have to constantly worry about losing their job and thus having their life thrust into turmoil.

The state merely exists to enforce the rule of law and in recent centuries, they are supposed to protect and defend the liberties of the individual. That is the purpose of the state. As for food, water, shelter and social interaction, if it was always the role of the state to provide those necessities, then we as a species would never have made it as far as we did. If you have a population of people who are too ignorant to figure out how to obtain these things, then you have a civilization that simply will not last. As for work, I'm sorry, but nobody owes you a job. You actually have to find one. As for finding a good job that you like, just like the standard of living, that is more of a preference issue than anything. Some people like working at McDonald's while others prefer something might require higher education. Then there are some people who simply want to work for themselves. Some people want to have responsibility and be a boss and some people don't. Some people (many of which who would probably agree with you) would love to have the authority of a boss without the responsibilities. I used to get a lot of those when I worked at Walmart. When or if you get fired, that is simply life. Sometimes it is your fault and sometimes it isn't. The truth is no matter what job you have, even if it is working for the government, that job may not always exist, but in an open and free market, another job will. For example, 30,000 people will lose their jobs because of Toys R Us closing down. That's bad news. The good news is if any of those people are still interested in that line of work, then there are many Toys R Us competitors that they can work for.

The US Delcaration of Independence itself lists life as an inalienable right, and you need water, food and shelter to survive. Of course you can argue that they're bullshitting, but that doesn't change the explicitly stated goals of the state.

Also, I think the "just get another job" line of reasoning neglects the fact that there are more people than jobs though, you can't just go and find another job because there are not other jobs to find in the first place.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/08/08/there-are-7-million-unemployed-and-6-2-million-job-openings-whats-the-problem/?utm_term=.94afce360880



VGPolyglot said:
Jon-Erich said:

The state merely exists to enforce the rule of law and in recent centuries, they are supposed to protect and defend the liberties of the individual. That is the purpose of the state. As for food, water, shelter and social interaction, if it was always the role of the state to provide those necessities, then we as a species would never have made it as far as we did. If you have a population of people who are too ignorant to figure out how to obtain these things, then you have a civilization that simply will not last. As for work, I'm sorry, but nobody owes you a job. You actually have to find one. As for finding a good job that you like, just like the standard of living, that is more of a preference issue than anything. Some people like working at McDonald's while others prefer something might require higher education. Then there are some people who simply want to work for themselves. Some people want to have responsibility and be a boss and some people don't. Some people (many of which who would probably agree with you) would love to have the authority of a boss without the responsibilities. I used to get a lot of those when I worked at Walmart. When or if you get fired, that is simply life. Sometimes it is your fault and sometimes it isn't. The truth is no matter what job you have, even if it is working for the government, that job may not always exist, but in an open and free market, another job will. For example, 30,000 people will lose their jobs because of Toys R Us closing down. That's bad news. The good news is if any of those people are still interested in that line of work, then there are many Toys R Us competitors that they can work for.

The US Delcaration of Independence itself lists life as an inalienable right, and you need water, food and shelter to survive. Of course you can argue that they're bullshitting, but that doesn't change the explicitly stated goals of the state.

Also, I think the "just get another job" line of reasoning neglects the fact that there are more people than jobs though, you can't just go and find another job because there are not other jobs to find in the first place.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/08/08/there-are-7-million-unemployed-and-6-2-million-job-openings-whats-the-problem/?utm_term=.94afce360880

First of all, the US Declaration of Independence was not a list of promises or laws. It was a series a grievances to justify the separation from England. The grievances had to do with government tyranny and oppression, and lack of proper representation, not that government wasn't providing enough. Second, the right to life merely means that no one has the right to take that from you. For example, the President can't simply send people to your home to kill you just because he doesn't like you. It does not mean that someone else is responsible for making sure you're alive. Yes, you need food, water and shelter to survive. However, since you do have the right to life, that means you have the freedom to go out and obtain those things. In some countries around the world, you don't. In fact, in some countries, if you try obtain any of that on your own, you get punished. Third, that article you posted was from August. Since then, more jobs have been created, especially within the last few months. Also, I learned something long ago since I have a background in art. I learned that If you can't find the job you want, or just find one, you have no other choice but to create one. That's really a key factor. People need to find a trade, something they're good at and then exploit it. That's basically how the modern internet got to where it was. 



Check out my art blog: http://jon-erich-art.blogspot.com

Jon-Erich said:
VGPolyglot said:

The US Delcaration of Independence itself lists life as an inalienable right, and you need water, food and shelter to survive. Of course you can argue that they're bullshitting, but that doesn't change the explicitly stated goals of the state.

Also, I think the "just get another job" line of reasoning neglects the fact that there are more people than jobs though, you can't just go and find another job because there are not other jobs to find in the first place.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/08/08/there-are-7-million-unemployed-and-6-2-million-job-openings-whats-the-problem/?utm_term=.94afce360880

First of all, the US Declaration of Independence was not a list of promises or laws. It was a series a grievances to justify the separation from England. The grievances had to do with government tyranny and oppression, and lack of proper representation, not that government wasn't providing enough. Second, the right to life merely means that no one has the right to take that from you. For example, the President can't simply send people to your home to kill you just because he doesn't like you. It does not mean that someone else is responsible for making sure you're alive. Yes, you need food, water and shelter to survive. However, since you do have the right to life, that means you have the freedom to go out and obtain those things. In some countries around the world, you don't. In fact, in some countries, if you try obtain any of that on your own, you get punished. Third, that article you posted was from August. Since then, more jobs have been created, especially within the last few months. Also, I learned something long ago since I have a background in art. I learned that If you can't find the job you want, or just find one, you have no other choice but to create one. That's really a key factor. People need to find a trade, something they're good at and then exploit it. That's basically how the modern internet got to where it was. 

I guess you have a much more positive outlook on society than I do, it's not like millions of people are just going to be able to go and find jobs. If it was so simple, and so manageable, there wouldn't be so many unemployed people.



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VGPolyglot said:
Jon-Erich said:

First of all, the US Declaration of Independence was not a list of promises or laws. It was a series a grievances to justify the separation from England. The grievances had to do with government tyranny and oppression, and lack of proper representation, not that government wasn't providing enough. Second, the right to life merely means that no one has the right to take that from you. For example, the President can't simply send people to your home to kill you just because he doesn't like you. It does not mean that someone else is responsible for making sure you're alive. Yes, you need food, water and shelter to survive. However, since you do have the right to life, that means you have the freedom to go out and obtain those things. In some countries around the world, you don't. In fact, in some countries, if you try obtain any of that on your own, you get punished. Third, that article you posted was from August. Since then, more jobs have been created, especially within the last few months. Also, I learned something long ago since I have a background in art. I learned that If you can't find the job you want, or just find one, you have no other choice but to create one. That's really a key factor. People need to find a trade, something they're good at and then exploit it. That's basically how the modern internet got to where it was. 

I guess you have a much more positive outlook on society than I do, it's not like millions of people are just going to be able to go and find jobs. If it was so simple, and so manageable, there wouldn't be so many unemployed people.

You're never going to have 0% unemployment. It's impossible. However, it should also be mentioned that people get jobs everyday while other people lose jobs everyday. So there are always jobs to go around. The important thing is to create jobs. Also, check this out.

https://data.bls.gov/pdq/SurveyOutputServlet

The US unemployment rate is at an 18 year low.

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/empsit.pdf

The current number of unemployed people in the US stands at 6.7 million while over 300,000 jobs were created in February alone (though that part is not mentioned in this particular report). 

So finding a job isn't that hard right now.



Check out my art blog: http://jon-erich-art.blogspot.com

Ever since Trump won, the rightwingers has turned into a bunch of babies, why?

Conservatives were constantly shouting Benghazi, irs scandals and whatever conspiracy your guys could cook up.

Soon as 1 leftie defend himself the rightwingers starts crying, please stop it.



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1-0 against Grubby in Wc3 frozen throne ladder!!

I don't get what the problem is? It's up to the companies to advertise or not and it's up to him if he accepts the apology or not. If followers would start to harass her in her personal life, that would be an issue but that the free market reacts this way shouldn't be an issue if you believe in the free market and consumer power. Also, she obviously "apologized" since the advertisers pulled out. That is not an actual apology, it's more of a company statement because they are loosing revenue.



Trumpstyle said:
Ever since Trump won, the rightwingers has turned into a bunch of babies, why?

Conservatives were constantly shouting Benghazi, irs scandals and whatever conspiracy your guys could cook up.

Soon as 1 leftie defend himself the rightwingers starts crying, please stop it.

Exactly, I have rarely seen so many snowflakes as the right wing in the last couple of years =)  



Azuren said:
Hiku said:

Wait, he's the bully?
Laura Ingram, with millions of Fox News viewers, sponsored by multinational companies, uses the platform she's been given to rally all her Twitter followers against Hogg with a petty personal attack, (which btw was pretty inaccurate, since he didn't really whine about not getting into any collage, and even said he's not surprised that he wasn't chosen because there are so many other brilliant people who don't get in either).

It's only fair that the investors of such shows are reminded if they really want to sponsor people who promote such behavior.
And at least 13 so far (last I heard) pulled their advertisement.

She's the bully here. And this is exactly how you stop bullying from someone in a much more powerful position than yourself.

They're both bullies. They're both commanding their own armies of mindless drones. The big difference here is Ingraham didn't stifle his ability to make a living, only commented on his inability to start one.

He didn't stifle her ability to make a living either, the free market did that.