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Forums - Sony Discussion - Neil Druckmann Becomes Vice President Of Naughty Dog

DonFerrari on 14 March 2018
John2290 said:
Aeolus451 said:

I edited the post (a little too late). I just don't want progressivism in gaming because it ruined other hobbies. Hobbies are meant to be a retreat so you can relax and forget about the real world for a bit. 

I'm sure you only hate it because you have been force fed it or have only noticed it because of bad implementation. I agree with you however saying that as a blanket statement is akin to censorship, every avenue should be open to the creative team of any medium. I understand you want ND to play it safe but at what cost does playing it safe come, it could easily start including violence or anything sexual. At what point do you then just end up with a bland ass story?

Sorry, progressivism per se sucks... but if a game developer want to portray gay people, black protagonist or fight against animals abuse in a way that makes sense and makes a compelling story than that is valid... the point I believe our friend doesn't want is that they are doing that out of coercion from SJW or to put an individual agenda on the game. Because we already have seem how bad that hit a game.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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globalisateur on 14 March 2018
GribbleGrunger said:
p0isonparadise said:
He's a fan of Anita Sarkeesian.

I love Neil and the games he makes. I believe he and his team are responsible for the greatest game ever made. That's only 'my opinion' but it puts what I think in perspective. I've noticed of late a few comments from Neil (in the interview at PSX in particular) that are worded in line with expediency. The fact he backs this fanatic is part of the worry and the push for female leads is also worrying. I have played many games with females in the lead role and enjoyed them. I tend to pick a female character when the option is available. My favourite franchise -- and the game that got me heavily into gaming -- 'used' to be Tombraider. My issue isn't to do with gender decisions (there being two), it's to do with motives. No matter how good a writer Neil is, if he continues adopting the extremities we see constantly promoted in the media or taught at colleges throughout the US, it could subconsciously affect his narrative decisions and THAT'S where my concern lies. SJWs have completely ruined most films and if we're not careful they'll ruin games. All I ask is that he writes what is right and not what is left.   

Yes, that's a legitimate worry, I agree. Actually I think that you are right to worry because his progressive ideas are already totally in TLOU2 based on their trailers:  We can see Bodybuilded (or not) women in charge in a post apocalyptic world. I found it totally unrealistic, but, hey, it's a videogame, it can be a living fantasy. But that's not actually my biggest worry.

My biggest worry is the quality of the gameplay. In the first game we had an independant director (Bruce Straley) in charge of gameplay whose boss was not the creative director. Now basically what I fear is that the creative director will direct all parts of the game, including the important gameplay. I am worried the game become a game focused on story and non-interactive cutscenes.

Also I am worried about the controls of the game. I loved TLOU controls (the responsive camera, mainly) and I HATED Uncharted 4 dynamic camera. I couldn't play the Multiplayer because of the unresponsive and 'cinematic' camera.



DonFerrari on 14 March 2018
John2290 said:
DonFerrari said:

Sorry, progressivism per se sucks... but if a game developer want to portray gay people, black protagonist or fight against animals abuse in a way that makes sense and makes a compelling story than that is valid... the point I believe our friend doesn't want is that they are doing that out of coercion from SJW or to put an individual agenda on the game. Because we already have seem how bad that hit a game.

Oh,, absolutely. I completely agree It shouldn't be show horned in to fit some fixed level of diversity to appease people or avoid back lash and it certainly shouldn't be used as a gimmick to get people chatting, free publicity and all that shit. People can sense the the intent behind the writers and creative directors motivations pretty damn well, more so than many writers in the industry are talented enough to avoid but Druckmann isn't one of them. Like I said, he and the rest of the creative team are either sincere and want these issues to genuinely support and strengthen their narritives or they are masterful at deceiving the audience, Id believe the former. 

I'm just saying in general, telling game writers or artists of any medium we don't want this because it's to political close at hand right now and it makes me uncomfortable is the same crap the left pull and end up censoring rather than helping. They should be allowed to take on any issue they desire but at the I also think it's up to them to handle it well, don't do it for the sake of doing it or to virtue dignal etc etc and ND have a pretty good record so far and if they fuck up then they'll be called out for it. No point in asking to kill a story before it's conceived just because other people have screwed it up before or in the name of a safe bet. 

Pretty sure from the looks of Tlou2 ND arent going for the safe bet. ^^

Well I agree with what you put, but sure it is a right from the customer to not agree with the idea proposed by the dev and not buy the product.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Hynad on 14 March 2018
iron_megalith said:
GribbleGrunger said:

It didn't actually bother me at all when we found out Ellie was a lesbian. It came on the back of the most honest and sincere writing I've ever seen in video games and so therefore the framing felt natural and not forced. For me, the kiss was one of the most beautiful moments I've ever seen in video games and I had to choke back tears, as us men are prone to do. At that point in his writing career I think he was just expressing his vision for the character and was being true to Ellie. It's not the subject matter than bothers me, it's the intentions behind writing about it. If SJW concerns are at the forefront of his mind when he's writing scripts then it will eventually seep through no matter how hard he tries to hide it. I'd call it the David Cage syndrome. If I get the slightest whiff of this when playing TLOU2 then I don't know if I'll be able to carry on playing the game because a huge factor in playing the first game was the connection honesty created with the narrative.  

But it's only a 'worry' at the moment. 

Disagree with this. Story was nice but again the reason I call it shoehorned was because there were no hints nor proper build up for it to make it seem that way. The only thing that the first game established was she lost a friend. Not a person who she has intimate feelings for.

Why would they hint at her being a lesbian? Do gay people go out yelling they're gay every chance they get?

Or do they only bring it up in one way or another only when they feel something for someone, like most normal people do regardless of their sexual orientation?

Was she supposed to have a badge that says she's a lesbian during her trek with Joel? 



iron_megalith on 31 July 2018

I just remembered this thread and saw this video.


Might have been posted already but this is exactly the state of Naughty Dog that I absolutely hate right now. Since I am posting this again might as well reply.

Hynad said:
iron_megalith said:

Disagree with this. Story was nice but again the reason I call it shoehorned was because there were no hints nor proper build up for it to make it seem that way. The only thing that the first game established was she lost a friend. Not a person who she has intimate feelings for.

Why would they hint at her being a lesbian? Do gay people go out yelling they're gay every chance they get?

Or do they only bring it up in one way or another only when they feel something for someone, like most normal people do regardless of their sexual orientation?

Was she supposed to have a badge that says she's a lesbian during her trek with Joel? 

Because personally that's  one my criteria for what a properly structured story is. Nothing comes out of the left field for no good reason. It makes you think about it. Also you're going in extremes. I didn't say they need to say it out loud. Even though that's what Naughty Dog itself feels like doing nowadays.

You just don't need to put so much emphasis on it. If someone where to say that Detroit Become Human is a parallel to one of society's current problems then yes I wouldn't dispute that. Do I find it absolutely overbearing? Absolutely not because it makes sense. It served a much better purpose than to pander around things. That's how you do a proper drama and make an actual good statement.

Last edited by iron_megalith - on 31 July 2018