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Forums - Politics Discussion - FCC is trying to end net neutrality. This is what it can look like.

Corporate lobbying is killing America.



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fatslob-:O said:

 

Puppyroach said:

Ofcourse you look at other countries and what they do, that is exactly what every country does all the time, including the US =). Why do you otherwise think that you have public schools, public transportation, publically funded police and fire department, a governmental system with inspiration from Europe? You can´t possibly be so naive as to think those ideas formed out of a bubble with no influence from other nations? The same goes with net neutrality: ISP´s in the US will ofcourse look at how ISP´s in other nations have been succesful at monetizing the lack of net neutrality and therefore you need to also look at how other countries does it.

And the example with healthcare, seriously... Medicare and Medicade was formed as an inspiration from how the UK finance its public healthcare.

@Bold LOL, are serious ? The US is one of the very few oldest federal republics that has attained universal suffrage so how much can that be said of other countries who still have either a monarchy or doesn't have any sort of suffrage ? 

FYI, copying what other countries are doing isn't possible in a lot of cases ... (US uses more high end drugs than any other nation so getting the same cost benefits isn't possible) 

Reaching the same per capita GDP as Qatar is nearly impossible since it's the second largest exporter of natural gas ... 

Ofcourse they did. No idea has ever, to the best of our knowledge, been created in a vacuum. The US constitution, as revolutionary as it was at the time (and it was indeed) was a product of the inspiration from free thinkers in France and the UK, from liberalis, conservatism (and without them thinking of it, socialism) and the ideas of universal, inalienable rights. This, combined with their opposition to the crown of the UK and goal of uniting under one nation, formed the basis for the constitution. So the way other countries were run was the inspiration for the document that founded the US.

I am not talking about copying what other countries do. Both Sweden and Norway have universal healthcare, but how we go about implementing it differs between us. The same goes for US and Swedish democracy, both countries have it but go about different ways of implementing it.



Campgrounds wouldn't be ok with removing all regulations when it comes to clear cutting forests, just like how websites wouldn't be ok with removing net neutrality, and it's because it could hurt their business.

How many other people stand to benefit from this though? I don't just mean big business either. There is a lot more to it than just, this is how things are now and everyone else can just deal with it, even if it means changing, because we're not.

If this second round of free market doesn't work in a reasonable amount of time, by all means, reinstate net neutrality and add more regulations that make sense at the same time.



Hiku said:
EricHiggin said:

If this second round of free market doesn't work in a reasonable amount of time, by all means, reinstate net neutrality and add more regulations that make sense at the same time.

The problem is, the majority of the FCC chairs (3 out of 5) are ignoring what the majority of the people want.



Despite millions of comments/letters sent to them, the FCC order did not cite a single one.
So it's not a simple matter of "if this doesn't work out, let's go back."
These three mega corporations have a lot of money, so it's not going to be an easy fight.

I never said it would be, and your right, it will take way more than a few nice words to get it reinstated if it needs to be. The truth of the matter is in today's world, expecting anybody in politics to listen to the people is a waste of time. There is a reason the media keeps showing how Country after Country or even regions, states, etc, are rising up and physically making things happen around the world. The west is slowly heading in that direction. We aren't quite at the everyone riot in the streets and shut the economy down level, but if the same cultural mindset that's been in place for quite some time continue's, this could very well happen eventually in the west as well.

Citizens as well as politicians have been so pampered and their mindset molded in such a politically correct way, that people think that being a 'troublemaker' is unacceptable and because of this, politicians can just sit back and do whatever they want and get away with it. Even when the people do rise up, once that particular issue gets resolved, everything seems to go back to 'normal' and everyone keeps getting screwed in other ways.

What people need to do is use the tools we have, like certain internet tools, to work together to make our voices heard. You have to do it in a physical way though. If the internet packages go up in price or get broken up and are expensive, people need to get together and all do the same thing. Refuse to pay, drop down to a lower package, give up certain services, whatever. As long as enough people all do this at the same time, the Corporations will back down and will change their tune.

Anyone who says I don't have time for that crap I need to work and need money now, well of course you do, your constantly being ripped off and screwed because your always busy working and not paying attention to what's happening and how to make the system work for you. Your also not being told the truth a lot of the time by the media, or their only giving you really poor point form notes, and if you knew the in's and out's, you'd be able to use it to your advantage and live a more laid back life.

The best thing's in life aren't free. What they leave out is that they also require more effort than you would like to give. It leaves everyone with a choice. Live with many minor problems which all add up to one major problem, or deal with most problems head on, and take care of the little things in the meantime. The first sounds easier but ends up tougher, the second sounds like a pain but overall ends up easier. The more people that hate and blame each other for whatever reason, the more everyone get's screwed by the few giant Corporations, who are all working together like you, the people, should be.

Just to be clear. When I say working together, I mean on a large scale. An urban person can't just talk, listen and group up with other urban people and make a decision, because what end's up happening, like with the internet, the rural people get screwed. Those rural people then end up getting together and making decisions and pushing for things that end up screwing urban people over. As many people as possible from various locations, backgrounds, education, etc, need to be brought together to make sure a compromise is made between them, so when the final compromise is made with the politician's, everyone is in the same boat. This isn't super easy, but with the internet tools today, isn't nearly as hard as things used to be either.

People have to start to realize that the problem isn't so much other people, it's Corporations and Government where you need to make a stand. If enough people stand together and make it clear they won't put up with the BS, things will change for the better. Just look at Battlefront 2 and Destiny 2. The people have the ultimate power, always, if they are willing to work together.



Internet is going to be fine. They are blowing this out of proportion.



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Hiku said:

Let me guess, your reply is going to be "because government control is bad"? Give me an actual reply pertaining to the facts please.

Yes, that is my reply - government control is bad.  Here's Fact number 1 for you - The internet is a vibrant, awesome thing.  It has also been subject to far less government intervention than just about any other aspect of modern life.  That's correlation for sure.  As to whether there's causation there, I can only speculate that there is.  

Fact 2 - All of the big content providers support NN.  These are some of the biggest companies on earth - the FAANGs.  That's Facebook, Apple (*the* largest company, by market capitalization, that has ever existed), Amazon, Netflix, Google.  So, that raises a red flag for me right there.  I'm skeptical of big business.  Maybe you think mega-businesses are looking out for your interests.  If so, we're just coming from fundamentally different places.  

But, putting the big business and government intervention angles aside.... At the end of the day, I have no problem with Comcast hitting Netflix for a fee, or charging me extra money to get faster streaming of Netflix versus Hulu, or anything else like that.  I don't know if it will come to that.  But, if it does, that's fine.  I also have no problem, in fact I actually prefer, that I have more choice in my internet service.  Right now, ISPs are very limited in what choices they can offer me.  So, removing that barrier is a good thing, IMO. 

I don't support government doing anything, I am always skeptical of big business, and I don't want any entity to be forced to do anything.  So, I support repeal of NN on those grounds.  The fact that I can envision a scenario with direct personal benefits for me is just icing on the cake. 

 



Gamer147 said:
Internet is going to be fine. They are blowing this out of proportion.

Yeah, the net neutrality act was passed in 2015... 2 years ago. Before that I have never experienced any kind of extra payment for visiting sites. I think if a company did try to do this that someone would go to a different service. It's like the Smartphone data plans, everyone is trying to get the unlimited data plans. At this point they are too expensive, but when they come down I think everyone will opt for unlimited data.



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VAMatt said:
Hiku said:

Let me guess, your reply is going to be "because government control is bad"? Give me an actual reply pertaining to the facts please.

Yes, that is my reply - government control is bad.  Here's Fact number 1 for you - The internet is a vibrant, awesome thing.  It has also been subject to far less government intervention than just about any other aspect of modern life.  That's correlation for sure.  As to whether there's causation there, I can only speculate that there is.  

Fact 2 - All of the big content providers support NN.  These are some of the biggest companies on earth - the FAANGs.  That's Facebook, Apple (*the* largest company, by market capitalization, that has ever existed), Amazon, Netflix, Google.  So, that raises a red flag for me right there.  I'm skeptical of big business.  Maybe you think mega-businesses are looking out for your interests.  If so, we're just coming from fundamentally different places.  

But, putting the big business and government intervention angles aside.... At the end of the day, I have no problem with Comcast hitting Netflix for a fee, or charging me extra money to get faster streaming of Netflix versus Hulu, or anything else like that.  I don't know if it will come to that.  But, if it does, that's fine.  I also have no problem, in fact I actually prefer, that I have more choice in my internet service.  Right now, ISPs are very limited in what choices they can offer me.  So, removing that barrier is a good thing, IMO. 

I don't support government doing anything, I am always skeptical of big business, and I don't want any entity to be forced to do anything.  So, I support repeal of NN on those grounds.  The fact that I can envision a scenario with direct personal benefits for me is just icing on the cake. 

 

I enjoy some government intervention... For examples:

1) Banning Smoking in public places: Thank god.

2) Taking Taxes to Develop roads: Can you imagine all of the toll booths that would exist if a company developed the roads? 

I can't think of anymore... 



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It will be funny to watch: Italy in the mid-late '90s was years ahead of France, that insisted on Minitel, on Internet, but it privatised the former public monopolist telco allowing it to keep a dominating position, the whole existing physical network (except a limited fiber network, bought by FastWeb, that still had to rely on Telecom Italia last mile, or even more than that, wherever it wasn't willing to invest to extend the fiber, and so it remained a fat niche, but never was really able to compete) and abusing it too. In a few years France surpassed us big time.



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