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What are you willing to sacrifice for 60 FPS or higher?

Forums - Gaming Discussion - What are you willing to sacrifice for 60 FPS or higher?

What do you prefer?

Framerate 139 62.05%
 
Resolution 48 21.43%
 
Other 37 16.52%
 
Total:224
caffeinade said:

 

Where is the confusion coming from?


Framerate is not the same as game design, no game I know of even blurs the lines.

Bold; There is no confusion, I'm simply asking why you're (At least trying to) telling me that I find 60fps more fun than 30fps as if it's a fact, when the simple fact is that no, I don't find 60fps more fun than 30fps, it makes absolutely zero difference to me whatsoever, yet you seem to be using "this is not up for debate" as an excuse to completely ignore anything being said that doesn't follow your way of thinking. It's very flawed.

Underlined; I'm not saying that framerate and game design are the same, I'm saying that framerate does not in any way affect the amount of fun I have with a game, I really don't get how you don't understand that, contrary to what you think, there are people who can enjoy a game the exact same amount at 30fps even if it's available at 60fps too. 



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caffeinade said:

It is a fact that the higher a framerate means a more enjoyable, more controllable, this is not up for debate.
Some of the best games (BotW) do run at 30 FPS, but they would be better enjoyed at 60, fact.

Whether or not something is more enjoyable or not is entirely subjective. You might as well claim that anchovies on pizza make it better tasting 100% of the time, and claim it is a fact. 



The sentence below is false. 
The sentence above is true. 

Cerebralbore101 said:
caffeinade said:

It is a fact that the higher a framerate means a more enjoyable, more controllable, this is not up for debate.
Some of the best games (BotW) do run at 30 FPS, but they would be better enjoyed at 60, fact.

Whether or not something is more enjoyable or not is entirely subjective. You might as well claim that anchovies on pizza make it better tasting 100% of the time, and claim it is a fact. 

Should get an interesting response to this, just remember though; it's not up for debate.



curl-6 said:
Pemalite said:

I disagree. The 7th Gen showed that three consoles can compete in the dedicated home console market with the Xbox 360, Playstation 3 and Wii doing amazingly well.

Actually... That statement is false.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_(API)

- I think that only worked cos Wii was nothing like PS3/360 though; never have three similar consoles all done well.

Well. That's just moving goal posts. :P
I mean. You aren't wrong though, I doubt the Wii would have succeeded if it was just another Playstation 3/Xbox 360-type machine.

curl-6 said:

- I can't see a general purpose tablet API giving as good optimization as a device designed specifically for gaming and pretty much gaming alone. Switch has its own custom API, "NVN" built specifically for the hardware. Tablets don't have this luxury as even Metal has to work on numerous different hardwares and can't be tailored specifically to any single one.

That's not a fault of the API though. The API works just as efficiently regardless of how many platforms it is on.

The issue is developers need to contend with varying types of hardware and their intrinsic capabilities, which as I elaborated prior, is where the Switch's strength ultimately lays.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
curl-6 said:

- I think that only worked cos Wii was nothing like PS3/360 though; never have three similar consoles all done well.

Well. That's just moving goal posts. :P
I mean. You aren't wrong though, I doubt the Wii would have succeeded if it was just another Playstation 3/Xbox 360-type machine.

So, can't we say that we have 3 successful consoles now then, with the PS4, XB1 and Switch? If the 7th gen counts despite the Wii's technical disadvantage, then surely the Switch would too.



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Pemalite said:
curl-6 said:

- I think that only worked cos Wii was nothing like PS3/360 though; never have three similar consoles all done well.

Well. That's just moving goal posts. :P
I mean. You aren't wrong though, I doubt the Wii would have succeeded if it was just another Playstation 3/Xbox 360-type machine.

curl-6 said:

- I can't see a general purpose tablet API giving as good optimization as a device designed specifically for gaming and pretty much gaming alone. Switch has its own custom API, "NVN" built specifically for the hardware. Tablets don't have this luxury as even Metal has to work on numerous different hardwares and can't be tailored specifically to any single one.

That's not a fault of the API though. The API works just as efficiently regardless of how many platforms it is on.

The issue is developers need to contend with varying types of hardware and their intrinsic capabilities, which as I elaborated prior, is where the Switch's strength ultimately lays.

Wasn't that the original position of my "goalposts" though? That there has never been room for 3 similar consoles? I don't think I ever said there's never been room for 3 at all; there is as long as they're not all fighting for the same audience. Wii and Switch are different enough that they can co-exist with the others without directly clashing.

I admit I'm no expert on APIs but it seems to me that one that was to work on numerous platforms won't be quite as low level as one custom tailored to a single platform, in the same way a suit that has to fit 100 different guys won't fit as well as one that was measured and tailored just for me?



I'll take framerate over resolution any day (with the possibility of some corner case exceptions). I don't care particularly much about resolution anyway, as long as it's not low enough to hinder gameplay (e.g. by hiding distant enemies).



I don't care how sharp it looks, if the frame rate is garbage I'm not touching it.



curl-6 said:

Wasn't that the original position of my "goalposts" though? That there has never been room for 3 similar consoles? I don't think I ever said there's never been room for 3 at all; there is as long as they're not all fighting for the same audience. Wii and Switch are different enough that they can co-exist with the others without directly clashing.

They are similar in that they were all fixed dedicated home consoles, which is what I assumed you were pertaining to as the Switch doesn't fall into that category but the Wii does.

curl-6 said:

I admit I'm no expert on APIs but it seems to me that one that was to work on numerous platforms won't be quite as low level as one custom tailored to a single platform, in the same way a suit that has to fit 100 different guys won't fit as well as one that was measured and tailored just for me?

Nope, they are all as low-level as each other.

That doesn't mean NVN/Switch isn't doing things Metal/iOS couldn't...
I mean, Microsoft offloaded the handling of draw calls from the CPU and threw it onto the command processor on the GPU for instance which is something that can only be reliably achieved in a fixed hardware environment... But that doesn't make NVN a lower level API that say Metal, it just exposes different features and does a few things differently.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
curl-6 said:

Wasn't that the original position of my "goalposts" though? That there has never been room for 3 similar consoles? I don't think I ever said there's never been room for 3 at all; there is as long as they're not all fighting for the same audience. Wii and Switch are different enough that they can co-exist with the others without directly clashing.

They are similar in that they were all fixed dedicated home consoles, which is what I assumed you were pertaining to as the Switch doesn't fall into that category but the Wii does.

curl-6 said:

I admit I'm no expert on APIs but it seems to me that one that was to work on numerous platforms won't be quite as low level as one custom tailored to a single platform, in the same way a suit that has to fit 100 different guys won't fit as well as one that was measured and tailored just for me?

Nope, they are all as low-level as each other.

That doesn't mean NVN/Switch isn't doing things Metal/iOS couldn't...
I mean, Microsoft offloaded the handling of draw calls from the CPU and threw it onto the command processor on the GPU for instance which is something that can only be reliably achieved in a fixed hardware environment... But that doesn't make NVN a lower level API that say Metal, it just exposes different features and does a few things differently.

I meant "similar" more in the sense that the PS3/360, PS4/Xbone, or PS2/Xbox/GCN are similar. Wii with its focus on motion controls and simpler, accessible games instead of the HD AAA titles that defined PS3/360 was different enough from the competition that it carved out its own market. Switch is doing the same by offering a very different experience to PS4/Xbone. Whenever you have 3 platforms that are quite similar and compete directly, one or more of them are unsuccessful. (E.g. Xbox/GCN, Saturn)

And okay, fair enough, I'll rephrase my comment.