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Forums - Politics Discussion - Being anti-nazi shouldn't be political or controversial

 

Fuck nazis

Hell yeah 139 100.00%
 
Total:139
Nogamez said:
There is no Nazis left only Right wing. If people want to be extreme right wing, let them, as long as they aint hurting anybody. Far right, far left, who really gives a shit

Wow....that's some strong shit. Ignorance is bliss I guess?! No, don't let them be that way! Try to counter them with reason, argue with knowledge and experience. "Let them" is only going to cause even more idiots in the long run. People need to be educated, not ignored.



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DarthMetalliCube said:
VGPolyglot said:

Further you go left, closer you get to the right? I assume you're referring to the horseshoe idea then.

Horseshoe theory is one that I very much believe in, as I've seen many similarities in the far right and far left. The further to either extreme you go, the more similar these people act, and actual ideas begin to give way to violent/suppressive characteristics and tactics at all costs. This video explains it very well. The main difference, as this professor puts it, distiled down to its absolute simpliest form - "In the far right Fascist imperial regime, a man is shot by the authorities at dawn for the crime of stealing an apple of the STATE. In the Communist, hyper Socialist dictatorship, a man is shot at dawn for stealing an apple of THE PEOPLE." The common theme is "as the horseshoe ends, YOU stop mattering. Only the role you play in 'The People' or 'The State' matters."

I think a lot of this "TRUMP/suppoters are NAZIS" stuff is projection, as these people see a lot of themselves, or at least of what they support, on the opposite end of the spectrum.

This is why I've always stressed Libertarianism/Individualism over hardcore left vs right or Authoritarianism.

No, it's just that a lot of Trump's values like nationalism, white supremacy, family values, fighting education and Aufklärung, ignorance of science/make up your own science, rewriting books etc. share their roots with National Socialism and other authoritarian regimes.

It's true that the extreme left is not much better than the extreme right, but that still doesn't make them equal. Fighting against individual wealth or fighting against a certain group of people's lright to live is not the same.



RolStoppable said:

You'd have somewhat of a point if you didn't deny the existence of nazis today. Nazi symbolism is still around today, but nothing of the Roman Empire is. That's why these two topics aren't treated in the same exact way.

Your final paragraph before the edit also has you taking sides with the people who got offended that virtual nazis get killed in a video game, because you aren't calling them out. Overall, it's a really bad post.

Deny their existence? In what universe do I deny their existence???

I make the educated difference between a nazi and a neo nazi which you don't seem to be aware of.

And on top of that you reduce the REASON for hating nazis to their symbolism? Are you saying if there was no nazi symbolism around today, nazis would be okay people just as you're justifying Roman atrocities and crimes cause their symbolism isn't around as much as nazis'?

And in what universe am I taking sides with people offended by nazis being killed? I'm just saying making such a huge deal of those atrocities while taking lightly every other atrocities committed by past civilizations makes no sense. I should have also added it's a one sided view that is plain wrong as previous crimes committed by previous armies and societies should ALSO be despised as nazis are.

No offense my friend but you need to read twice what I write to make sure you agree OR disagree with what I said and NOT what you think I said.



StarOcean said:
DarthMetalliCube said:

???

Forgive me but I'm completely baffled by this. Might I ask why?

IMO free speech is the biggest cornerstone of a free and prosperous society. Short of threatening words, ALL speech needs to be allowed. If they are truly horrible ideas (as are the ideas of Nazism, and hell Fascism/Communism in general for that matter), then they will be naturally marginalized and defeated in the free marketplace of ideas as the majority of well meaning people will reject them. Without free speech we are at the whim of oppressive people/governments who feel they can oppress and silence you through force simply because you have the wrong beliefs/ideas. To me that leads to a spiral of self-destruction, and in many ways represents the very characteristics of Nazism ironically..

This is why I despite Antifa fascists because they are starting to implement these tactics.

No. I do not believe in free speech. It allows for hate groups to exist. Any hate ideologies such as Nazism, racism, sexism, etc in their purest form (not the bastardized versions) should be punished. We send terrorists to Guantonomo Bay, solitary confinement indefinitely for many of them. That's what would be done to those sorts of people. There aren't many people like it thankfully, but they deserve no platform to spread their idealogies and must be stopped at the source. 

So because you think the idea is harmful you think people should be banned from making those statements? You know there's people who think video games in themselves are violent and harmful to society, and I doubt you would like to see them banned. In my opinion people should make effective arguments agaisnt ideologies they think is harmful, rather than just banning people from saying certain things.



CrazyGamer2017 said:

Except there aren't any nazis alive today and by the same logic, pretty much ANY army in past history you can think of including those that are depicted gloriously on some big budget movies, deserve to be hated.
I've always thought it kind of strange that people's emotional response to mass atrocities seem to be proportional to how recent said atrocities were committed and when something happens very long ago it's like, fun and nice and cool to hear about in a candid way.

Example: The Roman Empire, Who gets pissed off at people depicting the Roman Empire in a nice way? No one, There are even games that kind of praise that civilization and their armies. But we all know the Roman Empire was particularly cruel and they have murdered on such a huge scale and in so horrible ways that they deserve to be hated just as nazis are. There's even a theme park in France "Le Parc Asterix" centered on a comic fictional Gaul character that lived in those times and the Romans are just nice guys that granted, try to invade the village of Asterix but never really appear bad or evil, just an army of clumsy almost sympathetic guys that you kind of feel sorry for cause they fail at invading that village...

So, were nazis scum on the face of the earth? Hell yeah, they are, but are they the only ones? Hell no. So for all I care they can make games where you kick their ass or EVEN you play the nazi that kicks the so called "good" guys' ass, it's ONLY a game and in Star Wars games for instance, you can even be the bad guy. No big deal, as long as you know it's only a game and you know the difference between good and evil. But judging by how most people get upset at nazism while at the same time not giving the same kind of hatred to pretty much every past army and civilizations that sooner or later were inevitably guilty of atrocities too, Kind of makes no sense to me.

EDIT: Oh and to the OP: The very nature of making a poll is to give at least two options so there is a "choice" you can make, just saying.

No man, Hitler's ideology was way worse than Caesar's so don't try to equalise them. It wouldn't be acceptable to play as a Nazi at all. It would be nice to see a game from the average German soldier's perspective one day, not all Germans were Nazis...far from it. The minority were, just as only a minority supports Trump today...but don't get me wrong, Trump is no Hitler..(at least yet..he's missing the intellect for better or worse)...and I don't want to compare him directly with him, but there are certain parallels in the way both came to power which are clearly noticeable. 

Concerning your point...Of course it's arguable that the fight against the native Americans, Incas etc. (the "Untermenschen" (subhumans) of said time) or Stalin's Gulags were just the same evil - they were, at least partly, indeed - but that doesn't mean we should demonize the Nazis less...it means we should recognise the other crimes against humanity more!



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CrazyGamer2017 said:

Except there aren't any nazis alive today and by the same logic, pretty much ANY army in past history you can think of including those that are depicted gloriously on some big budget movies, deserve to be hated.
I've always thought it kind of strange that people's emotional response to mass atrocities seem to be proportional to how recent said atrocities were committed and when something happens very long ago it's like, fun and nice and cool to hear about in a candid way.

Example: The Roman Empire, Who gets pissed off at people depicting the Roman Empire in a nice way? No one, There are even games that kind of praise that civilization and their armies. But we all know the Roman Empire was particularly cruel and they have murdered on such a huge scale and in so horrible ways that they deserve to be hated just as nazis are. There's even a theme park in France "Le Parc Asterix" centered on a comic fictional Gaul character that lived in those times and the Romans are just nice guys that granted, try to invade the village of Asterix but never really appear bad or evil, just an army of clumsy almost sympathetic guys that you kind of feel sorry for cause they fail at invading that village...

So, were nazis scum on the face of the earth? Hell yeah, they are, but are they the only ones? Hell no. So for all I care they can make games where you kick their ass or EVEN you play the nazi that kicks the so called "good" guys' ass, it's ONLY a game and in Star Wars games for instance, you can even be the bad guy. No big deal, as long as you know it's only a game and you know the difference between good and evil. But judging by how most people get upset at nazism while at the same time not giving the same kind of hatred to pretty much every past army and civilizations that sooner or later were inevitably guilty of atrocities too, Kind of makes no sense to me.

EDIT: Oh and to the OP: The very nature of making a poll is to give at least two options so there is a "choice" you can make, just saying.

The main difference between the Nazis and the Romans is that the latter are long forgotten, while a fair amount of people nowadays remember World War 2 very well (or knew someone who did).



HomokHarcos said:

So because you think the idea is harmful you think people should be banned from making those statements? You know there's people who think video games in themselves are violent and harmful to society, and I doubt you would like to see them banned. In my opinion people should make effective arguments against ideologies they think is harmful, rather than just banning people from saying certain things.

 

Man I couldn't agree more. Banning someone cause you disagree with them EVEN if you can reasonably think what they say is wrong is becoming oneself an agent of anti-free speech and one cannot criticize fascism or hatred or whatever if one begins applying "the enemy's tactics".



Errorist76 said:

No man, Hitler's ideology was way worse than Caesar's so don't try to equalise them.

Caesar claimed to have killed around 1 million Celts (most of them weren't even soldiers), which was a huge part of the Celtic population, so I don't see how Hitler was that much worse.



monocle_layton said:
Fededx said:

Well you antifas say you're tolerant, but there's no tolerance in this thread. We live in this so called democracy, but if I say I'm neonazi here, you would insult me for my beliefs. You're as nazis as the nazis, but in modern era.

No no no. We can insult you all we like. That's true tolerance.

 

Be whatever the hell you desire. Just don't go about saying we're nazis for attacking your beliefs. It's 2017, I thought free speech was popular nowm

LurkerJ said:
Being anti-Islam shouldn't be political or controversial either. But this is the world we live in

What bothers me about the Muslim community is that they don't see their hypocrisy. They attack apostates and people who question Islam, yet respect a man who threatened Muhammad multiple times before converting to Islam (Omar ibn Khattab).

The man is literally considered one of the greatest men in Islam, but people can overlook multiple death threats and an actual attempt to kill Muhammad. If he can be forgiven, then honestly why should people criticizing Islam be hated?

Shias actually despise Umar.



Errorist76 said:

No man, Hitler's ideology was way worse than Caesar's so don't try to equalise them. It wouldn't be acceptable to play as a Nazi at all. It would be nice to see a game from the average German soldier's perspective one day, not all Germans were Nazis...far from it. The minority were, just as only a minority supports Trump today...but don't get me wrong, Trump is no Hitler..(at least yet..he's missing the intellect for better or worse)...and I don't want to compare him directly with him, but there are certain parallels in the way both came to power which are clearly noticeable. 

Concerning your point...Of course it's arguable that the fight against the native Americans, Incas etc. (the "Untermenschen" (subhumans) of said time) or Stalin's Gulags were just the same evil - they were, at least partly, indeed - but that doesn't mean we should demonize the Nazis less...it means we should recognise the other crimes against humanity more!

Then we're going to have to agree to disagree on that first statement of yours that I put in bold. Caesar not only was just as cruel as Hitler was though with a different agenda, cause his armies would massacre, rape, torture (women, children, even men), only rich and powerful people were allowed to vote, slaves were kept for all purposes, fight to the DEATH, sex (and by sex I mean constant rape including of children) Public amusement consisted of watching people being mauled and devoured by lions in a public stadium etc...

Anyway, Ceasar was not only at least just as cruel as Hitler, he was FAR FAR from being the only leader at the time. Basically every leader before him and every one after him within the Roman Empire was just as cruel and the pain never ended, AT LEAST After Hitler died things got better in Germany.

As for the second point I put in bold at the end of your post, I couldn't agree more, I am 100% with what you are saying there and if you read me again you'll notice that it is pretty much in essence what I was trying to say.