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Forums - Politics Discussion - Officer in Georgia says to woman during traffic stop: "We only kill black people"

Soundwave said:
A_C_E said:

These kind of statements never cease to impress me. I'm not sure if it gets worse everyday or people are just more comfortable (kind of ironic) with projecting their factually vulnerable "feels".

There are those that base evidence on their "feels" and there are those that base evidence on reality. We have two things; reality and interpretation of reality. When someone says they feel (interpretation) targeted, it does not mean they are targeted. Being stopped by a police officer might result in them being killed? How many traffic stops take place versus how many innocent people have been shot by police officers during a traffic stop? Again, I find myself impressed since the collective evidence suggests that the chances of an innocent person getting killed by a police officer at a traffic stop couldn't be anymore closer to zero. The number of people who have won the lottery greatly outnumbers the amount of innocent people being shot by a police officer during a traffic stop.

The question is, do the "feels" outweigh reality?

Probably easy to feel this way when you've never been put in a position where a routine situation could lead to you getting shot. 

That dude who was choked to death by several officers for selling CDs on a street corner or the kid that was shot to death for wearing a hoodie while walking home or that other dude who was shot to death like 8 times in front of his daughter while simply reaching for his papers ... yeah if that happened to people who speicifically looked exactly like you, I imagine you might have a different POV in that scenario. 

It's very easy to say until you've been put in a position where a routine situation almost leads to you getting shot.

In the Fall of 2009, I was on my way from Tulsa to Oklahoma State in Stillwater with my girlfriend in the passenger seat and one of our friends in the back. We are all minorities. I got pulled over in Mannford for doing about 70 or 75 in a 55 mph thanks to a fucking speed trap that these backwater, podunk towns are known for where the speed limit can drastically drop in the blink of an eye.

So I pull over, I'm reaching for my wallet to get my license, I already have my window rolled down, and the next thing you know, two officers run up to each front window and point pistols right between our eyes and shout out us to put our guns down. I remember imagining my head getting blown off and imagining those two getting riddled with bullets for no fucking reason, and I just froze in place for what seemed like an eternity. My wallet was in my right side pocket and I was using my left hand to reach for it, and when I stopped being shocked enough to actually listen to the officer shouting at me, I told him what I was doing and that we don't have weapons, and that I was scared to move my hand for fear that he would shoot me.

He told me to slowly put my hands on the steering wheel, so I did. The other officer made her put her hands on top of the dashboard and our friend's hands in the air. They made us get out of the car one at a time, they patted us down, and then made us get behind it on our knees with our hands behind our heads, and remain there while they searched the car for guns and drugs, all the while we're staring down the barrell of guns pointed at us the whole time. They radioed for another car to come with a dog to smell for guns and drugs, all the while telling me that if I am hiding any, I better tell them now or suffer the consequences later. I keep telling them that they can search a thousand times and find nothing, and asking them to please stop pointing their guns at my friends. I can't remember why they said no, because all that mattered to me at the moment was that they wouldn't, and all that was running through my head was the image of them and myself getting shot  for no fucking reason.

I'm going to spare all of the details because I've already made a giant wall of text, but we were on the side of that road for about an hour and a half, They eventually let us get off of our knees, and eventually stopped pointing guns at us. And they eventually told us their reasoning: they claimed that when I was pulling over to the side of the road, my friend in the back was scurrying to put on his seatbelt, and the silver buckle of the seatbelt looked like it could have been a gun from their point-of-view, so they couldn't take any chances. I could have been Trayvon Martin or Terrance Crutcher, or that guy in Baltimore over a fucking seatbelt. If I would have jumped when my hand was in my pocket, I and two other innocent college kids would have died over a fucking seatbelt. Want to know the irony in that? If you're 12 or older in the Oklahoma, you don't need your seatbelt on in the backseat; it's optional.

So if you've managed to read this far, I hope you can understand why I personally get a bit uneasy around an armed police officer, especially when I get pulled over (and if you want to hear more bullshit reasons for me getting pulled over, let me know. I have more). And I hope you can understand why an officer making such racist jokes isn't funny to someone like myself, no matter the context. I know it's personal and highly anecdotal, but you're delusional if you think this type of thing doesn't happen to people who look like me every single day.



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Aeolus451 said:
Tulipanzo said:

I can't believe you to be so fantastically thick as to not understand why a joke whose punchline is "killing black people" might be in poor taste.

On the plus side, I got "doesn't understand how sarcasm works" on the right wing bingo

There's a difference in saying something in sarcasm to make a point and telling a joke to be humorous. It's not in poor taste because cops aren't out to kill black people. That's just a myth used for politics.

Edit: I CAN believe you to be so fantastically thick.
Not worth discussing politics who someone who doesn't believe in facts. Have a nice day



Tulipanzo said:
Aeolus451 said:

There's a difference in saying something in sarcasm to make a point and telling a joke to be humorous. It's not in poor taste because cops aren't out to kill black people. That's just a myth used for politics.

Edit: I CAN believe you to be so fantastically thick.
Not worth discussing politics who someone who doesn't believe in facts. Have a nice day

How can you educate anyone if they have to believe in the facts before you discuss something with them though? Do your part Tuli! I believe in you!



AngryLittleAlchemist said:
Tulipanzo said:

Edit: I CAN believe you to be so fantastically thick.
Not worth discussing politics who someone who doesn't believe in facts. Have a nice day

How can you educate anyone if they have to believe in the facts before you discuss something with them though? Do your part Tuli! I believe in you!

It's not like he doesn't know the facts, he purposely chooses to present police brutality as myth.
That is not a position you reach by listening to people and educating yourself, it's one you reach after years of lies and bigotry.
The only person who can help Aeolus is himself. 



Aeolus451 said:
Insidb said:

1) Unarmed black men are shot by police at the same rate as armed white men.

2) Black youths are shot by police at 21 times the rate at white youths.

3) There is a no discernible difference between the rate of marijuana usage of whites and blacks, but blacks are are criminalized at a distinctly higher rate.

4) The pay-for-play private prison system has targeted and unjustly incarcerated minority youths at a much higher rate.

5) Blacks receive longer and harsher sentences for the same offenses as their white counterparts.

6) There have been recent convictions of judges involved in these discriminatory activities.

 

This is the problem with not understanding the context of statistics: as they say in baseball, "a bloop single looks like a hard line drive in the box score."

if you're gonna make claims like that, where's your source?

1) https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/07/11/arent-more-white-people-than-black-people-killed-by-police-yes-but-no/?utm_term=.75b068511a6e

2) https://thinkprogress.org/report-black-male-teens-are-21-times-more-likely-to-be-killed-by-cops-than-white-ones-72fb08a1dbda/

3) https://www.aclu.org/report/report-war-marijuana-black-and-white?redirect=criminal-law-reform/war-marijuana-black-and-white

4) http://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2014/03/13/289000532/why-for-profit-prisons-house-more-inmates-of-color

5) https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/17/opinion/sunday/unequal-sentences-for-blacks-and-whites.html?mcubz=1

6) https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/?toURL=https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterpavlo/2011/08/12/pennsylvania-judge-gets-life-sentence-for-prison-kickback-scheme/&refURL=https://www.google.com/&referrer=https://www.google.com/

 

There's a lot more where those came from, but the problem we face is quite severe.



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Prison industry is also a big time billion dollar industry in the US:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/16/us-prisons-jail-private-healthcare-companies-profit

"Prison industry" even has like their version of E3, lol, with new products shown off like "suicide blankets".

That industry doesn't work if those prisons aren't full.



Tulipanzo said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

How can you educate anyone if they have to believe in the facts before you discuss something with them though? Do your part Tuli! I believe in you!

It's not like he doesn't know the facts, he purposely chooses to present police brutality as myth.
That is not a position you reach by listening to people and educating yourself, it's one you reach after years of lies and bigotry.
The only person who can help Aeolus is himself. 

I know, lol. Good effort though Tuli 



Tulipanzo said:
Aeolus451 said:

There's a difference in saying something in sarcasm to make a point and telling a joke to be humorous. It's not in poor taste because cops aren't out to kill black people. That's just a myth used for politics.

Edit: I CAN believe you to be so fantastically thick.
Not worth discussing politics who someone who doesn't believe in facts. Have a nice day

Facts? As much as some of you like to cherry pick, you must get paid pretty well by the hour or something.... Let's look at some facts, shall we?

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2012/crime-in-the-u.s.-2012/tables/43tabledatadecoverviewpdf

Keep in mind this is just statistics for 2012. Blacks only make up about 12% of the US population but they commited 49% of all murders (more than even whites) and 54% of robberies for that year. They commit 25% or more crimes across the board except for DUI and liquor laws which are representive of their total population. It's safe to say this reflective of every year's stats.

In general, black people disproportionately commit more crimes which increase their interactions with the police. Considering the rate of murders and robberies, it's no surprise that blacks get into alot of deadly altercations with cops.

Cops are not out to kill black people. 



Tulipanzo said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

How can you educate anyone if they have to believe in the facts before you discuss something with them though? Do your part Tuli! I believe in you!

It's not like he doesn't know the facts, he purposely chooses to present police brutality as myth.
That is not a position you reach by listening to people and educating yourself, it's one you reach after years of lies and bigotry.
The only person who can help Aeolus is himself. 

You're being mistleading again or unable to read something as is. You're not representing any facts whatsoever. I never said that police brutality is a myth. I said that cops are not targetting blacks because they're racist but because they commit more crime. 



d21lewis said:

I'm black. I was a cop. I make a great living now (after quitting that job). My mom and dad are poor. They've never been in any type of trouble. They're still married.

Both worked nonstop up until they were in a car accident in about 2013.

They weren't afforded the opportunities that a lot of Americans had. They went to segregated schools as kids and grew up in a time where there was REAL oppression. I'm 40 years old. I haven't been unemployed for a week since I was 18. At one point, I worked two full time jobs (two different police agencies) just to make enough money to pay my bills late and I only have one kid. If it weren't for the doors that opened because I was a cop, I'd still be living in almost poverty.

It's very possible to make good financial decisions, stay out of trouble, work hard your whole life, and still be poor. There's other factors like location and opportunity to consider. I can't just look at other people and say "Just do what I did!" because the opportunities that I had were in extremely short supply. I'm lucky and I thank God everyday for basically winning the lottery. 

I'm glad you found success. But working hard and working smart are two different things. You can work very hard at minimum wage but you wouldn't be working smart because you would be much more capable than that minimum wage job. But honestly, good for you, and yes there are other factors.

My point is towards those who think being poor isn't a choice. Of course there is going to be cases where people do really nice things in life and still end up poor. I did not offer my arguement as an absolute. These first world countries are too full of opportunity to suggest that being poor isn't a choice. We all have our standards of awareness of certain facts and it is up to an individual to allow their awareness to cast a net on their interests in life. From here an individual (should) progress towards the interest, with not just hard work but also dedication and free will; without giving up. 85% of Americans go to jobs they are unhappy with, who wish they could just let it all go, but they are too afraid that letting go will be worse than their current situation.

I have seen and heard of too many cases of people handicapped from the beginning of their life, being told they couldn't do something, that are so misguided, only to become incredibly successful themselves because they grew themselves in the direction of their interests. I could go on with the whole "If they can do it, so can you" speel but we all know why they made it, because they did what they wanted to do.

Just answer me this one question: How can someone (in any walk of life/country), who is disabled in many ways, outclass someone much more capable than them? Americans and Canadians...it's almost as if too many of us are too comfortable with living a life that doesn't reflect our capacities.