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Turkey to teach children true meaning of 'jihad' in schools

Forums - Politics Discussion - Turkey to teach children true meaning of 'jihad' in schools

Dark_Lord_2008 said:
Turkey has shown to the world that Muslims and Non-Muslims can live together and embrace peace, freedom and democracy.

Are you being sarcastic? This is Turkey under Erdogan we're talking about.



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barneystinson69 said:
binary solo said:

"jihad as patriotic in spirit."

But that's not the true meaning of Jihad, like, at all.

So it's just another co-opting of a word for political control. Shouldn't really be surprised.

Turkey is devolving fast. I wonder if this would be happening if the EU had been more welcoming of Turkey as a member of the back before Erdogan started dismantling the secular bulwarks upon which modern Turkey was founded.

What are you talking about? This is exactly the WRONG thing to do when this is happening. Plus, letting Turkey into the EU means that 80 million turks can now roam around EU nations with no border controls. Not only would it be a security risk, but there would be millions of turks flooding the labour market in other nations as well. It would be an absolute disaster.

I'm talking about when Turkey was on the verge of joinging the EU before Erdogan got an iron clad Islamist grip on the country. Joining the EU before he starting ruinging the place may have helped secure its moderate secular foundations. But no too many EU countries were shit scared of a "Muslim" country being inside the circle, when it was actually a secular country with a majority Muslim (and modetrate) population. It's too late now.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

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binary solo said:

I'm talking about when Turkey was on the verge of joinging the EU before Erdogan got an iron clad Islamist grip on the country. Joining the EU before he starting ruinging the place may have helped secure its moderate secular foundations. But no too many EU countries were shit scared of a "Muslim" country being inside the circle, when it was actually a secular country with a majority Muslim (and modetrate) population. It's too late now.

Honestly, I'm happy that Turkey didn't join the EU yet ... 

Erdogan isn't the problem, Turkey just doesn't have strong enough institutions to ward off the instability that comes with it like how the United States or the United Kingdom does by picking Trump or choosing to secede from the EU ... 



binary solo said:
barneystinson69 said:

What are you talking about? This is exactly the WRONG thing to do when this is happening. Plus, letting Turkey into the EU means that 80 million turks can now roam around EU nations with no border controls. Not only would it be a security risk, but there would be millions of turks flooding the labour market in other nations as well. It would be an absolute disaster.

I'm talking about when Turkey was on the verge of joinging the EU before Erdogan got an iron clad Islamist grip on the country. Joining the EU before he starting ruinging the place may have helped secure its moderate secular foundations. But no too many EU countries were shit scared of a "Muslim" country being inside the circle, when it was actually a secular country with a majority Muslim (and modetrate) population. It's too late now.

According to who? Because from what I have heard, Turkey was a long way from the EU with or without Erdogan. You have to keep in mind that Turkey isn't even a primarly European country, and bringing it into the union could open up security issues (proximity to the ME). So no, it is not the EU's fault for what has happened. And how would bringing Turkey into the EU change things that much? The electorate wanted Erdogan, and this is what they get.



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fatslob-:O said:
vivster said:

They have the same basis but a completely different attitude and intent. Like an imam in a soup kitchen and an ISIS fighter.

Patriotism and nationalism are both based on pride but they take a completely opposite approach. Which takes me back to my original comment. Patriotism has never hurt anyone, nationalism has.

Patriotism and nationalism are literally synonyms ... 

Just what exactly is the difference between liking or being devoted to one's nation ? 

Both words mean being devoted to your country. The difference is in how you express it. I don't see how this is so hard to grasp. I'm running out of analogies.

Patriotism is inviting people over to show them how awesome your country is.

Nationalism is keeping people away because your country is too awesome to be stepped on by them.

The meaning is defined by how a person acts on his pride.



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this is horrible news, I have a feeling that if this keeps building up in Turkey, there's gonna be another coup or a civil war at worst

it's not a coincidence that they are investing primarily in military, and they won't join the EU, not with their current political status anyway and still, they don't wonna give up on the illegally occupied EU ground in Cyprus, which they've been holding for the last 43 years

seems to me that a big part the population has moved forward towards being Westernized in lifestyle, but it seems that there is also a significant number of Turks who are still living in the long past, and there's nothing wrong with nationalism and partiotism, most people love their countries, but there is a difference between loving your country and hating every other country

Islam is a very peaceful religion, hopefully this is what Erdogan wants to teach in schools, and not this:



barneystinson69 said:
binary solo said:

I'm talking about when Turkey was on the verge of joinging the EU before Erdogan got an iron clad Islamist grip on the country. Joining the EU before he starting ruinging the place may have helped secure its moderate secular foundations. But no too many EU countries were shit scared of a "Muslim" country being inside the circle, when it was actually a secular country with a majority Muslim (and modetrate) population. It's too late now.

According to who? Because from what I have heard, Turkey was a long way from the EU with or without Erdogan. You have to keep in mind that Turkey isn't even a primarly European country, and bringing it into the union could open up security issues (proximity to the ME). So no, it is not the EU's fault for what has happened. And how would bringing Turkey into the EU change things that much? The electorate wanted Erdogan, and this is what they get.

Turkey's proximity to the middle east wouldn't have created any additional security issues were they an EU country. For starters the refugees from there are getting through Turkey and in to EU countries regardless. And secondly it only would have allowed Turkish citizens the right to move freely within the EU, so it wouldn't have given any additional travel rights to any middle easterners.

And yes, Turkey joining the EU definitely would have changed things. Primarily because the things the EU would have required of Turkey to join would have made them a more democratic country and limited what erdogan could have done (as well as most likely decreasing his and the Turkish people's interest in doing any of that stuff in the first place). Although IIRC them being unwilling to meet EU standards in their government was one of the big problems which was preventing them joining the EU, so it would have been a mistake for the EU to let them in given the circumstances. But if Turkey were willing to change their government situation for membership, then yes it surely would have been a change for the better.



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vivster said:

Both words mean being devoted to your country. The difference is in how you express it. I don't see how this is so hard to grasp. I'm running out of analogies.

Patriotism is inviting people over to show them how awesome your country is.

Nationalism is keeping people away because your country is too awesome to be stepped on by them.

The meaning is defined by how a person acts on his pride.

That's context, it doesn't change the definition ... 



VGPolyglot said:
vivster said:

Yeah, look at those scumbag parents who are actually proud of their kids for being successful. What despicable people not living through their own achievements but that of their kids. Disgusting narcisists I tell ya.

You really need to chill.

Raising a child is much more direct, it's not even comparable to patriotism, which is pride towards a country.

So you never cheered or rooted for any atlethe during the Olympics?



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

dark_gh0st_b0y said:

this is horrible news, I have a feeling that if this keeps building up in Turkey, there's gonna be another coup or a civil war at worst

it's not a coincidence that they are investing primarily in military, and they won't join the EU, not with their current political status anyway and still, they don't wonna give up on the illegally occupied EU ground in Cyprus, which they've been holding for the last 43 years

seems to me that a big part the population has moved forward towards being Westernized in lifestyle, but it seems that there is also a significant number of Turks who are still living in the long past, and there's nothing wrong with nationalism and partiotism, most people love their countries, but there is a difference between loving your country and hating every other country

Islam is a very peaceful religion, hopefully this is what Erdogan wants to teach in schools, and not this:

That looks like how Trump wants people to see Muslims.



Some days I just blow up.