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Forums - Politics Discussion - Trumpcare will replace Obamacare/ACA

ICStats said:
monocle_layton said:

https://trumpcare.com/

 

Here we go folks, Trumpcare is officially the alternative to the Affordable Care Act (known as Obamacare). Stumbled upon this and thought it'd be worth sharing since we have a decent amount of people on here who are decent with these types of subjects. 

I must admit, I like the simplicity of the website and the overall neutral nature of it. We see what Obamacare offers, and what the new healthcare system will. Not really sure if I will like it or not- it will however be created during the time I start paying health insurance on my own. I guess I'll wait and see. 

 

 

Please no insults or any sly digs trying to generalize and insult entire groups of people (examples would be calling conservatives racist or hillbillies, calling a non-conservative an 'evil liberal' or SJW for no good reason, etc. I'd love to see one thread live without it turning into a war


This is a "Non-Official Website" as it says at the top, and the details of "Trumpcare" are still being debated.

Even though it isn't official, it gives a lot of the details that are confirmed or will probably be. Unavailable information is listed as such.

 

Unless trump and friends do a 180, I see this website being the closest thing to legit 

 



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WolfpackN64 said:
Locknuts said:

Taxation is punishment. It's a gangster shakedown. If you don't pay eventually people with guns are going to come to your house and take you away. If you resist them you could very easily be shot or killed. To me that's quite a punishment - your money or your life. Now that's what I call involuntary.

Also, there are many ways of making money legitimately out there. It's not like there is one factory owner in the whole of the USA and if you don't take 5c an hour to buy your family a bag of wheat every month you are going to starve to death. People actually compete for good workers. If you're good with money, live in a country like the US and work hard, it would be almost impossible to be poor.

The problem is not that some people are rich, it's that some people are poor. But the solution is not to steal from the rich and give it to the poor.

That's a very strange way to look at taxation. We all pay for the roads, schools, and services we all use. That's why we have taxation. If no one pays his taxes, you have no state and you have anarchy.

Taxing the rich more isn't theft. There is a point when people just have enough means, the only right thing to do is distribute the surplusses to where they can be used to make sure everyone can lead a good life. There is a real problem when some people think they can never have enough and sink ever deeper in the mortal sin that is greed.

It's an honest way to look at taxation. Specifically federal income tax. 

An income is required to sustain life in today's societies. If you are taking someone's income without their permission then you are stealing their labour from them and if you take it to it's logical conclusion (police intervention by court order) then you are stealing at gunpoint.

So the question needs to be asked: 'What is worth stealing from somebody at gunpoint?'

'Roads, schools and services'? I don't think so.

Military and police? - Maybe.

If you want the rich to pay for roads and public health then they should be funded by state Goods and Services taxes. These are paid primarily by the rich because GST should not be applied to anything required to sustain life (drinking water, food staples etc) so poor people don't pay them nearly as much as the rich. But anything else is taxed at say 10 - 15% (it's 10% in Australia but we also have federal income tax). Also, unlike federal income tax, a fancy accountant can't get you out of paying GST as it's charged at the point of purchase and we are moving away from paying with cash, so everything can be tracked. 

There are ways to make the rich pay their fair share without stealing it - via incentives and tapping into their egos and ultra competitive spirits. Tax their new iphones, Ferraris etc. 



SamuelRSmith said:

Notice that the cost of healthcare per citizen varies quite a bit between the states, and there's a strong link between the state's obesity level, and their healthcare costs.

There is more to it than that of course.

Part of an effective healthcare system is education... Because if your patients don't need to go to a hostpital, then they won't cost you money.
Australia for example has had very successfull anti-smoking and obesity campaigns over the years, which does reduce rates.

The USA's healthcare system is bloated, slow, costly and inefficient compared to OECD nations and doesn't react fast enough.

Also... The European average is 3.18 Physicians per 1,000 people where-as the USA is  just 2.2 per 1,000 people. That's roughly a 40% increase the amount of doctors available, that also tends to help... Yet you still end up paying almost twice the amount of money as the OECD average.


LadyJasmine said:
If the USA stopped spending on defense it would cease to be the worlds superpower.

It's going to stop being the worlds super power. It's a matter of when, not if. No empire has remained on top indefinitely.

Wiibaron said:
I would like a system where if you don't need it, you don't have to pay for other people who do need it. I like the idea of single payer, but that won't work because we have way too many people who won't be paying their share. It's is not my fault or problem if someone else is sickly. And there are way too many people who are sickly due to their own choices.

The thing with health is that... Health issues can arrise at any time during your life.
Tomorrow you could have a car accident and end up paralyzed unable to walk for the rest of your life. - Should you be denied help because you didn't pay a single cent as you spent your entire life telling everyone you didn't require it?

The best healthcare systems across the planet, in terms of overall costs, effictiveness and quality... Are those where everyone contributes to the health system for the benefit of everyone... Because *Everyone* at some point will need to use the health system in some capacity.

JRPGfan said:
LadyJasmine said:
If the USA stopped spending on defense it would cease to be the worlds superpower.

When you spend like 10 times as much as anyone else... nah.

Even if you cut it in half or more, US would still be a superpower.

Also that isnt even needed to get a working health care system in place.

The US already spends enough on health, you guys just dont use money well.

You don't need to cut military spending for a better healthcare system.
More money isn't actually the answer, the USA already spends almost twice as much as the average OECD nation per capita.

It needs it's health system overhauled, made more efficient, more effictive... And get rid of all the stupid middlemen with their hands out asking for money.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

You read it here first, 6 to 10 million people will lose their health insurance coverage under Trumpcare, and that's a soft estimate. Good to know the GOP is willing to literally let people die just so the top 1% can get a 200,000 tax cut.

This should be their new slogan:

"Trumpcare: When you think we care about you... but we don't."

They don't even TRY to hide it, anymore.



KManX89 said:

You read it here first, 6 to 10 million people will lose their health insurance coverage under Trumpcare, and that's a soft estimate. Good to know the GOP is willing to literally let people die just so the top 1% can get a 200,000 tax cut.

This should be their new slogan:

"Trumpcare: When you think we care about you... but we don't."

They don't even TRY to hide it, anymore.

Why should they hide it? They got elected with that mandate.
Not saying it's right... But it is what it is, sadly.

Whatever happens under Trump you are going to have to put up with it... The real test will come with the next election, hopefully people vote appropriately and get rid of him.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

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Pemalite said:
KManX89 said:

You read it here first, 6 to 10 million people will lose their health insurance coverage under Trumpcare, and that's a soft estimate. Good to know the GOP is willing to literally let people die just so the top 1% can get a 200,000 tax cut.

This should be their new slogan:

"Trumpcare: When you think we care about you... but we don't."

They don't even TRY to hide it, anymore.

Why should they hide it? They got elected with that mandate.
Not saying it's right... But it is what it is, sadly.

Whatever happens under Trump you are going to have to put up with it... The real test will come with the next election, hopefully people vote appropriately and get rid of him.

Except more people voted for Hillary, last I checked. They don't have no mandate. They use that word, but they don't know what it means. Clearly.

Oh, and the nonpartisan CBO just released their report, and it's actually much worse than that. They're saying that up to 24 million insured Americans will lose their coverage under this new proposed health care law. Yikes.

It gets worse, though: the average premiums will go up by 20% in its first 2 years (ouch), and Medicare and Medicaid will be cut by $880 billion, the opposite of what Trump promised earlier. Oh, but it's all good because the top 1% get to keep $200,000! 

Don the Con strikes again, and the saddest part is: I'm not the least bit surprised, I knew this would happen, the Republicans don't give a damn about anybody but the richest Americans, it's not rocket science, but of course, retards keep falling for it and this is the end result. Almost makes me feel bad for them. Almost.