By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - Trump revokes Obama guidelines on transgender bathrooms

Pemalite said:
Locknuts said:

Right, and neither should transgender people mind going into the bathroom that matches their sex. Although if I did see you or any other man appear to follow my girls into a girls bathroom without any apparent reason, we would have words at the very least.

And I would kindly tell you to piss off as it's none of your business.

But I have used the lady's room because the mens was full or there was no toilet paper, it was filthy or I had a friends child with me... And I have had the reverse happen where women have come into the mens room.
Being a smaller town though, you tend to get away with such things.

Transgenders should use the bathroom with the sex they identify with. How they were born is ultimately irrelevant and none of our business unless you are proposing we check what is between everyone's legs? (But then aren't we overstepping the right to freedom of privacy? ;) )

You could tell me to piss off, but it would be a very uncomfortable experience for you.

If someone looks like a woman I'm not going to question them entering the women's toilets obviously.

I'm talking about a situation where a male person exploits people's fear of being offensive by saying he identifies as a woman if questioned while following little girls into toilets. People should never fear speaking up if something doesn't look right, and when it comes to protecting your family, their safety will always come before other people's feelings.

I'm not sure how many fathers there are on Vgchartz but protecting your family consumes an awful lot of your energy. The thought of anything happening to them is unthinkable, so every scenario needs to be considered. There are some very bad people in the world and this just seems like another loophole for them to use to hurt others.

The feelings of transgender people don't even rate. 



Around the Network
Locknuts said:

You could tell me to piss off, but it would be a very uncomfortable experience for you.


Not at all. You assume I actually care what other people think... When in actual reality. I really really don't.
I don't care what people think on vgchartz, I don't care what people think in real life, if you hadn't noticed I am rather blunt.

Locknuts said:

I'm talking about a situation where a male person exploits people's fear of being offensive by saying he identifies as a woman if questioned while following little girls into toilets. People should never fear speaking up if something doesn't look right, and when it comes to protecting your family, their safety will always come before other people's feelings.



There is absolutely nothing stopping a man from following a boy into the males toilet. - Do you question all men that enter the males restroom as well? No? Then you have double standards.

Fact of the matter is... Transgender people have always gone to the toilet with the gender they identify as, lets not change that because of some far-off guilty-before-proven-innocent idea has you worried.

Locknuts said:

I'm not sure how many fathers there are on Vgchartz but protecting your family consumes an awful lot of your energy.

I don't doubt that.

Locknuts said:

The thought of anything happening to them is unthinkable, so every scenario needs to be considered. There are some very bad people in the world and this just seems like another loophole for them to use to hurt others. The feelings of transgender people don't even rate.

Your children are not my problem. They are your problem, they are your responsibility. - You should learn to look after them, take them to the toilets yourself if you are that worried about other people... But don't assume I have to do/change anything different because of your children, I am an Adult and I will do what I like within the confines of the law.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
NewGuy said:

Not sure what your point is. He is a man, so I would share the bathroom with the creep. I would much rather he share the bathroom with  me than my daughter, would you not?

I think you might be confused. He is transgender. Born a female. He would be forced to use Bathrooms with women.

It is confusing, and it is creepy and I wouldn't want my daughter going to the bathroom with a woman who thinks she is a man and looks like a man, but yeah, I would rather she shares a bathroom with her than with this dude who thinks he is a 6 year old girl. The latter actually has a real penis. Which one would you rather your daughter share the bathroom with?

 



NewGuy said:
Pemalite said:

I think you might be confused. He is transgender. Born a female. He would be forced to use Bathrooms with women.

It is confusing, and it is creepy and I wouldn't want my daughter going to the bathroom with a woman who thinks she is a man and looks like a man, but yeah, I would rather she shares a bathroom with her than with this dude who thinks he is a 6 year old girl. The latter actually has a real penis. Which one would you rather your daughter share the bathroom with?

 

It's not creepy. Most trans people you wouldn't even know they were trans to begin with, which is the very crux of the issue.

I wouldn't let my child into a public bathroom with strangers without me accompanying them anyway. So it's irrelevant.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:

Ever heard of the saying... "Walks like a duck, talks like a duck, it probably is a duck?" That applys to Trans people. A female to male trans person who walks like a man, talks like a man, is a man.

So you believe that when it comes to trans people (and accordingly, the Gretchenfrage of "Which toilet/changing room/shower room should they go to?"), we should apply the "duck test" = abductive reasoning.

Since the "duck test" suggests determining an object's (sexual or whatever) identity by their observable characteristics, you must obviously be against Obama's policy of trans people simply deciding for themselves which toilet they go to. (because, after all, the "duck test" does not say "If it believes to look like a duck, swim like a duck, and quack like a duck, then it probably is a duck.") Correct?

 

Now that you mention the "duck test", I'm starting to realize that you are actually indeed touching the very core of this whole transgender-toilet-issue:

The whole problem is ultimately about the "rubbish transvestites" (as the BBC comedy programme "Little Britain" sometimes called the characters Emily and Florence), who fail to pass the sex "duck test" in the eyes of their fellow human beings.

A trans person who mimics the characteristics (looks, behaviour etc.) of the opposite sex so perfectly that everybody believes them to actually be of the opposite sex is ultimately a non-issue: If he/she walks into a public toilet for the opposite sex than he was born with, enters a toilet cubicle, does his business and leaves again, nobody will even care - because they passed the "duck test" so perfectly that nobody even became suspicious and thus felt uncomfortable about someone from the opposite sex entering an intimate zone reserved for his own sex.

The whole problem only exists if a trans person fails to pass the "duck test"; i.e. if, in the eyes of the other people in the toilet/changing room/shower room, he does not "look like a man/woman, swim like a man/woman, and quack like a man/woman" (to stick with the duck test meme), and thus start to feel uncomfortable.

So, maybe, the solution is indeed to decide the question of which public toilet/changing room/shower room a trans person should go to by a "duck test":  Trans people who want to use a different toilet/changing room/shower room than for the sex they were born with get judged by a kind of neutral jury who performs a "duck test" and guesses what sex/gender the person is of. If the jury members believe the person to be of the opposite sex than he was born with, he is allowed to use the public toilets reserved for that sex.



Around the Network
NewGuy said:
KManX89 said:

Instead, you'd rather they share a bathroom with somebody like this: 

Got it. 

Not sure what your point is. He is a man, so I would share the bathroom with the creep. I would much rather he share the bathroom with  me than my daughter, would you not?

Wrong, if you had you way, he'd have to use the LADIES room! That's a trans man. 



Pemalite said:
NewGuy said:

It is confusing, and it is creepy and I wouldn't want my daughter going to the bathroom with a woman who thinks she is a man and looks like a man, but yeah, I would rather she shares a bathroom with her than with this dude who thinks he is a 6 year old girl. The latter actually has a real penis. Which one would you rather your daughter share the bathroom with?

 

It's not creepy. Most trans people you wouldn't even know they were trans to begin with, which is the very crux of the issue.

I wouldn't let my child into a public bathroom with strangers without me accompanying them anyway. So it's irrelevant.

I will give you that most of the ones who go out of their way to look like the opposite sex would be able to walk in a bathroom and no one would bat an eye. 

Let me rephrase my question here, would you feel comfortable if the latter person I posted walked in the girls bathroom if your wife/sister was in there with your daughter? And you saw said person walking in? I mean that's what you are saying you are okay with.



KManX89 said:
NewGuy said:

Not sure what your point is. He is a man, so I would share the bathroom with the creep. I would much rather he share the bathroom with  me than my daughter, would you not?

Wrong, if you had you way, he'd have to use the LADIES room! That's a trans man. 

If you had just continued reading the thread...



NewGuy said:
Pemalite said:

It's not creepy. Most trans people you wouldn't even know they were trans to begin with, which is the very crux of the issue.

I wouldn't let my child into a public bathroom with strangers without me accompanying them anyway. So it's irrelevant.

I will give you that most of the ones who go out of their way to look like the opposite sex would be able to walk in a bathroom and no one would bat an eye. 

Let me rephrase my question here, would you feel comfortable if the latter person I posted walked in the girls bathroom if your wife/sister was in there with your daughter? And you saw said person walking in? I mean that's what you are saying you are okay with.

You make it sound as if toilets are some massive crime syndicate that is full of abusers, drugs addicts and rapists... When really, everyone who goes in there just wants to take a dump.

But yes. I would be fine with it.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Ka-pi96 said:
VGPolyglot said:

And if pedophiles really want to do that they already can. If they're that desperate, they're going to go in there and molest a girl whether it's their designated bathroom or not. They'd probably also molest little boys in the men's bathroom too, so it'd happen either way. It seems that your main goal is to associate transsexuals with pedophiles.

There's still a difference there. Let's say some other guy sees the guy trying to go in to the womens toilet right after a little girls goes in.  He thinks "fucking paedo!" and beats the shit out of the guy.

With a "people go in to the bathroom that their fits their physical gender" law then there's like a 99% chance that that guy actually was a paedo and the guy saved the little girl and is a hero.

With a "people can go in whatever bathroom they feel more comfortable in" law then it may have been a paedo, it may not have been, either way the guy's going to jail for assault, even though he may have just beat up someone that fully deserved it.

He'd probably get arrested no matter which bathroom the guy was in. The police prefer to have as much of a monopoly as they can, and only allow violence in very limited cases. If a guy beats someone else up for going into the opposite gender's bathroom, he's probably going to get in trouble.