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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Same Old Nintendo - KindaFunnyGames

Hynad said:
pokoko said:

It's always going to be the same on forums.  People go after the person when they're unable to form a solid argument about the content.

"But ... but he was wrong once before! (posts link)."  Yeah, and I'm pretty sure everyone else has been wrong before, too.  How many people said the Wii U would be a success?  That Xbox would win this generation?  That the 3DS would never recover from that bad start?  I guess we shouldn't consider the arguments of anyone else again, ever, including ourselves?  I bet if they agreed with him they wouldn't be bringing up his past mistakes.

Glass houses, etc.

Prople aren't going to endlessly repeat all their rebutals everytime a naysayer say something. This isn't a full time paid job after all. Look around the forums. There's plenty of threads in which you'll find arguments and positions countering Colin's diatribes.

So instead they post in a different thread in a way that hurts their own credibility?  Not the smartest solution.  

I don't mind someone going after a media person for pattern behavior that is relevant to the topic at hand but "he was wrong about this other thing lol" is not a good look.  

And, no, if they can't be bothered to make an actual argument when they post in the thread I'm reading, I'm certainly not going to go hunt the forums to see if they made an argument somewhere else.



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pokoko said:
Hynad said:

Prople aren't going to endlessly repeat all their rebutals everytime a naysayer say something. This isn't a full time paid job after all. Look around the forums. There's plenty of threads in which you'll find arguments and positions countering Colin's diatribes.

So instead they post in a different thread in a way that hurts their own credibility?  Not the smartest solution.  

I don't mind someone going after a media person for pattern behavior that is relevant to the topic at hand but "he was wrong about this other thing lol" is not a good look.  

And, no, if they can't be bothered to make an actual argument when they post in the thread I'm reading, I'm certainly not going to go hunt the forums to see if they made an argument somewhere else.

Let me point out that you are doing the same here. Only the target is different.



pokoko said:
KLXVER said:

You shouldn't just try and remove his credibility when you cant come up with an argument for why he is wrong.

It's always going to be the same on forums.  People go after the person when they're unable to form a solid argument about the content.

"But ... but he was wrong once before! (posts link)."  Yeah, and I'm pretty sure everyone else has been wrong before, too.  How many people said the Wii U would be a success?  That Xbox would win this generation?  That the 3DS would never recover from that bad start?  I guess we shouldn't consider the arguments of anyone else again, ever, including ourselves?  I bet if they agreed with him they wouldn't be bringing up his past mistakes.

Glass houses, etc.

To be fair, he didn't make a solid argument for why he was correct. He basically made some predictions, so his history on doing so should be mentioned. Nintendo clearly didn't do what he wanted, but that hardly puts them in a bad position. 



Hynad said:
pokoko said:

So instead they post in a different thread in a way that hurts their own credibility?  Not the smartest solution.  

I don't mind someone going after a media person for pattern behavior that is relevant to the topic at hand but "he was wrong about this other thing lol" is not a good look.  

And, no, if they can't be bothered to make an actual argument when they post in the thread I'm reading, I'm certainly not going to go hunt the forums to see if they made an argument somewhere else.

Let me point out that you are doing the same here. Only the target is different.

That makes no sense whatsoever.  I made my argument in my very first post in this thread.



 

BeatdownBrigade said:

Posted pages ago about only seeing people attacking the messenger and not the message, and that has proceeded to remain the case. In my experience if an argument is flimsy its easy to attack the argument. But when you have to resort to attacking the person in many cases it means you cannot fight their argument so you seek to discredit them.

Been seeing this type of behavior a lot since the Switch reveal and I think it speaks to the issues Nintendo has, and their new console specifically has. If you like the portability factor and think this concept is perfect for you that is fine. The concept behind the hardware is fine. Its many of these other factors that I don't know how as a consumer you put up with, or even defend.

Switch is not the first console to have some negative perceptions at its reveal. Just thinking back in recent history like the PS3 and Xbox One are notable cases of a bad first step. But in those cases consumers and fans of the respective companies fought back and heavily criticized certain stances and policies. In response there was a number of changes taken by Sony and more recently Microsoft that has benefited consumers.

On the flip side, I just see so many fans of Nintendo just bunker down and defend some obviously bad consumer practices. Not being a platform for third party support, their online offering for one 20-30 year old game being taken away at the end of the month, expensive accessory prices, including a non-charging grip in with the console, Gearbox saying they wanted to discuss a game like Borderlands 3 to Switch but Nintendo basically stopped communicating with them, voice-chat being done on an app and not native when competitors had it native 15 years ago, not telling what they plan to charge for online before the console launch, and coming out saying Zelda is the very last supported Wii U game when just over a year ago Iwata said,

"When NX is launched, there already will be a certain volume of Nintendo 3DS and Wii U hardware widely existing in the market, so from a software business perspective, it would be highly inefficient to stop releasing titles for Nintendo 3DS or Wii U right after the launch of NX,"

How about the pretty bare launch window. I mean most consoles don't have huge robust launches historically, but many tend to have third party annual release games that help fill some space. But also most companies had a console they previously supported up until the launch of the new one. Often times supporting it for some time afterwards. Nintendo has stopped pretty much all meaningful development on the Wii U for almost 2 years now and still have such an empty launch window!?

These are just a few of many legitimate complaints that have nothing to do with what you think of the hardware vision (maybe slightly as power is a major reason for the lack of third-party, but there are plenty of third party options at that power range but they have poor relationships with many devs it appears). Where are the fans who sure love the console and Nintendo games, but also want to rightfully push back on some of these obviously bullsh*t things to better the company and the product? Otherwise the company is just gonna keep walking over consumers that accept less as okay.

^^This, couldn't have said it better.



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CaptainExplosion said:
Pavolink said:

His video was good on paper but badly executed. No, not bad, terrible. Overreaction the vid.

People only hit the like button because it gave them someone to laugh at.

Hey man, whatever makes you feel better. He thought the Vita was a good piece of hardware in 2011 tho. 



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

pokoko said:
Hynad said:

Let me point out that you are doing the same here. Only the target is different.

That makes no sense whatsoever.  I made my argument in my very first post in this thread.

And then you started complaining about people.



BeatdownBrigade said:

Posted pages ago about only seeing people attacking the messenger and not the message, and that has proceeded to remain the case. In my experience if an argument is flimsy its easy to attack the argument. But when you have to resort to attacking the person in many cases it means you cannot fight their argument so you seek to discredit them.

Been seeing this type of behavior a lot since the Switch reveal and I think it speaks to the issues Nintendo has, and their new console specifically has. If you like the portability factor and think this concept is perfect for you that is fine. The concept behind the hardware is fine. Its many of these other factors that I don't know how as a consumer you put up with, or even defend.

Switch is not the first console to have some negative perceptions at its reveal. Just thinking back in recent history like the PS3 and Xbox One are notable cases of a bad first step. But in those cases consumers and fans of the respective companies fought back and heavily criticized certain stances and policies. In response there was a number of changes taken by Sony and more recently Microsoft that has benefited consumers.

On the flip side, I just see so many fans of Nintendo just bunker down and defend some obviously bad consumer practices. Not being a platform for third party support, their online offering for one 20-30 year old game being taken away at the end of the month, expensive accessory prices, including a non-charging grip in with the console, Gearbox saying they wanted to discuss a game like Borderlands 3 to Switch but Nintendo basically stopped communicating with them, voice-chat being done on an app and not native when competitors had it native 15 years ago, not telling what they plan to charge for online before the console launch, and coming out saying Zelda is the very last supported Wii U game when just over a year ago Iwata said,

"When NX is launched, there already will be a certain volume of Nintendo 3DS and Wii U hardware widely existing in the market, so from a software business perspective, it would be highly inefficient to stop releasing titles for Nintendo 3DS or Wii U right after the launch of NX,"

How about the pretty bare launch window. I mean most consoles don't have huge robust launches historically, but many tend to have third party annual release games that help fill some space. But also most companies had a console they previously supported up until the launch of the new one. Often times supporting it for some time afterwards. Nintendo has stopped pretty much all meaningful development on the Wii U for almost 2 years now and still have such an empty launch window!?

These are just a few of many legitimate complaints that have nothing to do with what you think of the hardware vision (maybe slightly as power is a major reason for the lack of third-party, but there are plenty of third party options at that power range but they have poor relationships with many devs it appears). Where are the fans who sure love the console and Nintendo games, but also want to rightfully push back on some of these obviously bullsh*t things to better the company and the product? Otherwise the company is just gonna keep walking over consumers that accept less as okay.

There are legitimate concerns, but I really don't see what's the problem with chat on mobile? This is something where Nintendo excels it's competition.

Not sure though if 3rd party support is really a concern either if the industry AAA games aren't coming to Switch.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

bdbdbd said:

There are legitimate concerns, but I really don't see what's the problem with chat on mobile? This is something where Nintendo excels it's competition.

Not sure though if 3rd party support is really a concern either if the industry AAA games aren't coming to Switch.

I think it's a great idea as an additional option to chat with friends and coordinate with each other. I don't like that it's the only option for it. Less options isn't excelling. I do hope they allow for sometime of OS integrated party solution.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

People chat on mobile already because the Wii U online setup is terrible. Being told that we now have to pay for that is unsettling to say the least. I'll wait for more details to come out but if Nintendo makes a Skype app and thinks that solves all our problems....I'll silently shake my head.