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Forums - Politics Discussion - Chancellor Merkel keeps open-gate policy, outrage breaks out

CaptainExplosion said:
hershel_layton said:

I'm with you on that opinion.

 

Too many people act as though it's a very easy decision. It's not. It'll have an impact on many people for the generations to come.

 

I just hate how Saudi Arabia won't even accept any of them. Shows how disgusting of a country Saudi Arabia is. To think they won't even help their own fellow brothers and sisters. 

 

besides, the migrants would be accustomed to Saudi Arabia's laws much quicker if you think about it. They follow Islam, many Syrian refugees/immigrants do as well, easy transition

Then if Saudia Arabia gets thrown into terrorism and chaos let's not bat an eye.

Why would Saudi Arabia experience issues?

There's a reason why you don't hear about shooting or bombings frequently in Saudi Arabia- it's already run by Shariah. Practically everyone follows Islam. I'd say it's the most religious country you can get in this generation.

 



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

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setsunatenshi said:
sure, take the refugees, but at the very least take the landmass of Syria too. At least there will be a long term solution to place back the refugees once the conflict is over.

yes, it's simplistic, but it seems like a pro active solution to all this mess.

The Syrians tried to take Syria back from Al-Assad- it lead to the Syrian war.

 

I don't see how we can possibly take Syria without causing even MORE issues.



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

OdinHades said:

I'm with Merkel on this one. Damn right the refugees come with problems. It costs a ton of money, it asks for a lot from german citizens and it will continue to bring problems for decades to come. But I for once do not want to be remembered by future generations as an asshole who doesn't care about other people. The sacrifices we have to make are little in the big picture. All day long people here are yelling about how they would love to help people who live under bad conditions but they are just not able to. Then they pay their 5 € a month to save the children and feel like a better human. Now, right now, when they actually have the chance to do something, they do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Instead, they want people out of their country, they are afraid they couldn't be as rich as they are tomorrow and whatnot. Nationalism on the rise because of fear and hate. It makes me sick.

Ok, that's just some people, I also know many guys and lads who are doing everything they can. We are helping out in a local refugee camp. We don't get paid, we do it just to help these people. There are 12 families here form Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq. All good people, my son loves to play with the other children. We help them maintain their houses, explain them how everything works in germany (the waste seperation is a real problem for them ^^), we translate their documents and really do all we can to help them integrate. But then we also get up in the middle of the night to fight some goddamn nazis who are throwing rocks at the camp for no reason at all. They don't know these people, they just hate them for no reason at all. It makes me so fucking sick.

Anyway, people are fast with prejudices. Of course there are bound to be some assholes in such a big refugee crisis, but I am absolutely convinced that the majority really needs help. Countless refugees told me how they didn't want to leave their country but they had no choice. They are also not uneducated as you hear it from certain groups. In our refugee camps, there is a high school teacher, a doctor and even a physics professor! All they need to do is learn our language and they could help our economy in a great way. Germany is dying for educated workers for crying out loud!

I beg you, if you want to make any judge in this topic, first go out there and really deal with what's up. Talk to the people, see for yourself how "bad" they really are. Don't just jump to conclusions because of overdramatized stories in the news. Don't judge a whole group if people just because two or three assholes decided to go postal. It's not fair in any way.

These people have nowhere else to go. It's not our duty to help them, but it is a big fat giant test of history. Think very closely about how you and your generation should be remembered in future history books. That's all I have to say.

Just because they say something it doesn't mean it's true. How naive can a human be?

It's only the strong who are able to come to Europe. These people don't flee for their lives, they come to improve their lives. All the weak, the real refugees, are left behind (not that these should be allowed into Europe either, no. They can be helped at site, at the refugee camps. It's not a human right to become a citizen of Europe).

And really, you are surprised that some of them are highly educated? But it's because it's the strong and resourceful people who are able to come to Europe! The poor and uneducated are left behind.

I am totally against helping any of these people who cross our borders. By receiving these people we are changing our society forever and there's nothing to turn it back. In some European cities, native people are already a minority in their own country. I don't want to live in a multicultural chaos.



I do find it ironic that the US is criticized so heavily by Europe for being the policeman of the world sometimes. Now, those same people are calling for their government to bend over where they have no real obligation to.

My position in all of this is that something has to be done to help people fleeing from war, but taking in so many economic migrants is not wise. It has long running consequences that I don't think people consider. Doing what feels right at the time may end up being worse for your country.



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Slimebeast said:

Just because they say something it doesn't mean it's true. How naive can a human be?

It's only the strong who are able to come to Europe. These people don't flee for their lives, they come to improve their lives. All the weak, the real refugees, are left behind (not that these should be allowed into Europe either, no. They can be helped at site, at the refugee camps. It's not a human right to become a citizen of Europe).

And really, you are surprised that some of them are highly educated? But it's because it's the strong and resourceful people who are able to come to Europe! The poor and uneducated are left behind.

I am totally against helping any of these people who cross our borders. By receiving these people we are changing our society forever and there's nothing to turn it back. In some European cities, native people are already a minority in their own country. I don't want to live in a multicultural chaos.

Welp, I don't know where you are from, but here in germany we prefer to presume innocence until proven otherwise. Not the other way around.

Do you have any sources to back up your claim that only "rich" (the ones I know have basically nothing because they left everything behind, including cars and houses) refugees came to europe?

Society is always changing. You can try to conservate it, but you won't succeed in it. And that isn't even a bad thing. As for that multicultural chaos: You're already living in such a state. Culture is a living thing. It is constantly changing. Culture that doesn't change or doesn't get influenced form the outside only occurs in dead populations. Like the old rome or the old greeks or something. 



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OdinHades said:
Slimebeast said:

Just because they say something it doesn't mean it's true. How naive can a human be?

It's only the strong who are able to come to Europe. These people don't flee for their lives, they come to improve their lives. All the weak, the real refugees, are left behind (not that these should be allowed into Europe either, no. They can be helped at site, at the refugee camps. It's not a human right to become a citizen of Europe).

And really, you are surprised that some of them are highly educated? But it's because it's the strong and resourceful people who are able to come to Europe! The poor and uneducated are left behind.

I am totally against helping any of these people who cross our borders. By receiving these people we are changing our society forever and there's nothing to turn it back. In some European cities, native people are already a minority in their own country. I don't want to live in a multicultural chaos.

Welp, I don't know where you are from, but here in germany we prefer to presume innocence until proven otherwise. Not the other way around.

Do you have any sources to back up your claim that only "rich" (the ones I know have basically nothing because they left everything behind, including cars and houses) refugees came to europe?

Society is always changing. You can try to conservate it, but you won't succeed in it. And that isn't even a bad thing. As for that multicultural chaos: You're already living in such a state. Culture is a living thing. It is constantly changing. Culture that doesn't change or doesn't get influenced form the outside only occurs in dead populations. Like the old rome or the old greeks or something. 

I didn't say that they bring with them riches when they arrive here, but they are the rich and resourceful of their home countries, the strongest 10% of the population that are able to come.

It's all a joke. We're not helping anybody, the only thing we're doing is ruining our own societies.

In almost every damn neighborhood in your country and mine, you have gangs of these very arrogant young immigrant men now, with their disrepectful attitude. None of those belong here. None.

Multiculturalists always give that childish answer, "oh, but culture is always changing". It's such a low level or argumentation it doesn't deserve a reply.



hershel_layton said:
setsunatenshi said:
sure, take the refugees, but at the very least take the landmass of Syria too. At least there will be a long term solution to place back the refugees once the conflict is over.

yes, it's simplistic, but it seems like a pro active solution to all this mess.

The Syrians tried to take Syria back from Al-Assad- it lead to the Syrian war.

 

I don't see how we can possibly take Syria without causing even MORE issues.

I did put it in an over simplistic way, but let's say if there was ever a justification for a land invasion of any middle eastern 'country', this would be it. There was no mass exodus from Afghanistan or Iraq that could justify those 2 absurd invasions.

Now, on the other hand, you have the entire population of a country fleeing to neighboring countries. At some point that has to mean the land is up for grabs. You could bet your ass if they had oil or other natural resources there would have been no short list of candidates to ocupy the place.

In my oppinion it would be better to squash the daesh in there, rather than let their infection spread. Supposedly there has been some military progress, but once some sort of success has been achieved it would be good to return the Syrian citizens to their country, help them rebuild actual schools, not madrassas, and perhaps things could get back to normal.

Yes, it would have costs, but doing nothing will have greater costs in the long run.



setsunatenshi said:
hershel_layton said:

The Syrians tried to take Syria back from Al-Assad- it lead to the Syrian war.

 

I don't see how we can possibly take Syria without causing even MORE issues.

I did put it in an over simplistic way, but let's say if there was ever a justification for a land invasion of any middle eastern 'country', this would be it. There was no mass exodus from Afghanistan or Iraq that could justify those 2 absurd invasions.

Now, on the other hand, you have the entire population of a country fleeing to neighboring countries. At some point that has to mean the land is up for grabs. You could bet your ass if they had oil or other natural resources there would have been no short list of candidates to ocupy the place.

In my oppinion it would be better to squash the daesh in there, rather than let their infection spread. Supposedly there has been some military progress, but once some sort of success has been achieved it would be good to return the Syrian citizens to their country, help them rebuild actual schools, not madrassas, and perhaps things could get back to normal.

Yes, it would have costs, but doing nothing will have greater costs in the long run.

Not entirely sure.

 

A lot of our issues came from constant interference with the middle east. I'm sure our politicians will screw it up and corrupt Syria.

 

Your idea is smart. However, humans can be selfish. They may take the resources and just ignore the people who need help. you never know.



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

outlawauron said:

I do find it ironic that the US is criticized so heavily by Europe for being the policeman of the world sometimes. Now, those same people are calling for their government to bend over where they have no real obligation to.

My position in all of this is that something has to be done to help people fleeing from war, but taking in so many economic migrants is not wise. It has long running consequences that I don't think people consider. Doing what feels right at the time may end up being worse for your country.

I find it ironic that the US decides to pretend there are WMD's in Iraq, invade and kill off the leadership of that country unprovoked, and when all hell breaks loose, refuse to take any refugees, while Europe, Turkey and a few others have to foot the bill.

That's what I find ironic really.



OdinHades said:
Slimebeast said:

Just because they say something it doesn't mean it's true. How naive can a human be?

It's only the strong who are able to come to Europe. These people don't flee for their lives, they come to improve their lives. All the weak, the real refugees, are left behind (not that these should be allowed into Europe either, no. They can be helped at site, at the refugee camps. It's not a human right to become a citizen of Europe).

And really, you are surprised that some of them are highly educated? But it's because it's the strong and resourceful people who are able to come to Europe! The poor and uneducated are left behind.

I am totally against helping any of these people who cross our borders. By receiving these people we are changing our society forever and there's nothing to turn it back. In some European cities, native people are already a minority in their own country. I don't want to live in a multicultural chaos.

Welp, I don't know where you are from, but here in germany we prefer to presume innocence until proven otherwise. Not the other way around.

Do you have any sources to back up your claim that only "rich" (the ones I know have basically nothing because they left everything behind, including cars and houses) refugees came to europe?

Society is always changing. You can try to conservate it, but you won't succeed in it. And that isn't even a bad thing. As for that multicultural chaos: You're already living in such a state. Culture is a living thing. It is constantly changing. Culture that doesn't change or doesn't get influenced form the outside only occurs in dead populations. Like the old rome or the old greeks or something. 

Sorry, but from what I know, most Germans like to treat foreigners like shit (I was certainly given that impression when I went there). They're very nationalistic from what I can tell, and I don't see that as wrong. But forcing Germany to change its culture for the sake of others is arrogant and downright unfair. Slimebeast has a point, it isn't Europe's reponsibility to take in these people, but rather the countries that haven't bothered at all (the gulf nations). And while culture does change, what we're seeing is a gradual shift to radical Islam throughout western Europe. This isn't a good cultural change, and people who can't see this in hindsight deserve what is coming to them.



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