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Forums - Politics Discussion - Chancellor Merkel keeps open-gate policy, outrage breaks out

Teeqoz said:
LurkerJ said:

Ugh, how do you want them to get work done if they are too "fresh"? They have to learn the language first, every employer everywhere demands the applicants to speak the language that's dominant in the work environment. 

You won't have such issues if god forbids, the rich Arabic countries that invest heavily in the destruction of Syria, take these refugees instead. Foreigners make up more than 30% of Saudi Arabia population, 10 millions, all them are there to work in the private sector because the private sector doesn't prefer unfit and lazy local workers. Saudi Arabia doesn't even allow the private sector to bring in Syrian professionals anymore, and yet, Europe is demanded to do more towards people who need a lot of time before being a productive part of the society. Certainly a lot more time than they would've needed in Saudi and Qatar.

That's not true. Where I work, we have multiple Poles that don't speak Norwegian, and the one I work with the most, a Bulgarian woman, is perfectly capable of making herself understood, but with a broken accent. She's still a better worker than probably any one else that work here.

 

You don't learn a language by sitting on a school bench. You learn it by using it in day to day situations. Except they never are in those say to day situations because they aren't allowed to work before they get their apllication approved (regardless of how well they speak the language), and they also don't have circle of non-refugee friends because like I said, the workplace is the average person's most important social arena.

 

We've also had a Belgian exchange student who lived with us for a year (we were the host family), do you think he learnt Norwegian by taking those two classes each week? No, it's because he was placed in a classroom with no choice but to learn. Bam, two weeks and he knows enough Norwegian to get by, and the learning only goes exponentially further upwards after that.

 

If we are able to get these refugees into the work force so that they can contribute to the value creation in the west, they'll be an immense resource, especially because the part of our population that are elderly is exploding (look at Japan. That's where every western country will be in a decade.)

I agree that learning a language requires more than sitting on a school bench. I am not sure shoving unprepared individuals into the work space is the best way to do it.

I don't know what you do for a living. English is not my native language, and I am always asked to provide evidence of English fluency whenever I apply to work in an English speaking country. 



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Her country will feel the impact and it won't be pleasant.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

These threads are really useful for identifying people I must avoid.



 

The PS5 Exists. 


Xbrah said:
Almost 2 weeks ago they had to scrape nearly 10 children off the pavement in Nice... After one of these poor immigrants decided he would kill nearly a hundred people. If ever Germany needed concentration camps....

300 000 - 500 000 people are estimated to have died in the syrian civil war. 13.5 million civilians had to leave their home behind to flee the violence. Is it criminal to want ot help these people out? Is it right to deny them aid, because less than 0.1 % of the individuals have commited some crime? (Nice was not, by the way, commited by a refugee, but someone of earlier immigration.)



Bet with PeH: 

I win if Arms sells over 700 000 units worldwide by the end of 2017.

Bet with WagnerPaiva:

 

I win if Emmanuel Macron wins the french presidential election May 7th 2017.

sure, take the refugees, but at the very least take the landmass of Syria too. At least there will be a long term solution to place back the refugees once the conflict is over.

yes, it's simplistic, but it seems like a pro active solution to all this mess.



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LurkerJ said:
Teeqoz said:

That's not true. Where I work, we have multiple Poles that don't speak Norwegian, and the one I work with the most, a Bulgarian woman, is perfectly capable of making herself understood, but with a broken accent. She's still a better worker than probably any one else that work here.

 

You don't learn a language by sitting on a school bench. You learn it by using it in day to day situations. Except they never are in those say to day situations because they aren't allowed to work before they get their apllication approved (regardless of how well they speak the language), and they also don't have circle of non-refugee friends because like I said, the workplace is the average person's most important social arena.

 

We've also had a Belgian exchange student who lived with us for a year (we were the host family), do you think he learnt Norwegian by taking those two classes each week? No, it's because he was placed in a classroom with no choice but to learn. Bam, two weeks and he knows enough Norwegian to get by, and the learning only goes exponentially further upwards after that.

 

If we are able to get these refugees into the work force so that they can contribute to the value creation in the west, they'll be an immense resource, especially because the part of our population that are elderly is exploding (look at Japan. That's where every western country will be in a decade.)

I agree that learning a language requires more than sitting on a school bench. I am not sure shoving unprepared individuals into the work space is the best way to do it.

I don't know what you do for a living. English is not my native language, and I am always asked to provide evidence of English fluency whenever I apply to work in an English speaking country. 

I'm not saying that you shove unprepared individuals into work. They obviously need the qualifications required to do the job. The thing is though, even in non-english speaking countries, speaking english is enough to get by (at least in Norway, but I have heard that we are supposedly above average. Don't think I know a single person that could at the very least make himself understood in English here). So if the refugees know English to a certain degree, that's certainly sufficient for more physical work (like what I'm doing for my summer job. I repair/make equipment for marine industries, ie. fishing and aquaculture).

 

And it doesn't have to be a big job either, as long as they get something to do, that goes a looooong way in preventing that they just remain unemployed for life once they *do* get the result of their application. Like I've stated multiple times, if you are unemployed for a substantial length of time, the chances that you ever get into the workforce decrease exponentially. So we should make sure that they can do small jobs, like being a waitress/waitor, clean up hotel rooms, anything where you don't need a fluency in the language. It will drastically improve the integration situation and will be a huge benefit in the long run, both economically and otherwise.



Yep, sure... you are fleeing from a conflict zone with your whole family and the nearest safe place for you to take refuge is 2000 miles away crossing dozen countries.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

OdinHades said:

I'm with Merkel on this one. Damn right the refugees come with problems. It costs a ton of money, it asks for a lot from german citizens and it will continue to bring problems for decades to come. But I for once do not want to be remembered by future generations as an asshole who doesn't care about other people. The sacrifices we have to make are little in the big picture. All day long people here are yelling about how they would love to help people who live under bad conditions but they are just not able to. Then they pay their 5 € a month to save the children and feel like a better human. Now, right now, when they actually have the chance to do something, they do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Instead, they want people out of their country, they are afraid they couldn't be as rich as they are tomorrow and whatnot. Nationalism on the rise because of fear and hate. It makes me sick.

Ok, that's just some people, I also know many guys and lads who are doing everything they can. We are helping out in a local refugee camp. We don't get paid, we do it just to help these people. There are 12 families here form Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq. All good people, my son loves to play with the other children. We help them maintain their houses, explain them how everything works in germany (the waste seperation is a real problem for them ^^), we translate their documents and really do all we can to help them integrate. But then we also get up in the middle of the night to fight some goddamn nazis who are throwing rocks at the camp for no reason at all. They don't know these people, they just hate them for no reason at all. It makes me so fucking sick.

Anyway, people are fast with prejudices. Of course there are bound to be some assholes in such a big refugee crisis, but I am absolutely convinced that the majority really needs help. Countless refugees told me how they didn't want to leave their country but they had no choice. They are also not uneducated as you hear it from certain groups. In our refugee camps, there is a high school teacher, a doctor and even a physics professor! All they need to do is learn our language and they could help our economy in a great way. Germany is dying for educated workers for crying out loud!

I beg you, if you want to make any judge in this topic, first go out there and really deal with what's up. Talk to the people, see for yourself how "bad" they really are. Don't just jump to conclusions because of overdramatized stories in the news. Don't judge a whole group if people just because two or three assholes decided to go postal. It's not fair in any way.

These people have nowhere else to go. It's not our duty to help them, but it is a big fat giant test of history. Think very closely about how you and your generation should be remembered in future history books. That's all I have to say.

You sir, are an amazing human being.



naruball said:
OdinHades said:

I'm with Merkel on this one. Damn right the refugees come with problems. It costs a ton of money, it asks for a lot from german citizens and it will continue to bring problems for decades to come. But I for once do not want to be remembered by future generations as an asshole who doesn't care about other people. The sacrifices we have to make are little in the big picture. All day long people here are yelling about how they would love to help people who live under bad conditions but they are just not able to. Then they pay their 5 € a month to save the children and feel like a better human. Now, right now, when they actually have the chance to do something, they do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Instead, they want people out of their country, they are afraid they couldn't be as rich as they are tomorrow and whatnot. Nationalism on the rise because of fear and hate. It makes me sick.

Ok, that's just some people, I also know many guys and lads who are doing everything they can. We are helping out in a local refugee camp. We don't get paid, we do it just to help these people. There are 12 families here form Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq. All good people, my son loves to play with the other children. We help them maintain their houses, explain them how everything works in germany (the waste seperation is a real problem for them ^^), we translate their documents and really do all we can to help them integrate. But then we also get up in the middle of the night to fight some goddamn nazis who are throwing rocks at the camp for no reason at all. They don't know these people, they just hate them for no reason at all. It makes me so fucking sick.

Anyway, people are fast with prejudices. Of course there are bound to be some assholes in such a big refugee crisis, but I am absolutely convinced that the majority really needs help. Countless refugees told me how they didn't want to leave their country but they had no choice. They are also not uneducated as you hear it from certain groups. In our refugee camps, there is a high school teacher, a doctor and even a physics professor! All they need to do is learn our language and they could help our economy in a great way. Germany is dying for educated workers for crying out loud!

I beg you, if you want to make any judge in this topic, first go out there and really deal with what's up. Talk to the people, see for yourself how "bad" they really are. Don't just jump to conclusions because of overdramatized stories in the news. Don't judge a whole group if people just because two or three assholes decided to go postal. It's not fair in any way.

These people have nowhere else to go. It's not our duty to help them, but it is a big fat giant test of history. Think very closely about how you and your generation should be remembered in future history books. That's all I have to say.

Thank God for people like you.

As a christian I'm truly ashamed of my fellow Christians. In my country a bishop said we should only help Christian refeugees. I mean, seriously...

Good to see some good is left in this world.

It sucks that there's so many refugees though. Europe can only support so many people.

 

I hope the leaders give the refugees skills such as building, farming etc etc. Sending them back once the war is over and pumping life into the economy will help Syria stabilize. 



 

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12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.

GribbleGrunger said:
These threads are really useful for identifying people I must avoid.

What do you mean?



 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

12/22/2016- Made a bet with Ganoncrotch that the first 6 months of 2017 will be worse than 2016. A poll will be made to determine the winner. Loser has to take a picture of them imitating their profile picture.