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Forums - General Discussion - 6 police officers shot; 3 dead in Baton Rouge

Um, this is sad but its not sadder than the black lives that are lost everyday both at the hands of police and at the hands of other blacks. This is not more worth of attention because they are cops. So, for folks to say that things are escalating have no clue what they are talking about because when hundreds of unarmed blacks are killed every year by law enforcement, that should have been seen as an escalation to you guys as well. Every day on Facebook, people would post videos of police brutality but it only get serious for you guys when an officer is killed.  This tension has always exsisted but now some people are fighting back in the most grusome and violent way.   Suprised it took this long really.  Real effort must be made to intergrate police into the communities that they are serving better to build trust.  If you don't want to talk about that then you are just pining over dead bodies without regard for the cause. 



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Aeolus451 said:
Rab said:

I don't think it's enough to improve the police, I think it's the whole society we live in, inequality in the USA is one of the highest in the world, the disadvantaged will push back violently if nothing changes, they have nothing to loose any more, it's already all taken away from them

I disagree with that. It's completely false. There's many places in the world where shit is far worse in terms of inequality. India and pakistan are good examples of it. It's just an excuse for most of them here to steal, hurt people and run wild. If this group of people wanted to seriously change things in positive ways for themselves and others, they would go to school to get into careers that influence society or better yet become cops to prove how it's done in a positive way. Violently protesting and hurting others only takes away the clout of their message and gives credence to their opposition's points. Frankly, they're extremely hypocritical about racism as a whole and their issues are overrepresented in comparison to other minorities. A fair number of 'em have a warped sense of entitlement.

BTW India and Pakistan have lower levels of inequality than the US, which ranks near the bottom, look down the last column (lower numbers are better) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_distribution_of_wealth 

 

Open your eyes to reality, try and take off the rose colored glasses first 

From a Stanford University study on inequality in the US http://web.stanford.edu/group/scspi/cgi-bin/facts.php 

- CEOs in 1965 made 24 times more than the average production worker, whereas in 2009 they made 185 times more

- In the United States, 21 percent of all children are in poverty, a poverty rate higher than what prevails in virtually all other rich nations.

- There are 750,000 Americans who are homeless on any given night

- High-school dropout rates are least among whites and highest among Hispanics, while college enrollment rates are least among blacks and highest among whites.

- Only college graduates have experienced growth in median weekly earnings since 1979 (in real terms). High school dropouts have, by contrast, seen their real median weekly earnings decline by about 22 percent.

- Resumes with “white-sounding” names, whether male or female, were much more likely to result in call backs for interviews than were those with “black-sounding” names (even though the resumes were otherwise identical)

- The incarceration rate in the United States has grown so dramatically since the 1970s that the U.S. now has one of the highest rates in the world. The rise in incarceration has been especially prominent among young Black males and high school dropouts.

- In 2007, 8.1 million children under 18 years old were without health insurance. Children in poverty and Hispanic children were more likely to be uninsured.



This whole situation is devolving quickly. We need to put an end to the violence, there is no justification for it.

What Fox News and CNN want us to forget is that most people recognize that police work a very difficult job, and also acknowledge that there is a disparity in how white and black suspects are treated by the police.

It's normal to believe that both "black" and "blue" lives matter. Let's not be drawn apart by the polarization being created by partisan media sources, and by the divisive candidates we have for president.



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Rab said:
Aeolus451 said:

I disagree with that. It's completely false. There's many places in the world where shit is far worse in terms of inequality. India and pakistan are good examples of it. It's just an excuse for most of them here to steal, hurt people and run wild. If this group of people wanted to seriously change things in positive ways for themselves and others, they would go to school to get into careers that influence society or better yet become cops to prove how it's done in a positive way. Violently protesting and hurting others only takes away the clout of their message and gives credence to their opposition's points. Frankly, they're extremely hypocritical about racism as a whole and their issues are overrepresented in comparison to other minorities. A fair number of 'em have a warped sense of entitlement.

BTW India and Pakistan have lower levels of inequality than the US, which ranks near the bottom, look down the last column (lower numbers are better) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_distribution_of_wealth 

 

Open your eyes to reality, try and take off the rose colored glasses first 

From a Stanford University study on inequality in the US http://web.stanford.edu/group/scspi/cgi-bin/facts.php 

- CEOs in 1965 made 24 times more than the average production worker, whereas in 2009 they made 185 times more

- In the United States, 21 percent of all children are in poverty, a poverty rate higher than what prevails in virtually all other rich nations.

- There are 750,000 Americans who are homeless on any given night

- High-school dropout rates are least among whites and highest among Hispanics, while college enrollment rates are least among blacks and highest among whites.

- Only college graduates have experienced growth in median weekly earnings since 1979 (in real terms). High school dropouts have, by contrast, seen their real median weekly earnings decline by about 22 percent.

- Resumes with “white-sounding” names, whether male or female, were much more likely to result in call backs for interviews than were those with “black-sounding” names (even though the resumes were otherwise identical)

- The incarceration rate in the United States has grown so dramatically since the 1970s that the U.S. now has one of the highest rates in the world. The rise in incarceration has been especially prominent among young Black males and high school dropouts.

- In 2007, 8.1 million children under 18 years old were without health insurance. Children in poverty and Hispanic children were more likely to be uninsured.

I'm not talking just about it ust in terms of inequality of wealth but inequality as a whole. 

How does India and Pakistan treat women?

Frankly, I don't care about the poor or homeless. It's their responsibility to go to school, work and provide for themselves. 



SvennoJ said:
There's other similarities I haven't heard anyone over yet. Baton Rouge gun man was former military again (former marine this time), same as in Dallas. Perhaps the military should pay more attention to their veterans?

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/crime/headlines/20160715-soldiers-criticize-army-s-handling-of-dallas-shooter-after-underwear-incident.ece
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2016/07/18/man-named-as-baton-rouge-shooter-was-former-marine-it-was-his-birthday.html

Not much to do about it now. Plenty of ex military who spend time in Iraq knew about Radicals who fucked up the nation and wanted to fuck up the nation especiall al zarqawi(not sure if spelled well) but everyone including analyst who dared to criticize the leaders like Rumsfeld were basically called idiots. Remember how the media were ignored and were called sensation seekers when the first suicide bombs started in IRAQ.  






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Aeolus451 said:
Rab said:

BTW India and Pakistan have lower levels of inequality than the US, which ranks near the bottom, look down the last column (lower numbers are better) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_distribution_of_wealth 

 

Open your eyes to reality, try and take off the rose colored glasses first 

From a Stanford University study on inequality in the US http://web.stanford.edu/group/scspi/cgi-bin/facts.php 

- CEOs in 1965 made 24 times more than the average production worker, whereas in 2009 they made 185 times more

- In the United States, 21 percent of all children are in poverty, a poverty rate higher than what prevails in virtually all other rich nations.

- There are 750,000 Americans who are homeless on any given night

- High-school dropout rates are least among whites and highest among Hispanics, while college enrollment rates are least among blacks and highest among whites.

- Only college graduates have experienced growth in median weekly earnings since 1979 (in real terms). High school dropouts have, by contrast, seen their real median weekly earnings decline by about 22 percent.

- Resumes with “white-sounding” names, whether male or female, were much more likely to result in call backs for interviews than were those with “black-sounding” names (even though the resumes were otherwise identical)

- The incarceration rate in the United States has grown so dramatically since the 1970s that the U.S. now has one of the highest rates in the world. The rise in incarceration has been especially prominent among young Black males and high school dropouts.

- In 2007, 8.1 million children under 18 years old were without health insurance. Children in poverty and Hispanic children were more likely to be uninsured.

I'm not talking just about it ust in terms of inequality of wealth but inequality as a whole. 

How does India and Pakistan treat women?

Frankly, I don't care about the poor or homeless. It's their responsibility to go to school, work and provide for themselves. 

That Stanford study does looks at inequality as a whole, click the link damn it

If you dont care about people suffering then your walking around with blinkers on, keep expecting to be shocked by people's behaviour for the rest of your life



Machiavellian said:
Dunban67 said:
A long time Real Estate closing attorney recently told me he has never seen so many people use gun permits and carry permits as their 2nd form of ID at closings than he has the last year+
IMO one big reason many people are skeptical about gun control (in the US) are that it will keep guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens but will not slow down the amount of guns in the hands of criminals- most guns used in acts of crime and violence are not legally registered And many of those guns are bought via pawn shops, craigs list etc Additionally gun control almost certainly will not stop military contractors and our government from selling/giving guns by the millions throughout the world - many of which make their way back to the US via legal and black market trade-

Needless to say these shootings are tragic- and will make hiring and attracting quality people to become police officers much more difficult -

Actually I believe this part is neither true or false because the NRA has pretty much blocked the study of this everytime it comes up in congress.  The CDC has tried to bring this up to get funding for studying gun violence and get some solid numbers out there but everytime it comes up it gets blocked.  One thing I do know and will bring up the stat when I find it is that there is a heck of a lot of gun violence from registered owners as there is from unregistered.

I would like to see the stat because gun violence by non registeed and illegal gun owners is many multiples higher than registered gun owners-   If you are not able to find federal stats on that i bet you could probably find them in a  cross section of metro areas in the us -   By definition a registered gun owner is  typically going to be much more careful w their own gun as it would easily be tracked back to them if they used it in the commission of a crime-  Matter of fact gun violence by registered gun owner is prob among the lowest  unless you are counting self inflicted possibly- but i am talking criminal gun violence, guns used (fired or not) in the commission of a crime etc



Rab said:
Soundwave said:

They showed this shooter's Youtube video, basically he said he doesn't believe protesting solves anything, the only thing that does (according to his world view) is money or violence. He has a pretty nihilistic world view. 

Alton Sterling's aunt was on TV in tears pleading with people to stop the killing.

Sad. We need more love in the world. My hope is that the relationship between the black community and the police can be rebuilt brick by brick with more mutual respect and understanding, better training and more open and frank interface with the community, it's the only way this will get better. 

I don't think it's enough to improve the police, I think it's the whole society we live in, inequality in the USA is one of the highest in the world, the disadvantaged will push back violently if nothing changes, they have nothing to loose any more, it's already all taken away from them

What? In what world where the USA's poorest have access to dozens of free government programs and are given luxuries like smartphones means that the USA has one of the highest inequality in the world. The US isn't the best in the department, but it's not even the worst in North America. 



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outlawauron said:
Rab said:

I don't think it's enough to improve the police, I think it's the whole society we live in, inequality in the USA is one of the highest in the world, the disadvantaged will push back violently if nothing changes, they have nothing to loose any more, it's already all taken away from them

What? In what world where the USA's poorest have access to dozens of free government programs and are given luxuries like smartphones means that the USA has one of the highest inequality in the world. The US isn't the best in the department, but it's not even the worst in North America. 

The real World, just google it, the US is one of the worst countries for inequality period, your living in cloud cuckoo land if you ignore the data and believe otherwise (already addressed this a few posts back if you can be arsed to check) 



Rab said:
outlawauron said:

What? In what world where the USA's poorest have access to dozens of free government programs and are given luxuries like smartphones means that the USA has one of the highest inequality in the world. The US isn't the best in the department, but it's not even the worst in North America. 

The real World, just google it, the US is one of the worst countries for inequality period, your living in cloud cuckoo land if you ignore the data and believe otherwise (already addressed this a few posts back if you can be arsed to check) 

LOL. Income inequality isn't the only measure that people use. It honestly doesn't really give much of an answer, because have most of the wealth redistributed doesn't help all that much. While there are things to improve in terms of improving the quality of life for everyone in the US, you haven't really provided any data for why the US in one of the worst places in the world for inequality.

Also, your stanford study link was a 404, so I dunno what I'm supposed to do with that.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

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