Paying for online was silly and done because the company in question wanted to milk the gamers' pockets, but now that Sony's doing it it's a sound business decision

Idk about other people but I have standards. If Nintendo ever introduces paid online play I won't pay for it, I'd just game offline.

Same thing with remasters and DLC. I mean, I could understand it if it's remade from the ground up like the Pokemon remakes or Metroid Zero Mission, and if the DLC is done right like Smash Bros and Mario Kart, but TPHD isn't something I'd support, and neither are the Amiibo.

What is it then? A question to be answered without bringing up other systems to compare it to, so the only answer I can give you is.

No.

Good thread though! Think I might go and quite gaming.

I think they are, to some extent, but I think all gamers and consumers in general, are. As for Bethesda, PC gamers have clearly been given the short end of the stick here for some time, same goes for former PC superpower Bioware. Bethesda titles have thrived on PC in large parts due to the community and modding, this has nothing to do with the intentions of the developer, if anything, the amount of mods and fixes and their popularity shows how dissatisfied many gamers are with the core titles themselves.

Yes. People are ok with difficulty modes locked behind a plastic figurine.

Funny how you didn't mention PS Plus Games and Games with Gold.

I think it depends on how deep the loyalty goes. For example, I am a person that bought both Nintendo and Sony consoles for many generations. However, with this gen, Sony made it mandatory to pay for online which I think is nonsense as best to pay for such a basic feature. So I havnt bought a ps4 yet however you see many people buying ps4s regardless.

Dont get me wrong, the ps4 has many great games and some owners dont pay for online but I think console owners are willing to tolerate more than PC owners.

Consoles are the bane of gaming. At least they're slowly making strides to better themselves. The final move to just having a PC under your TV and console makers making their games multiplatform is all but inevitable.

Not all console gamers are created equal and we can't just group them all together, but I can see most of your points being applied to those console gamers that care little for the brands but still prefer consoles. Were you avoiding console war thread de-evolution? Is still a positive that at least two of the fanbases have shown they are willing to cause a backlash to those corporate decisions they disagree with. Even if the next day they are running back to buy whatever big thing their preferred company offers.

Also, is not like we don't have to deal with Valves terrible costumer service.

Whoa, that's an entire herd of generalizations you have there.

Outside of the "pay to play online" which is some unfortunately thing to put up with console gaming, and one I don't agree with (Despite having paid for it on some occasions, because it's either that or not playing online at all), I think you're extrapolating one simple case (Skyrim Remastered or whatever) into this whole paragraph of "gamers too willing to accept things", especially when that thread bashes Bethesda for such a terrible practice.

Console gamers and PC gamers both buy broken, unfinished or unoptimized games in most cases. They both double-dip if they find it worth doing so (not unlike having a vanilla game and then getting the GOTY version afterwards, which I rarely know any case of GOTY version given for free on PC). They both purchase scumming microtransactions. Steam makes some truly questionable revisions of their policies and hardly anyone bats an eye, just like Sony suddenly starts charging for online play and people just go with it.

Some console gamers complain about such games and don't get it, just like some PC gamers know what games not to get and ignore them. The former can wait for an official patch, the later might try some fixing mods or unnoficial patches. It looks like you're trying to make this one-sided, but in reality, the status quo of this industry is caused by gamers in general. Trying to make the distinction of "console gamers" as if they suddenly were more guilty of it really doesn't work. At least that's how I see it.