I see a massive difference in store, but that's the real scam. All the 1080p tvs display crappy live tv feed, which is about 7-8 mbps mpeg2 720p/1080i, while the 4K tvs display specially made high bit rate content to make them look as good as possible.

I know my 1080p projector can still look a lot better while displaying 4K content. A downscaling 4K UHD player will tie me over better (until 4k projectors get affordable) than settling for a smaller tv. Higher bandwidth, less compression artifacts and downscaling to 4:4:4 full RGB will give most of the benefit of 4K blu-ray.

Blu-ray is 1920x1080 grayscale, 960x540 color info, 220 shades per color (15-235 range). 4K blu-ray is 3840x2160 grayscale, 1920x1080 color info, upto 1024 shades per color, although it's on a logarithmic scale to define brighter whites and for now encoded in DCI P3: The main difference between DCI P3 and Rec.709 (the current standard color space) is that DCI P3 can display many more tones of green, though there is also a slight expansion to the number of red tones. The number of blue tones was unchanged.
Hence if you properly downscale to full RGB 1920x1080 256 shades per color, no chroma subsampling, you already have a big upgrade over standard blu-ray and if your 1080p tv supports full RGB without chroma subsampling you should see a difference already.

So yeah, if you watch the same 4K content downscaled onto a high quality 1080p tv, you're less likely to notice a difference until you get really close. Ofcourse in the store you might even get high bitrate 4:4:4 demo 4K content which you'll never get at home. Chroma subsampling is still applied to all video streamed or on disc. Not that you'll notice the difference sitting on the couch :)

4K tvs aren't the scam, bit starved HD streams are the real scam. At least there is HDR to make a difference, however there's not a lot of content yet in HDR and the specs are still subject to change. 12 bit Rec.2020 is the ultimate goal, covering aout 70% of human color vision. For now HDR tvs are aiming to cover 90% of DCI P3 which covers about 50% of human color vision. (The current rec.709 standard only covers 35%)

It's a weird situation with color coverage, like selling tvs with a few more pixels each year until 4K standard is reached.

For me, it's hard to tell the difference, unless I'm paying close attention, so I don't think it's worth getting an expensive TV for

4K or UltraHD is about high dynamic range, deep colour etc. as well. Especially high dynamic range is interesting here, deep colour is also though.

Basically the most interesting things about 4K don't have much to do with resolution at all.

IRonically that's the reason i wont buy a 4K tv for the next two years. The really important stuff isn't implemented at all or just half way through.

I would say deep colour is more important for movies. Cinemas don't have and can't show HDR effects. Looking at 4K blu-ray reviews, the ones that are received best are because of deep colour, those with enhanced HDR effects tend to be less favorable. It is still early days, every release is different. Some still have issues with black level, a lot are upscaled from the 2K source. The Revenant seems to come out best, reference quality material, doesn't support HDR.

Ofcourse 4K tvs are currently rated on how well they can display HDR material. I assume that implies also being able to show 10 bit color as intended.

I have a 4k tv, but never use it for 4k content. I bought it because it is a good gaming tv, and I got a bit of a deal.

Projectors man....... projectors.

And i say again, i calibrated the TVs myself using settings I got from AVS. And was sending pictures to both of them. Looked at like 20 different pics in addition to solid white.

For thise wondering why, I am contemplating upgrading my 1080p projector to a 4k projector...... and those things aren't cheap. I needed to see first hand and spend some good time with 4k material to see if the costs are justified.

Yet some people here are making this about MS and sony.....smh.

Wrong. 4k is fucking beautiful. I will often bring out my PS4 when I visit my parents and play for a bit on their 4k TV. TV will upscale the PS4 and it looks very, very nice. It is kind of like how the 360 and the PS3 upscaled to 1080p, just to a lesser extent.

What I'm curious is to if the "Native" 4k will actually be worth buying a PS-Neo or a Scoprio for. Will it visually look THAT much better than upscaled 4k?

For those who played on a 4k tv. Do all of them upscale your consoles to 4k? I've heard that some of them do, where others won't and it'll look like a jaggy feast.

Can you easily zoom out on your projecter, as in make it project at 55 inches in the middle of the screen?
If so, downscale some 1080p pictures to 540p and resize them back up to 1080p (pixel doubling, not resampling), then compare the two from your normal sitting position in that shrunk down window. If you see a noticeable difference then 4K upgrade is worth it. (resolution wise anyway)

Ofcourse actual 4K content won't look as good due to chroma subsampling. To make the test better you need to save both pictures as jpg in 4:2:0 format, before resizing the 540p one back to 1080p. The difference is the same anyway.

Anyway if you test 4K pictures on a 1080p set you're actually comparing downsampled 4K vs native 4K. It would be nice to see 3 versions together, blu-ray on 1080p, 4K UHD version on 1080p and on a 4K set. Where is the bigger difference I wonder.

I kind of agree. MS and Sony should focus more on quality 1080p/60fps stability in games than 4K for the next five years at least. We won´t benefit much from 4K unless we use really big screens, so it´s pretty useless feature right now.

I can only tell the difference if I really concentrate on it. It's not enough to blow my mind, forget all my senses and rush out to buy some new TV for 1.000 € or something. 4K is nice and all, but it's not comparable to the jump from SD to HD back in the days. That's why I will just continue to use my Full HD TV until it dies. I don't care if it lasts another 5 years or even 10 years, it's good enough for me. Once it breaks down, I will get a 4K TV.