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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - (APRIL'S FOOLS!) "Nintendo should make a transgender Link in the new Zelda game"

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TheLegendofDS said:

Ok my question to you is if this is not a social narrative then why change an establish charater in an establish IP? Why not create a new IP and not pander to the minoraty?Linkle(and any version of fem.Link) in a side game is fine but in a main one is just stupid since it makes no sense.Link is a guy,Zelda a girl and Ganon a pig monster,and if we are to get a female lead in a Zelda game why do we have to change Link? Why can't we just have Zelda as the hero and Link as the prince?

I for one would much rather play a new version of Ocarina were you play the 7 missing  years as Zelda/Sheik than Zelda U with an shoehorn Trans/Fem. Link.Also most of the 3D Zelda's the story is not just the hero saves the princess and in many of them Zelda as a major role in the  story and in 1 there isn't even a princess to save.

 

See, this is where you contradict yourself. You claim that making changes to the main games in the franchise is stupid, because people is already established to be those types. But Ganondorf isn't only a pig monster, he has been changing and evolving into different things from his first iteration until now. He wasn' a pig monster in Wind Waker, was he? You thought that was stupid? Of course not, because characters CAN change. Heck, sometimes he isn't even the villain or is not present at all in certain main entries of the franchise.

So, the fact that Ganondorf change isn't a social narrative, you can agree with that, right? Then why changing Link IS a social narrative? See, a contradiction. That's because changing Link IS NOT a social narrative. It's a sign of a franchise that evolves and diversificates itself, just like Ganondorf ISN'T ALWAYS a pig.

Again, Zelda as a hero would be a good option, but what we've shown already of Zelda U points at Link being in charge, once again. Why not take this oportunity and, you know, just like Ganondorf isn't always a pig, make Link something else than a white male? Your opinion actually supports this view, not the other way around.



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To be fair, I don't think it matters. Simply because I don't think the gender identity of Link matters much to his character. So in away it would be a pointless change and in some ways superficial pandering.

I agree with increasing the representations of non-white males in video games, but not with changing established character to do so unless there is a more of a reason than just representing them.

So for Link, even if he is technically multiple people, if you change him to represent other groups then it can't just be solely for that reason, especially since if that is the case you've got no reason to make him Transgender over any other (Non-white male heteronormative groups) such as African Americans, Arabs, Asians, etc, as well as different gender and sexual identies. 



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Transgender?! How often do you even meet a transgender person? Maybe once a year! Why make a universally popular character be represented by a group of people who make up less than 1‰ of the population?

If we really want diversity and representation we should talk about the next Link being xenophobic or against mass immigration before suggesting he's transgender. A racist Link, that would be diversity for real.

This PC brainwash is disgusting. Always the left wing Marxists coming with these perceived "minorities" who already are over-represented in media.



Wright said:
hershel_layton said:
Why are people so obsessed with this? I mean, it's ridiculous!

I'm Arab, and as we all know, Arabs are pretty much rarely shown in video games. DO I COMPLAIN? No. I do not complain. I realize that if all we do is whine because our stupid little feelings are hurt, then we'll get no progress done. I don't care for arabs to be "appreciated'' more in the video game world. Come on. We've purposely made games like this to escape reality. Why do we need to bring them down to earth?

I mean, Jesus flipping Christ. People will blow up at you for saying or doing anything that doesn't go 100% with their viewpoints.

 

It's not obsession. It is a problem that needs to be adressed.

Maybe you're comfortable with the misrepresentation of arabs in videogames, but the Transgender collective is fed up being always ignored. They're also part of those consumers that make the videogame business thrive and succeed. So, it's only fair that they get the spotlight every once in a while, don't you agree? You should read the full article in the source, it adresses the importance of a transgender protagonist with factual points and solid evidence.

No one is blowing up here, people is just asking for change. Nothing wrong with that, no one is holding up Anouma's family hostage and demands that he changes the main character.

I read it. My criticism was on a whole though. Not just to transgender(they do have it bad), but other people that demand everything is diverse and have all groups feel represented. 

 

The only reason I don't want it for Link is because Sheik would be a more matching character. Makes everyone think she's a boy(even though she isn't in OoT).

 

Also, the article had problems. First off, nintendo never dealt with otherkin. There's a difference between transforming into a badass animal and otherkin.

Secondly, Anita Sarkeesian. Saying the typical audience is "30 year old white[caucasion] males" is absolutely dishonest. Do you truly think the majority of Nintendo's audience is above 30, let alone 25? Most of them are teenage-young adult men and women who love their games for original gameplay. You'll find the "white men" elsewhere, not at Nintendo.


Also, look at the wording. She's so biased it's to the point where I'm cringing. The article is portraying Nintendo as some big, bad villian with the fired worker(who I have nothing against) as some angel that got pursecuted by Nintendo.

 

Adding on, I'm quite sure Nintendo has their own reason for not making any of their current characters transgender- they just never felt the need. As I said, this is video games that we're talking about. Not everyone will be happy. But guess what? Link isn't a white male with white privilege. He's a dude that's an elf(I think).

YET, the reason why I never saw the need for Link being transgender is because most of the Link's from the LoZ franchise look extremely masculine and male-like(especially the voice). The Wii U version could make him look like a girlish boy/boyish girl to allow people to pick whatever the heck they want Link to be. Male, female, transgender male, transgender female...See what I mean?

 

 

 

Link is Nintendo's golden character(well, one of them). I'm pretty sure Nintendo will do whatever they can to keep it like that, now what I mean? They probably know what to do for the best.



 

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Christians outnumber transgenders by a ratio of 1 million to one in our world, but how often do you see Christian characters in games?

We've seen many more LBGT characters in games of recent years than we've seen characters who are Christian.

We need to shut down these Marxists/feminists/multiculturalists/immigration lovers from setting the agenda and washing our brains. They don't care for equality or diversity, they just want to destroy the current order, destroy norms and everything that was built by the white man.



Wright said:

 

See, this is where you contradict yourself. You claim that making changes to the main games in the franchise is stupid, because people is already established to be those types. But Ganondorf isn't only a pig monster, he has been changing and evolving into different things from his first iteration until now. He wasn' a pig monster in Wind Waker, was he? You thought that was stupid? Of course not, because characters CAN change. Heck, sometimes he isn't even the villain or is not present at all in certain main entries of the franchise.

So, the fact that Ganondorf change isn't a social narrative, you can agree with that, right? Then why changing Link IS a social narrative? See, a contradiction. That's because changing Link IS NOT a social narrative. It's a sign of a franchise that evolves and diversificates itself, just like Ganondorf ISN'T ALWAYS a pig.

Again, Zelda as a hero would be a good option, but what we've shown already of Zelda U points at Link being in charge, once again. Why not take this oportunity and, you know, just like Ganondorf isn't always a pig, make Link something else than a white male? Your opinion actually supports this view, not the other way around.

Ganon didn't change when Ganodorf was introduce,he was still the same charater that given a human form that isn't changing a character that's adding to it and in WW even though he didn't change into his pig form he was still the same character and yes Fem/Trans Link is a social nararrative and a stupid ideia because the main reason that people want it to happen is just so that there are more women or trans people in games and as nothing to do with the games themselves,let's take Zelda U and give the Hero save the princess story that aparrantly Zelda games love to have and let's make Link a woman in what way does the game change or is freshen up the series apart from "Link has titts now" nothing changes,now with Zelda as the main character things most likely will change since you know Zelda is a different character and not just a guy in drag.So Zelda U won't have a female lead so fing what that doesn't mean that the next one won't have Zelda as the main character.And I will say I'm perfectly fine with more women and tras characters in gaming, but create new ones and give them their own IP don't just change new characters that is just pandering and kinda of isulting if you ask me because you are basically saying that they are not good enough on their own so you'll throw them a bone by giving them an already popular IP.



Wright said:
Shiken said:

It is stupid because it would be a blatant kissing up 2 pathetic social justice Warriors. A female link is unnecessary in every sense. However if it were optional then I really would not care to be honest. When it comes to a forced female protagonist however I would much rather have Zelda herself be the hero of that particular story. She is an actual character that has everything to do with the world we are exploring. A female link however is just pointless.

 

It's not kissing up 2 SJW. It's showing your customers that more people outside the stereotiped white male can be the hero (or heroine) of Hyrule. The article isn't calling for a forced change (You should read it, Anita makes the point across better than myself trying to explain it here), but rather, take advantage of the game not being released yet and do the swap. Forced change would be adding a patch that changes the protagonist.

While Zelda as a protagonist isn't a bad idea, and it's been discussed in the past, we've already seen that a Link will be the protagonist, so this will go down on the traditional Zelda structure rather than giving the spotlight to a fresh (or another veteran) character. All this article asks for is that a transgender Link is given the chance to be the heroine in the game. It would be a daring move from Nintendo, and transgender collective could feel identified with the protagonist. Everyone wins.

Be careful, there is a fine line between a bold move and a stupid one.  The Zelda universe is what it is, to change it to that degree even to just show diversity is pointless when there are better options available.

 

Either A, make the NEXT one focus on Zelda or B, make Link's gender an option.  This is the ONLY way everyone wins.  I don't like playing as a female, period.  Still have not beaten RotTR due to this.  I know many who won't even touch a game with a female lead because, like me, they have no interest in playing as a female.

 

Samus is a female, never make her male.

Lara is female, should always be that way.

Link is MALE, and should remain so.

 

Changing an eatablished characters gender is beyond reaching.  As I said however, an option would not bother me at all.  Playing as Zelda or Impa would not be a huge deal, even though I do not prefer it.  If I am forced to play as a female OR transgender Link, I may pass on it altogether.  If this comes to pass, I want a male version of Samus to play as, and I would want him to be the only option as well.

 

Do you see how stupid this idea is?  Lets make the next Tomb Raider game focus on a male as well while we are at it.  You see where I am going with this...



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Wright said:
mornelithe said:
Still don't understand the obsession with taking already established characters and twisting them to suit a social narrative. I would think creating new characters with new stories would be something the LGBT community could get into more. It just feels like a shallow attempt at being inclusive imo.

And why exactly is it a heterosexual woman, telling a dev, what a community she isn't part of wants? Wouldn't the appropriate thing be to hire LGBT artists/writers/etc... to create what they want? Dunno, it doesn't impact me greatly, because I don't really play Zelda games anymore...but, it doesn't come across as very genuine to just co-opt existing characters.

 

It's not a social narrative. It's the fact that Nintendo seems stuck with the "standard male save-the-day hero" instead of, you know, acknowledging there are diverse people that could take his place instead. Linkle was a start, now they have to keep that path, but doesn't seem they want to, judging what we know about ZeldaU.

Samus says you're wrong ...



hershel_layton said:

I read it. My criticism was on a whole though. Not just to transgender(they do have it bad), but other people that demand everything is diverse and have all groups feel represented. 

The only reason I don't want it for Link is because Sheik would be a more matching character. Makes everyone think she's a boy(even though she isn't in OoT).

Also, the article had problems. First off, nintendo never dealt with otherkin. There's a difference between transforming into a badass animal and otherkin.

Secondly, Anita Sarkeesian. Saying the typical audience is "30 year old white[caucasion] males" is absolutely dishonest. Do you truly think the majority of Nintendo's audience is above 30, let alone 25? Most of them are teenage-young adult men and women who love their games for original gameplay. You'll find the "white men" elsewhere, not at Nintendo.

Also, look at the wording. She's so biased it's to the point where I'm cringing. The article is portraying Nintendo as some big, bad villian with the fired worker(who I have nothing against) as some angel that got pursecuted by Nintendo.

Adding on, I'm quite sure Nintendo has their own reason for not making any of their current characters transgender- they just never felt the need. As I said, this is video games that we're talking about. Not everyone will be happy. But guess what? Link isn't a white male with white privilege. He's a dude that's an elf(I think).

YET, the reason why I never saw the need for Link being transgender is because most of the Link's from the LoZ franchise look extremely masculine and male-like(especially the voice). The Wii U version could make him look like a girlish boy/boyish girl to allow people to pick whatever the heck they want Link to be. Male, female, transgender male, transgender female...See what I mean?

Link is Nintendo's golden character(well, one of them). I'm pretty sure Nintendo will do whatever they can to keep it like that, now what I mean? They probably know what to do for the best.

 

So, you read the source? Do you understand now why Transgenders and not another collective (even though they need to be represented) must be the one being represented in the new Zelda game?

And you're wrong. Sheik was definitively a man in OoT (Zelda used magic to change her body, it wasn't just a disguise. The OoT Manga confirmed this), and the transforming into an animal was definitively a move to represent the otherkin collective. Because otherwise wouldn't have made sense that Link was a wolf, wasn't it? They could have simply do what they did in Majora, change his race.

Nintendo definitively aim for the white men population, though I agree that maybe Anita got the age wrong. I do think 15 is way too short, probably mid-20. Still, we're in the same situation.

And she's not biased. She's pointing out the flaws in Nintendo's patriarchal way of thinking. That worker did nothing to deserve being fired. Yet she was kick out regardless.

 

I think it's too sad that Link has to be a man to be considered the Golden Character of Nintendo. They have the opportunity to demonstrate that your sex isn't what determines the Golden Character thing. Because outside Samus, there's really no diversification in Nintendo's humane-esque Golden Characters.