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Forums - Politics Discussion - Is God's existence objectively verifiable?

 

Well, is it objectively verifiable?

Yes 57 15.20%
 
Not Sure 20 5.33%
 
No 244 65.07%
 
What's objective mean? 16 4.27%
 
Results 38 10.13%
 
Total:375
Soundwave on 30 January 2016
Puppyroach said:
One question though: What god are we talking about? It seems that is kind of up in the air.

 

Yes that's the other dig, what if some obscure religion in like Banglesdesh or some such is the only one that got it right? Then what? Everyone else is fucked? lol. 

There's 10339383984393 iterations of "god". 

Just be a good person. Is it that damn hard? If you need religion to give yourself morals and to stop yourself from being murdering, raping asshole, it's not religion you lack but humanity. 



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Frank_kc on 30 January 2016

Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.



JWeinCom on 30 January 2016
Frank_kc said:
Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.

Someone has been listening to too much Ray Comfort...



Playstation_awaiter on 30 January 2016


If nothing existed before the BigBang there are no laws to govern what can occur, so anything is possible. Our universe was one of those possibilities.

Volterra_90 on 30 January 2016
Puppyroach said:

In what way is the concept of god not a human invention to explain irrationality in nature? :)

This is kind of what I am getting at; the only possible answer to the question in the OP is "No" since we don´t even have a common definition of "God" and therefore it does not exist unless we have a unified definition. When I mention Zeus or Odin, Shiva or The World Tree, all are some type of God for some people, at different times in history and in different places. People don´t even seem to talk about the biblical God but some kind of personal spiritual entity or the one that kicked of the BigBang.

Therefore it is safe to conclude that the term "god" is only our way to explain the unknown, the extraordinary, things we have yet to comprehend or can explain through scientific methodology. And in that case, God is precisely as real as Santa, and that is ok.

Yeah, pretty much this. People failing to see that God is a human invention and failing to know that their belief is an act of faith, not an act of rationality are wrong. But I can't prove that their beliefs are wrong, because, it's impossible to prove otherwise. Therefore, I'm an agnostic xDDDD.

Frank_kc said:
Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.

Is this irony? I really hope so. Just in case, I'll answer you. We know about how electricity works, pain, and frequencies, and we have science to explain all of these examples. If you have interest, you can see plenty of articles and explanations about this on the Internet. Jesus, it reminds of some day that a person told me how can't I believe in God, he's (HE, it can't be a she, of course) like the wind, you feel it but you can't see it. Fuck, I feel the wind, I know why the wind exists, that was the shittiest comparion ever lol. 

And you must definitely read Darwin, you're talking with ignorance about his theories. 





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RadiantDanceMachine on 30 January 2016
JWeinCom said:

RadiantDanceMachine said:

 Definitions are arbitrary. So your contention may be true for the definitions you hold for agnostic, atheism, but certainly not true for what I do. I was very careful with offering my definitions so you could understand. Instead you ignored them, pretended definitions are not arbitrary and asserted that THE definition is [X].

That's quite the assertion about my thread and myself. Have any supporting reasons for it? (*chuckles*)

Everything is binary. A proposition is either true or false. This is really fundamental to logic...you know it by the law of the excluded middle term. 

If you can show me where I claimed that the concept of god is flawed, I'd be happy to address it. However, knowing that I made no such claim, I doubt there is anything to address.

=)

Definitions are not arbitrary.  They are fluid, and can change, but they do not pop out of the air... which is kinda why I stopped replying to him...

Agnostic atheist is absolutely not an oxymoron.  I explained the distinction pretty clearly which is why I gave up.

A-theist

From the greek atheos.  "A" meaning without and "theos" meaning a god.  So, whitout a god. 

Gnostic is from the greek gnostikos.  Meaning "knowing".

Agnostic simply means "not knowing" or "not sure". 


Agnostic does not refer to what you believe, it refers to what you know.  For instance, I strongly believe the NX will launch in 2016, but I don't KNOW that it will.  So regarding the claim "the NX will launch in 2016" I am agnostic.

In terms of god, I am also agnostic, as in I don't think I know certainly there is no god.  I am also an atheist.  Because I do not believe the claim that there is a god.


So, you put those together and you get agnostic atheist.  I prefer the term atheist though, because the fact that I don't know that there is a god should be implicit.

If you believe there is a god, but don't know it for sure, congratulations.  You're also agnostic.  An agnostic theist.

It's really a very simply concept. A quick wikipedia search would have explained it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnostic_atheism

"If a man has failed to find any good reason for believing that there is a God, it is perfectly natural and rational that he should not believe that there is a God; and if so, he is an atheist... if he goes farther, and, after an investigation into the nature and reach of human knowledge, ending in the conclusion that the existence of God is incapable of proof, cease to believe in it on the ground that he cannot know it to be true, he is an agnostic and also an atheist – an agnostic-atheist – an atheist because an agnostic... while, then, it is erroneous to identify agnosticism and atheism, it is equally erroneous so to separate them as if the one were exclusive of the other..."  Robert Flint

Definitions are indeed arbitrary, which is to say that they can be anything. I can assign any meaning I want to any term. Dictionaries are an effort to have *common* meaning so in every day conversation we can actually understand what one another is saying. If you notice, dictionaries often have several different definitions for words because of their usage. 

Standard practice in philosophy to define terms you're using which tend to have non-specific meaning or create a neologism. A definition needs to have a certain level of specificity especially if we're going to use the word in an argument. Otherwise you'll never be able to make a proper inference from it. 

Etymology is really not an argument. It just displays why someone made up this particular definition for this particular word. If I do not wish to use the definitions which are currently available, I do not have to. I almost always provide definitions for terms I adopt in order to preclude misunderstanding about their meaning.





Frank_kc on 30 January 2016
JWeinCom said:
Frank_kc said:
Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.

Someone has been listening to too much Ray Comfort...

 

I really dont know him nor I care who he is. I am just stating facts, not illusions.



DivinePaladin on 30 January 2016
fatslob-:O said:
DivinePaladin said:

In fairness, burden of proof sits with the person making the outlandish claim. Not to say religion is outlandish necessarily, but it's definitely more so than the claim that there isn't a god. 

I personally don't care as I don't contemplate over pointless questions about God's existence and just get on with being an agnostic athiest because it's seemingly impossible to prove or disprove such ... 

I want science to focus for our benefit, not be used as some futile attempt to deface religion ... 

Thankfully the good scientists stopped caring about the existence of a god a long time ago and worked instead on bettering humanity. Having Neil DeGrasse Tyson as the figurehead of science right now isn't helping science seem less anti-religious since he spends way too much time digging into religion and begging for attention, but that's neither here nor there. Love the guy but god has he sold out lol



You should check out my YouTube channel, The Golden Bolt!  I review all types of video games, both classic and modern, and I also give short flyover reviews of the free games each month on PlayStation Plus to tell you if they're worth downloading.  After all, the games may be free, but your time is valuable!

Frank_kc on 30 January 2016
Volterra_90 said:
Puppyroach said:

In what way is the concept of god not a human invention to explain irrationality in nature? :)

This is kind of what I am getting at; the only possible answer to the question in the OP is "No" since we don´t even have a common definition of "God" and therefore it does not exist unless we have a unified definition. When I mention Zeus or Odin, Shiva or The World Tree, all are some type of God for some people, at different times in history and in different places. People don´t even seem to talk about the biblical God but some kind of personal spiritual entity or the one that kicked of the BigBang.

Therefore it is safe to conclude that the term "god" is only our way to explain the unknown, the extraordinary, things we have yet to comprehend or can explain through scientific methodology. And in that case, God is precisely as real as Santa, and that is ok.

Yeah, pretty much this. People failing to see that God is a human invention and failing to know that their belief is an act of faith, not an act of rationality are wrong. But I can't prove that their beliefs are wrong, because, it's impossible to prove otherwise. Therefore, I'm an agnostic xDDDD.

Frank_kc said:
Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.

Is this irony? I really hope so. Just in case, I'll answer you. We know about how electricity works, pain, and frequencies, and we have science to explain all of these examples. If you have interest, you can see plenty of articles and explanations about this on the Internet. Jesus, it reminds of some day that a person told me how can't I believe in God, he's (HE, it can't be a she, of course) like the wind, you feel it but you can't see it. Fuck, I feel the wind, I know why the wind exists, that was the shittiest comparion ever lol. 

And you must definitely read Darwin, you're talking with ignorance about his theories. 

 

And this science you are talking about came from no where? All the science you are refering to exised for a long time, and human was able to discover it. It was set by some one, right?  You missed the point here, i am pointing to things which existed and you dont see it, though you believe it exists.  Who decided to have a magnatic field around earth to protect it? Science... Nature.... or did it come up from no where..





Soundwave on 30 January 2016
Frank_kc said:
Definitely god exists. This is to the atheists who keep denying the existence of god. If I slap you in the face, you will get pain... Can you see pain? Can you see electricity?? Can you see frequencies? If You cant see Pain, Electricity, frequencies.. that doesnt mean it doesnt exist!!!!! You can see a proof of god creation in this world.. If we take a look to the planes, cars, TVs, etc, it would be irrational if we say that all exist by themselves. There must be people who make them!

If the simple thing such as the match has its makers, then the universe that far more complex than that must be has its creator.


And for all the believers in Darwin's evolution, give me an example of only one creature who changed its species.. I only challenge you with one example... Adjusting to environment doesn't change species... a bird will always be a bird. Everything Darwin's is talking about is a theory which has not been proven and if you have a proof, show it to me.

 

Which god? Thor? Zeus? Let me guess it's your god of choice (or one you were born into), but even if you're European, then what about your ancestors that were pagan? Do they burn in hell too even though they're the only reason you have the privelege to sit there on your computer and espouse invisible gods?

I can't see Santa Claus either, is he real too? 

Middle Eastern goat herders would worship a working toilet if you showed them one, why should I take their word on the nature of the cosomos and the creator if there is one? What makes them an authority on anything?