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Forums - Movies & TV - The Force Awakens sucks! *MAJOR SPOILERS*

amp316 said:
Soundwave said:
amp316 said:

Yes, Episode VII was Lucas' idea.  He gave Disney his original stories for VII through IX to show what happened next in his universe.  Disney said , " Screw it!  Let's just make a movie for the "fans".



 

No they opted to make a movie that brought back the fun nature of the original movie that appealled to non-nerds. Everyone saw the first Star Wars when it came out, grandparents, stoner rock girls, jocks, not just comic book nerds.

That's the thing with Star Wars is the "fans" are all obsessed with geeky details like what's the relationship of the Empire/Republic and what are politics of it, what's a Super Star Destroyer vs. a Star Destroyer, what can a Jedi do versus what he can't do, etc. etc. ... here's a newflash ... the general public never gave a shit about any of that. 

Star Wars was always about fun, likable characters in a mythic, fairy tale like space opera, but it was about those characters first and foremost. Their struggles, their joys, their fear, their friendships. The rest of it was just window dressing. 

Somewhere along the way, George Lucas forgot this, and started making movies more focused on the politics, midichorlians, cartoon rabbits stepping in space dog shit, power levels, trade blockades, and all the other dull stuff and pushed the characters into the background. 

Nobody quotes any line from the prequels (unless it's to mock them), because none of the characters are relatable or likable in any way. But people constantly quote the OT all the time. 

And there you have it.  You just admitted that this film isn't for the real fans (comic book nerds as you call them), but for the general public. 

Oh, and please give me a quote from the new movie.  Maybe a joke by Finn?  Those were hilarious, huh?  Cool non-nerds love that stuff.  Indestructible women that can do everything and anything without effort or even a bit of struggle are hip too.  It's a sign of the times I guess...  I'm far to dorky get it or this super cool movie filled to brim with pure unadulterated awesomeness.  Time to make that my first issue of The New Mutants is still in mint condition.

The film is for everyone, but it doesn't bog down like the prequels do. George at some point forgot he was making movies for human beings and just got absorbed into the mythology rather than understanding things like "who's my protagonist in this movie? Do I even have one?", "why am I having Jar-Jar step in poop?", "do I have an antgonist in this movie that pushes the plot forward?". etc. etc. etc. 

And sure Finn was a well done character, and yes he had several funny lines in the movie that actually got a laugh, unlike Jar-Jar in Episode I or actually probably even worse C-3PO in Clones is just terribly bad writing. He's funny, he's brave, and he brings a lot of energy to the movie, he's the basic "window" character that most fantasy films have. 

My favorite lines were from Han Solo, who was written absolutely spot on in this film, this is Harrison Ford's best performance in this type of film since like '89's The Last Crusade if not before that. "It's true ... all of it" was a great line, but the one I really loved was when he says "you got bigger problems kid, women can always tell you're lying". I love that he played the role unlike the "grumpy grandpa" Harrison Ford that we've seen lately this movie reminds you why this guy was a huge movie star.  Stuff like that just worked, those lines just felt more like real actual human beings talking than the prequels where it was so painful watching actors like Natalie Portman and Sam Jackson, who are legitimately good actors, stumble around like they were in a 7th grade play (A Sith ... Lord? .... I'm .... Ron ... Burgundy? ... like who the fuck talks like this?). 



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Soundwave said:

The film is for everyone, but it doesn't bog down like the prequels do. George at some point forgot he was making movies for human beings and just got absorbed into the mythology rather than understanding things like "who's my protagonist in this scene?", "why am I having Jar-Jar step in poop?", "do I have an antgonist in this movie that pushes the plot forward?". etc. etc. etc. 

And sure Finn was a well done character, and yes he had several funny lines in the movie that actually got a laugh, unlike Jar-Jar in Episode I or actually probably even worse C-3PO in Clones is just terribly bad writing. He's funny, he's brave, and he brings a lot of energy to the movie, he's the basic "window" character that most fantasy films have. 

My favorite lines were from Han Solo, who was written absolutely spot on in this film, this is Harrison Ford's best performance in this type of film since like '89's The Last Crusade if not before that. "It's true ... all of it" was a great line, but the one I really loved was when he says "you got bigger problems kid, women can always tell you're lying".  Stuff like that just worked, those lines just felt more like real actual human beings talking than the prequels where it was so painful watching actors like Natalie Portman and Sam Jackson, who are legitimately good actors, stumble around like they were in a 7th grade play reading lines to what was probably a tennis ball on a blue screen (A Sith ... Lord? .... I'm .... Ron ... Burgundy? ... like who the fuck talks like this?). 

I agree with you on every point you made. Also using a beloved character like Ham to pass on the torch was super clever, newcomers went along with it fine, old timers got to see Ham notice these new ppl and trough his actions got closer to the new cast. Another thing to consider, altough this is anedoctal, everyone I know who hadnt watched Star Wars or had done so but like ages ago and didnt even pay atention loved this movie to bits, like we did when we watched Ep IV, became completly enthralled by this universe and are now on board with the series, reading books watching the old movies etc. Force Awakens captures what makes Star Wars what it is, somehting that Lucas was unable to do on the prequels and that the series needed restored.

Another 1 liner I love is C3POs "It is I C3PO, you might not recognize me because of the red arm", thats glorious, it captures C3POs goofness perfectly and is just so dumb that you cant help but laught.





DakonBlackblade said:
Soundwave said:

The film is for everyone, but it doesn't bog down like the prequels do. George at some point forgot he was making movies for human beings and just got absorbed into the mythology rather than understanding things like "who's my protagonist in this scene?", "why am I having Jar-Jar step in poop?", "do I have an antgonist in this movie that pushes the plot forward?". etc. etc. etc. 

And sure Finn was a well done character, and yes he had several funny lines in the movie that actually got a laugh, unlike Jar-Jar in Episode I or actually probably even worse C-3PO in Clones is just terribly bad writing. He's funny, he's brave, and he brings a lot of energy to the movie, he's the basic "window" character that most fantasy films have. 

My favorite lines were from Han Solo, who was written absolutely spot on in this film, this is Harrison Ford's best performance in this type of film since like '89's The Last Crusade if not before that. "It's true ... all of it" was a great line, but the one I really loved was when he says "you got bigger problems kid, women can always tell you're lying".  Stuff like that just worked, those lines just felt more like real actual human beings talking than the prequels where it was so painful watching actors like Natalie Portman and Sam Jackson, who are legitimately good actors, stumble around like they were in a 7th grade play reading lines to what was probably a tennis ball on a blue screen (A Sith ... Lord? .... I'm .... Ron ... Burgundy? ... like who the fuck talks like this?). 

I agree with you on every point you made. Also using a beloved character liek Ham to pass on the torch was super clever, newcomers went along with it fine, old timers got to see Ham notice these new ppl and trough his actions got closer to the new cast. Another thing to consider, altough this is anedoctal, everyone I know who hadnt watched Star Wars or had done so but liek ages ago and didnt even pay atention loved this movie to bits, like we did when we watched Ep IV, became completly enthralled by this universe and are now on board with the series, reading books watching the old movies etc. Force Awakens captures what amkes Star Wars what it is, somehting that Lucas was unable to do on the prequels and that the series needed restored.

Another 1 liner I love is C3POs "It is I C3PO, you might not recognize me because of the red arm", thats glorious, it captures C3POs goofness perfectly and is just so dumb that you cant help but laught.



 

Yeah the 3PO introduction in this film was well done. It got big laughs both times I saw the movie. 

My favorite moment in the movie actually probably is where Rey is just sitting alone and puts the blast shield over her head ... I dunno why, but that moment was just so cool (and it probably in a clever forshadows her destiny). I also thought they handled that pivotal scene with Han and Kylo Ren surprisingly well, I don't know why but I thought it would be a little eye-rolling, but JJ got good performances there. 

I also like Poe's line to Kylo Ren where they kinda just stare at each other and he says "who talks first, you or me?" or whatever, that was just perfect, it grounds the audience right away.

Look, TFA is certainly not the perfect movie, but it basically proves a premise I always had ... a *decent* Star Wars movie that wasn't some cold, human-less story that brought back the fun of the originals would do MONSTROUS box offce. It didn't need to even be great, just decent, and Abrams basically delivered that and now the result is fairly predictable to me. 

I always thought domestically Phantom Menace should have beaten Titanic, it didn't because the movie simply was too cold and silly to get to that level of box office. There was that painful moment in 1999 where walking out of the theater it dawned on me that "The Mummy" (also released that summer), albiet a silly film, felt more like a Star Wars movie than the new Star Wars did. 



DakonBlackblade said:
amp316 said:

And there you have it.  You just admitted that this film isn't for the real fans (comic book nerds as you call them), but for the general public. 

Oh, and please give me a quote from the new movie.  Maybe a joke by Finn?  Those were hilarious, huh?  Cool non-nerds love that stuff.  Indestructible women that can do everything and anything without effort or even a bit of struggle are hip too.  It's a sign of the times I guess...  I'm far to dorky get it or this super cool movie filled to brim with pure unadulterated awesomeness.  Time to make sure that my first issue of The New Mutants is still in mint condition.

Nope he said this film is for everyone, everyone includes fan. You can enjoy the movie if you allow yourself to, but youre too caught up in the fact that Rey is a powerfull jedi. Super powerfull male characters have been plentyfull and no one have problems with them, Swazeneger is one on every movie he ever made and he isnt even a jedi, but Rey somehow is a problem, even tough she clearly has training in hand to hand combat and lived 20 years alone in a planet full of criminals where she either learned to figth and fend for herlself or died, and its still up in the air if she has or has not ever had jedi training.

And amongst the 92% viewer aproval this movie have Im pretty sure theres millions of handcore fans (me included) that read books, comics, watch the animated series and some even like the prequels a bit. JJ Abrahms put the franchise back on track, now Ep VIII is free to go wherever it like, it recaptured the spirit of what made Srar Wars great, gave us awesome characters and an interesting story that still has a lot to give.

And I can give you at least 1 quote: "you will remove these restraints and leave this cell with the door open". "Ill tighten those restraints you rebel scum!!!"



I don't have a problem with Rey being the main character or that a woman can be an all powerful Jedi.  Don't get it twisted.  What I do have a problem with is that she learns how to do a force push, move objects using the force and weild a lightsaber to the extent that she can beat down the man that destroyed Luke Skywalker's temple and forced him to flee without any training. Also, she knows more than Han Solo does about the Millennium Falcon...  Rey could have been great if she learned how to do these things over the course of three movies through trials and tribulations, but that would take actual character development and storytelling.  The fast food culture that wants everything NOW gets what they want.   She touches a lightsaber and already is all powerful and perfect.  I can't wait until she beats down Luke on Dagobah or wherever they are during training.  Why does she even need training?  She already made the villain look like a bitch until that earthquake split the ground in between them.  What a lucky thing to happen for Kylo...  

 





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amp316 said:
Porcupine_I said:

 

Thanks to Lucas it didn't introduce anything new. If he had not messed up the prequels that bad, they would not have been forced to re-establish the whole franchise with a soft reboot like that. It may even take another movie to gain the trust of the fanbase back before they really can do anything new.

This movie did exactly what it was set out to do. Repair the damage that Lucas himself did to the Franchise. If Lucas don't like it, he should not have sold it. 

Wow!  So you're actually blaming George Lucas for the shortcomings of a movie that he had absolutely nothing to do with?  What a bunch of mularkey.  Disney now owns Star Wars and can do whatever they want with it.  By your own admission they chose to do a soft reboot.  Not Lucas' choice, now is it? Honestly, all of the Lucas hate needs to end.  Without him there would be no Star Wars at all...  I will admit this though.  It is his fault that The Force Awakens exists.  He sold Star Wars to Disney which allowed them to make this garbage movie. 



Absolutely not! I'm blaming Lucas for the shortcomings of the prequels and losing the trust of the fans and the state the francise was in when he sold it. That's what Disney had to repair and earn back that trust before they could do anything new with the franchise.  As far as the box office goes, it seems to work.

And the Force Awakens may not be the best of the Star Wars movies, but calling it a "garbage movie" really doesn't give you much credibility discussing movies. It is a very competent movie regardless of the franchise and both writing and cinematography is way beyond anything Lucas would be able to achieve these days.



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

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Soundwave said:

 

I also thought they handled that pivotal scene with Han and Kylo Ren surprisingly well, I don't know why but I thought it would be a little eye-rolling, but JJ got good performances there. 

 

Huge eyeroll from me.  Oh son, stop being bad.  Etc. etc.  I feel conflicted something something.  Great scene.  What a great way for the legendary Han Solo to eat it.  Also, isn't it great that the reunion between Han, Luke, and Leia that everyone wanted will never happen? 



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Ha! Now apparently I have no credibility discussing movies. At least according to one guy.



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amp316 said:
Ha! Now apparently I have no credibility discussing movies. At least according to one guy.

If only you had written over twenty reviews on this site before then you'd have some credibility...





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TruckOSaurus said:
amp316 said:
Ha! Now apparently I have no credibility discussing movies. At least according to one guy.

If only you had written over twenty reviews on this site before then you'd have some credibility...



 

Veknoid Outcast is a better reviewer than me though.  I have huge respect for him.



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"There are like ten games a year that sell over a million units."  High Voltage CEO -  Eric Nofsinger

amp316 said:
TruckOSaurus said:

If only you had written over twenty reviews on this site before then you'd have some credibility...

Veknoid Outcast is a better reviewer than me though.  I have huge respect for him.

Yup, he's quite good. Plus, he's got perfect taste when it comes to games.





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