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Forums - Politics Discussion - Woman and children first off a sinking ship. Gender equality...?

 

Should the case be...

Let the 100 women get the... 90 24.13%
 
Let the 100 men get the l... 31 8.31%
 
Split the lifeboats 50/50 between the adults. 168 45.04%
 
Let everyone drown because I can't decide. 84 22.52%
 
Total:373
Derek89 said:

Maybe it's because I'm not well informed on the matter, but I don't understand why it has always been like that. If before it was the man who had full controll of the family income, wouldn't it make more sense that the father should get on the boat with the child?

Chivalry, that why it was this way. The old way of thinking that men should protect women and child that so happens to be a good way of act and a usual instinct among animals: to protect the future of the species with the childs and women, because 1 men can get pregnant many women at the same time, but not the only way around.

 

OT: Why can't kids seat on their mother's (or father's) legs like has been happening since the invention of seats and save everybody?

Now seriously, I agree with childs first, but then neither all the women nor 50/50. We should save the more capable ones.



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nanarchy said:
I am old fashioned, the women and children are getting on the boats, I would physically restrain/beat any man that decided otherwise if I was there. Having said that I have no issue with the feminists volunteering up their place for a man in the spirit of equality.

Well shit that would be interesting, I think we can all agree children first but if you don't think it should be adults second and should be women second then you go last, dont forcefully put your ideals on others.

 

OT: yeah, children first adults second. Elderly last just because logic but I'm sure people would have huge problems with that



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

Why are arguments against feminism always such ridiculous scenarios?



nanarchy said:
I am old fashioned, the women and children are getting on the boats, I would physically restrain/beat any man that decided otherwise if I was there. Having said that I have no issue with the feminists volunteering up their place for a man in the spirit of equality.


You are part of the problem and NOT the solution, your way of thinking is not only backwards but sexist to boot, do you honestly think so low of woman that you have to coddle them like children?

I treat woman as my equals, and as my equals I'd work with them towards the saftey of the children first, then each other. If no children are involved, then it's each woman and man for themselves...it's called self-preservation, this is true equality!



"First come, first served"

Someone has to die.



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reggin_bolas said:
A more relevant example is the modern draft. In times of war, women ought to be drafted just as men. Most women would shrug at the idea which reveals the hypocrisy of common feminism.


Yes, and no.

Yes, women should be drafted equally in theory, but there is several stepping stones for that.

 

First, there would have to be a 'only one draft per family rule' otherwise children could end up without supervision/orphaned by design.

Second, you have to account for womens physical diffrences from men. Women in the military don't fight in the infantry, because they lack the required upper body strengh and endurance to carry the immense weight of body armor, ammo rounds and assorted gear and still be fast and flexible enough to keep up with their male colleagues.

While they might make excellent snipers, heli operators ect, they are a liability in the infantry and by proxy endanger the lives of their fellow soldiers. Even female soldiers themselves are lobbying against putting women into the infantry beause of these reasons.

Now I dont know what kind of percentage in soldier numbers the infantry makes up compared to the overall military, but if you account for the infantry having to basically be all male, yet still want to achieve an equal drafting system, you either have to put more women into all of the other positions (probably resuting in jobperspective inequality), or divide the remaining position 50/50 but have more men overall in the Military.

This is not unsolvable, by all means, but it is also not as simple as just 'also drafiting women'.

 

On topic: First and most important rule in case of crisis is clear and easy to understand ruleset in order to prevent an outbreak of panic. 'Women and children first' is one of those. Everyone immidiately understands the priorities set by it. As for reasons why it was chosen this way, aside from the chivalry of past times is probably that women and children were the two groups, the least likely to survive in the water/on debris on their own. In the past many women weren't taught how to swim, making their chances of suvival close to zero if they didn't get into a lifeboat. (Lifejackets would have rectified that somewhat though)

Women and children tend to be smaller, and loose body temperature faster then men on average too. That, and their superior upper body strengh would make a man in the sea more likely to survive than a woman. Last but not least, the rule was probably implemented to give the children at least one supervising part of their family to hang on to. Even back then men were permitted on lifeboats first if they had children to take care of and no wive that could have done it was present.

Today, the rule should probably more along the lines of 'Familys first' I guess, having a few men on a lifeboat can be a cucial advantage too. As a young, unmarried, childless person I'd be scewed anyways.



nanarchy said:
I am old fashioned, the women and children are getting on the boats, I would physically restrain/beat any man that decided otherwise if I was there. Having said that I have no issue with the feminists volunteering up their place for a man in the spirit of equality.


I have to be honest. I am 100% against violence but I would gladly beat any man beating other men who want to survive just like any woman or child. The deserve to be on those boats as much as everyone else. 



ganoncrotch said:
bananaking21 said:
my humble opinion.

dont be a dick, and do whats right. its that simple.


Yeah if everyone stopped to consider what they have lived and to live for it would be amazing, like I said in my case having lived a very enjoyable 32 years I would happily offer up a spot to survive for a younger person who wasn't suffering an illness which could lead them into trouble on a liferaft anyway. But.. I'm not sure a lot of people would actually do this in the moment.

I would. I don't suffer from a particular illness but in most of my life I've been depressed and don't see things changing any time soon, so if I had to choose, I'd offer my spot to someone who seems to stand a better chance at living a happy life. For example, I'd easily give my spot to my sister not because she's mys sister but because she has a family that depends on her. If she were to die, more lives would be affected.



naruball said:
ganoncrotch said:


Yeah if everyone stopped to consider what they have lived and to live for it would be amazing, like I said in my case having lived a very enjoyable 32 years I would happily offer up a spot to survive for a younger person who wasn't suffering an illness which could lead them into trouble on a liferaft anyway. But.. I'm not sure a lot of people would actually do this in the moment.

I would. I don't suffer from a particular illness but in most of my life I've been depressed and don't see things changing any time soon, so if I had to choose, I'd offer my spot to someone who seems to stand a better chance at living a happy life. For example, I'd easily give my spot to my sister not because she's mys sister but because she has a family that depends on her. If she were to die, more lives would be affected.

Very noble and honest, if everyone were like this a sinking ship scenario would be a far more civilised place.

That said I'm sorry for the way you feel and suffering depression at this time of year especially can be hard, can I just suggest that you make sure to reach out to your family so you have a plan for the holiday meals etc, while you feel that lives wouldn't be affected if you weren't around that is very rarely the case, I'm sure your sister would miss a brother who would offer his life for her and I'd miss the Naruball comments on this site :D!



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Done a bit of reading, first time it appeared was in a novel and there is no actual legal grounds for any such order of survival on a ship, so if someone was to assault a male to stop them getting into a lifeboat, the only one doign a criminal act would be the assaulter not the man attempting to sit down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_children_first

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_children_first#History



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