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Forums - Politics Discussion - What Makes Being Poor in The United States Suck?

CaptainWorf said:
sc94597, that was a very interesting original post and many interesting points were made in the replies both by you and others. You said you didn't have to work as a teen, and that is probably both good and bad. You have been able to achieve, but holding a part-time job as a teen can be a very useful experience. I think that many youths have no role models for the notion that if you hold a lawful job, you will get paid, and if you make a good impression and improve your skills, you can get paid more. The labor force participation rate for the 16-24 age group has declined by over 11% from 1992-2012. As for single payer, the Veterans Administration defeated General Shinseki, who was one of the best generals. There is a high probability the whole system will turn out like that if we do single payer. Please note, I private messaged you.

I didn't have to work, but when I was between 14-16 I wanted to work so that I had my own money. I had extra time, and could've. The child labor laws in Pennsylvania make it practically impossible to get a job until you are 16 or older. Furthermore, since my area was not a large city, transportation was a limiting factor to any job I would be able to find. After I turned 16, I was invested heavily in high school, studying for SAT's and Subject Tests after school, taking extra courses at the community college, etc to enhance my resume for a decent school. So I didn't really work, mostly out of preference, even though I could've. After my first year of college, I didn't want to return home for the summer and I wanted to find an apartment as the dorms were way too expensive compared to the local housing costs ($1,200/month vs. $350- $500/month). So I got a part time job working at my university. A year after that I worked at Walmart as a cashier for 6 months, three of which were while I was attending classes. And this last summer I worked at Ikea as a cashier. I also tutor online, and make a few extra hundred dollars per month doing that. I've been able to reduce my loans considerably by working part time jobs, and I agree one-hundred percent that they are valuable experiences which will help me even in my field (eventually will get a PhD in Physics, working on BS in Physics/Math and an Econ minor right now.) 

I will respond to your PM, thanks! :) 

 



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spurgeonryan said:
I would not want to be poor anywhere else! As a kid we lived in a small house, but had 10 acres of property and I had a blast on that property with the dog , my neighbor friends and step brothers. My mom was never on food stamps soour food was never super interesting, but She was a good cook so it was more interesting than it should have been I think.
Now my dad only gave 100 dollars in child support a month but he paid for everything else. Clothes, vacations with him to our family in California and on the Washington beach where we had property. Weekends with him were a break from my step siblings and being poor and he paid for me to go to private school until 11 grade when he too fell on hard times with drugs.
Being poor as an adult forced me to join the army where I quickly put my wife's pushy on a pedestal and put myself into huge debt to keep her entertained. We were complete opposites though and after my second deployment got divorced and she vanished and I am now poor again with three kids that I wanted to take custody of. Moved with my current gf, who has a nice job but I now have a crap job at Wal-Mart with no child support and Very little food atamps.
life isn't horrible though, I live paycheck to paycheck. Never enough to save and just enough to enjoy life a bit. But with jar work I hopefully will be a salaried manager soon and maybe life will improve dramatically. Maybe my 30 years of being poor and making some poor decisions will finally be behind me.

My life as a Poor has not been horrible, I have actually done a lot. But pay check to pay check sucks and now that I have learned some life lessons hopefully my second chance at being middle class will go better than the first.

The beginning.

Very interesting story. :) Best of luck to you and good luck on the salaried position and whatever else life brings. 



Man life sounded hard
Try being poor in Australia, sometimes you can make more money being unemployed than working



First world countries problems lol, Really you don't have any idea of what been poor is. I lived on the USA for 3 years and let me tell you, even if my parents only made 1000 USD together per week that is far better than most countries, here in mexico both of them made the same amount per month, with everything else costing the same or more. My parents give me $20 pesos per day which is like $1 USD now lol and now we are in a better situation than 10 years ago. I always laugh when people complain for 60 USD games, like WTF here in Mexico we pay like 85 USD nobody complains and people here in Mexico makes far less money. When I was a child we didn't even have water or electricity neither government help. When I was on the USA I always ask myself how is possibly to be poor in this country and even if you are poor those people are in a far better position than most of other poor people.



sc94597 said:

If you make less than $1,500/month you get food stamps, more if you have children. 

This is one of the problems. In most other first world countries you don't get food stamps, you get your money transfered to your account.

So if you go shopping, you pay with money or your normal bank card. Not every clerk in your town (or people standing behind you in line at the cash register) need to know that you are poor and are getting welfare support... it's not their business. Of course your bank teller will probably know it, but the less people who know it, the better. Even if some poor people don't care about that, many would prefer to keep the support a secret and it helps them to keep their dignity.

The same goes for medical treatment. Most people in other first world countries have their health insurance cards, the government pays the insurance fees.  The doctor or hospital don't know if the patient pays the insurance fees himself or if the state pays it... it's not their business. Only the government and the health insurance company know it.



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Conina said:
sc94597 said:

If you make less than $1,500/month you get food stamps, more if you have children. 

This is one of the problems. In most other first world countries you don't get food stamps, you get your money transfered to your account.

So if you go shopping, you pay with money or your normal bank card. Not every clerk in your town (or people standing behind you in line at the cash register) need to know that you are poor and are getting welfare support... it's not their business. Of course your bank teller will probably know it, but the less people who know it, the better. Even if some poor people don't care about that, many would prefer to keep the support a secret and it helps them to keep their dignity.

The same goes for medical treatment. Most people in other first world countries have their health insurance cards, the government pays the insurance fees.  The doctor or hospital don't know if the patient pays the insurance fees himself or if the state pays it... it's not their business. Only the government and the health insurance company know it.

It is a political issue to choose to not give cash assistance instead of food stamps. Too many people worry that the persons receiving the assistance will purchase drugs and alcohol instead of the food that they are suppose to use to feed their children. Most people on food stamps are not that concerned about what other people - particularly strangers - care. Cashiers (and I was one) couldn't care any less about who comes in and what they pay with. Besides a minor feeling of embarrasment, I don't see how this is a big problem. Please note that most places people shop at in the U.S are huge stores like Walmart or the local grocery chain, even in the small towns.  There are thousands of people who go through these stores daily. It is hard to recognize and determine who uses food stamps and who doesn't. In towns so small that everyone knows one another, practically everyone is on food stamps because their local incomes are very low.

Pennsylvania use to supply its medicaid through a health-insurance card that they called "Access." Everything went through the state. Since a few years ago they transitioned to letting you choose a plan from a local health-insurance company (in Pittsburgh you get four choices, for example) and they pay that company for you to have insurance. This was because most doctors would not accept the access card because Pennsylvania wanted to pay them 80% of what their typical rates were. Most doctors accept these private health-care plans. These plans are indistinguishable from people who pay for it themselves. So it is exactly as you described. 



sc94597 said:
Conina said:
sc94597 said:

If you make less than $1,500/month you get food stamps, more if you have children. 

This is one of the problems. In most other first world countries you don't get food stamps, you get your money transfered to your account.

So if you go shopping, you pay with money or your normal bank card. Not every clerk in your town (or people standing behind you in line at the cash register) need to know that you are poor and are getting welfare support... it's not their business. Of course your bank teller will probably know it, but the less people who know it, the better. Even if some poor people don't care about that, many would prefer to keep the support a secret and it helps them to keep their dignity.

It is a political issue to choose to not give cash assistance instead of food stamps. Too many people worry that the persons receiving the assistance will purchase drugs and alcohol instead of the food that they are suppose to use to feed their children.

Other countries have the food stamp option, too. But they use that option only in exceptional cases... only if it turns out that the recipient misuses the cash payment. Putting almost 1/6 of the population (almost 50 million people) under general suspicion that they probably would use the money for other things doesn't give me much confidence in that government.

sc94597 said:

Most people on food stamps are not that concerned about what other people - particularly strangers - care.

How do you know that? And even if it's no big deal for them... given the choice most people probably would prefer that as few people as possible know about their financial situation.



Conina said:
sc94597 said:
Conina said:
sc94597 said:

If you make less than $1,500/month you get food stamps, more if you have children. 

This is one of the problems. In most other first world countries you don't get food stamps, you get your money transfered to your account.

So if you go shopping, you pay with money or your normal bank card. Not every clerk in your town (or people standing behind you in line at the cash register) need to know that you are poor and are getting welfare support... it's not their business. Of course your bank teller will probably know it, but the less people who know it, the better. Even if some poor people don't care about that, many would prefer to keep the support a secret and it helps them to keep their dignity.

It is a political issue to choose to not give cash assistance instead of food stamps. Too many people worry that the persons receiving the assistance will purchase drugs and alcohol instead of the food that they are suppose to use to feed their children.

Other countries have the food stamp option, too. But they use that option only in exceptional cases... only if it turns out that the recipient misuses the cash payment. Putting almost 1/6 of the population (almost 50 million people) under general suspicion that they probably would use the money for other things doesn't give me much confidence in that government.

sc94597 said:

Most people on food stamps are not that concerned about what other people - particularly strangers - care.

How do you know that? And even if it's no big deal for them... given the choice most people probably would prefer that as few people as possible know about their financial situation.

How does one determine whether the cash payment was misused?

I know that from experience. Yes most people would prefer cash to food stamps. I am not personally against replacing food stamps with cash because then it would allow people to more efficiently spend the benefit. However, I was telling you why the majority of people (whom do not receive food stamps) oppose giving cash assistance versus food stamps. It isn't necessarily that the government is suspicious, but the people who are not receiving the food stamps and their impression thereof. Politicians need to make these decisions based on the whole population's beliefs, not the minority that is receiving the benefits.



sc94597 said:

So what are the poor missing out on in the U.S that makes people from other countries so scared of being poor here? I find the poor live a life of luxury to be honest. The only thing I feel I missed out on was a real, cohesive, and intelligent upbringing. But I figured that out for myself. 

It sounds like you lucked out honestly, as messed up as that sounds. Poor isn't just a static thing, and not very many poor people are "lucky" enough to have all the government benefits that you did growing up. I grew up poor but my mentally impaired mother and caring stepfather had to pay out the ass for rent, we went a couple different year long periods without Internet or cable, electricity was high, et alia. When my stepdad tore his rotator cuff(s) he lost his job within six months despite being there for 15 years and after months of struggling with it we finally got on food stamps. Not very many at all - something like $150 or so between two people (my mom briefly moved away). And my entire child support and a week of pay went to help rent. He maxed out everything he had in this period and my brother by chance had to come live with us because he's also poor and lost his apartment because he couldn't afford paying $400 a month for what was no more than a 30 square foot apartment, and that helped pay the bills. My mom was always lucky enough to have full insurance because she absolutely needed it (asthma, copd, etc.) and I was on my dad's insurance plan but I haven't had dental for a good decade. My stepdad is now dead, I didn't have the credit or a cosigner to help get the college loans I needed, and I'm living with a friend while I transfer to a community college where (thankfully) I'll likely be paying nothing. Most of this was last year, and I live in PA as well. 



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DivinePaladin said:
sc94597 said:

So what are the poor missing out on in the U.S that makes people from other countries so scared of being poor here? I find the poor live a life of luxury to be honest. The only thing I feel I missed out on was a real, cohesive, and intelligent upbringing. But I figured that out for myself. 

It sounds like you lucked out honestly, as messed up as that sounds. Poor isn't just a static thing, and not very many poor people are "lucky" enough to have all the government benefits that you did growing up. I grew up poor but my mentally impaired mother and caring stepfather had to pay out the ass for rent, we went a couple different year long periods without Internet or cable, electricity was high, et alia. When my stepdad tore his rotator cuff(s) he lost his job within six months despite being there for 15 years and after months of struggling with it we finally got on food stamps. Not very many at all - something like $150 or so between two people (my mom briefly moved away). And my entire child support and a week of pay went to help rent. He maxed out everything he had in this period and my brother by chance had to come live with us because he's also poor and lost his apartment because he couldn't afford paying $400 a month for what was no more than a 30 square foot apartment, and that helped pay the bills. My mom was always lucky enough to have full insurance because she absolutely needed it (asthma, copd, etc.) and I was on my dad's insurance plan but I haven't had dental for a good decade. My stepdad is now dead, I didn't have the credit or a cosigner to help get the college loans I needed, and I'm living with a friend while I transfer to a community college where (thankfully) I'll likely be paying nothing. Most of this was last year, and I live in PA as well. 

Every person that i knew who fit the requirements got the same/similar benefits, so I don't see how my family was special in that regard. Now that isn't to say that people who didn't receive the benefits didn't struggle, just that they didn't fit the arbitrary, but strict, requirements. I had many lower-middle class friends whose parents pinched much more and struggled a lot more than my "impoverished" friends and my family. It is a shame, and it is one of the reasons why I support a negative income tax rather than the welfare system we have now that only rewards people who work just enough, but not too much. 

Did you not qualify for federal loans? The requirements for those are much more lenient than the requirements for welfare. There is no cosigner required either, and half of them are subsidized until graduation. Especially since you have certain circumstances involved, if you mention that to your school of interest and on the FAFSA they will work with you independent of the number that you got for your EFC (Expected Family Contribution.)