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Forums - Movies & TV - Who would win: Superman Vs Dr. Manhattan

 

Who wins?

Superman 20 16.81%
 
Doctor Manhattan 89 74.79%
 
Draw 2 1.68%
 
They kill each other 6 5.04%
 
DC wins 2 1.68%
 
Total:119
mysteryman said:
ils411 said:
Batman with his anti-Dr. Manhattan spray

Stay on-topic. Anyone vs. Batman is an even less fair fight.

Even immortal gods cannot touch plot-armour.


Eh... why even bother? if we're talking about powersets and not the character themselves, then theoretically, Dr. Manhattan could, would, and should win no questions asked. Superman's powerset is that of a superfast flying brick while Dr. Manhattan is that of an all powerfull being. Again, powerset vs powerset, all powerfull being would curb stomp and pimp slap a superfast flying brick all day, everyday.

But we're talking about superman. the dood has pulled out some ridiculous shit out of his ass over the course of his history such as vibrating so fast that he can phase, or resisting mater manipulation, resisting high level telephatic assault, tanking and surviving attacks that should have turned him into putty, and even tanking magical base attacks that again should have turned him to ash.

Next to batman, superman is the most craptastic walking plot divices that can pull out powers out of his ass and win the day. 

So like I said, power set vs power set, Dr. Manhattan, but in a comic book fight, Superman would probably pull out some shit that he's immune to "x" power coz..well...he's superman.



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AbbathTheGrim said:
The_Sony_Girl1 said:
mornelithe said:

Dr. Manhattan, theoretically could create a Black Hole inside Superman...or turn his blood into Kryptonite.  Speed doesn't matter when you can not only move instantly, but exist in multiple places at once.  There are limits to Supermans' strength, also.  Dr. Manhattan could theoretically increase his mass to much, much greater than anything Superman could move.

That's the problem with this discussion, Dr. Manhattan simply isn't touchable.

That's the problem. Dr. Manattan wouldn't know what Kryptonite is. And we've never seen Dr. Manhattan make a blackhole, so we can't assume he can. And I doubt that Dr. Manhattan can increase his mass to 5 Sextillion Megatons, which is a big feat for him.

If Doctor Manhattan can manipulate matter he can create a Black Hole, but I don't think he could create a "little Black Hole" inside Superman.

Black Holes are the result of massive stars bending space-time to ridiculous amounts by gravity, once they have fused the atoms (matter) that comprise them all the way from hydrogen to iron.

This is why I don't think Doctor Manhattan can create mini-Black Holes, you see, for example, our Sun is fated to become a White Dwarf after the Sun's mass limits the fusion reaction up to oxygen, becomes a Red Giant and then ends as a White Dwarf. The mass of a star is the one that allows it to become a Black Hole and it has to be at least 5 times bigger than that of our Sun (Earth fits 1,300,000 times inside the Sun) to go Black Hole.

So in order for Mr. Manhattan to create a mini-Black Hole he would need the power to manipulate space-time itself because otherwise with his power of manipulating matter he would need to create a gigantic body of mass to bend space-time for it to create a Black Hole.

I guess Dr. Mahattan could at least grab a huge amount of atoms from neighboring parts of the Universe and turned them into iron and create a Black Hole with Superman in the middle. Superman would no longer have sunlight and he would go through the Black Hole's singularity now reduced to toothpaste.

Unless you believe Mr. Christopher Nolan and as long as Superman flies very fast towards the center of the Black Hole he will be fine and will even learn about "love".

What a complicated convo, Dr. Manhattan should just disperse the atoms that form Superman and get it over with. Like Augen said:

Augen said:
Manhattan can not be defeated by force, he could simply break down any opponent at the atomic level. This "fight" would last exactly as long as Manhattan decided it to last.


Superman has survived black holes before.



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The_Sony_Girl1 said:
AbbathTheGrim said:

Superman has survived black holes before.


Would you imagine superman could survive having all of his atoms turned into cheese, then each atom teleported to centre of random stars throughout the cosmo in the blink of an eye? Because that is the type of power that Dr M is written to have. Speed doesn't do much for you when someone can be everywhere/everytime and being made of "steel" does nothing for you when fighting someone who can turn that steel into flowers as stated.



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This one's going to Superman. Doctor Manhattan has a very impressive power set, but his feats are quite small and his potential/limitations undefined.

Superman tanked a supernova and survived a black hole; the Doctor has never demonstrated destructive capacity anywhere near that scale. Though the Doctor has managed to piece himself back together after being blasted into atoms, the Infinite Mass Punch would reduce the Doctor's quantum state to even more basic components of matter (see: What if Superman Punched You (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-fL8zopddI).

If the Doctor could pull himself back together after that, Superman still has Phantom Zone technology and the means to warp the space-time continuum just by rubbing his hands together and using static electricity. And since the Doc was so decisively outsmarted by a mere human--to such an extent where his ability to "see time" became unreliable--Superman's intelligence and speed are arguably high enough to do the same.



The_Sony_Girl1 said:
AbbathTheGrim said:
The_Sony_Girl1 said:
mornelithe said:

Dr. Manhattan, theoretically could create a Black Hole inside Superman...or turn his blood into Kryptonite.  Speed doesn't matter when you can not only move instantly, but exist in multiple places at once.  There are limits to Supermans' strength, also.  Dr. Manhattan could theoretically increase his mass to much, much greater than anything Superman could move.

That's the problem with this discussion, Dr. Manhattan simply isn't touchable.

That's the problem. Dr. Manattan wouldn't know what Kryptonite is. And we've never seen Dr. Manhattan make a blackhole, so we can't assume he can. And I doubt that Dr. Manhattan can increase his mass to 5 Sextillion Megatons, which is a big feat for him.

If Doctor Manhattan can manipulate matter he can create a Black Hole, but I don't think he could create a "little Black Hole" inside Superman.

Black Holes are the result of massive stars bending space-time to ridiculous amounts by gravity, once they have fused the atoms (matter) that comprise them all the way from hydrogen to iron.

This is why I don't think Doctor Manhattan can create mini-Black Holes, you see, for example, our Sun is fated to become a White Dwarf after the Sun's mass limits the fusion reaction up to oxygen, becomes a Red Giant and then ends as a White Dwarf. The mass of a star is the one that allows it to become a Black Hole and it has to be at least 5 times bigger than that of our Sun (Earth fits 1,300,000 times inside the Sun) to go Black Hole.

So in order for Mr. Manhattan to create a mini-Black Hole he would need the power to manipulate space-time itself because otherwise with his power of manipulating matter he would need to create a gigantic body of mass to bend space-time for it to create a Black Hole.

I guess Dr. Mahattan could at least grab a huge amount of atoms from neighboring parts of the Universe and turned them into iron and create a Black Hole with Superman in the middle. Superman would no longer have sunlight and he would go through the Black Hole's singularity now reduced to toothpaste.

Unless you believe Mr. Christopher Nolan and as long as Superman flies very fast towards the center of the Black Hole he will be fine and will even learn about "love".

What a complicated convo, Dr. Manhattan should just disperse the atoms that form Superman and get it over with. Like Augen said:

Augen said:
Manhattan can not be defeated by force, he could simply break down any opponent at the atomic level. This "fight" would last exactly as long as Manhattan decided it to last.


Superman has survived black holes before.

When?



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archer9234 said:
mountaindewslave said:
The_Sony_Girl1 said:
You guys are seriously underestimating Superman and overestamating Dr. Manhattan.


how? I think the issue is that the lore has made Dr. Manhatten too powerful. he is indestructible. explain to me what Superman would do to defeat Dr. Manhattan. even when he was departiclized into a bunch of pieces in the Watchmen comics he simply put himself right back together. if he can break into a million parts and immediately return back to normal then there is no physical possible way Superman can damage him

 

the reality is that Dr. Manhattan is too powerful, being able to teleport, see the future/past, explode/destroy particles of anything from anywhere, has no weaknesses- it is boring to compare him with ANY superhero or supervillain because he is meant to be a 'God' figure and as such is not your regular comic character

There's a few ways to deal with Manhattan. One requires someone to kill him that isn't known to him. Like someone from another universe. Deconstruct atoms. Or burn off his particles. He doesn't really care about a lot of things. As you can see in the comic or movie. He still fucks up. A person who can see the future. Still doesn't care, and fucks up spectre's life. He's all seeing. Still does it. Which begs the qestion when he complains how he can't remeber being human. Remove your power. If you're all powerful. You can do this. Plothole land. Which can be used to exploit.

Second, go back in time and kill him before birth. Can Manhattan really scan the entire universe and keep track of everyone. At the same time. Multiple universes. Multiple time periods of each one. What about his evil version from an alt dimension. Gladly help out and kill him off. There's some options. But it's really stupid to create characters like him.

Third. Get someone that can't be killed. A real God, for example. Or someone who has very simliar powers like Myxlplyx. And lock him into a spell.

Regarding time travel, that is to say killing someone before they're born, there are two schools of thought and limited to how a writer would write it.

Maybe there can be an infinite number of you throughout space time, so killing the past version of a hero or villain wouldn't actually kill the present version, as there can always be another version of you a nano second later or earlier.  Proceeding back to a previous time in and of itself would create a different universe  and change history would it not?  Someone's mere existence traveling forwards or backwards could create a different universe from the original time.  Who's to say that universe doesn't take its own path separate from the present's?  The Dr. Manhattan or Superman of that time might as well be considered different people from their present counterparts if any tinkering happens.

 

Edit: Regarding changing history, I meant that a specific time could just trail off into another pathway and not effect the future of another universe already established.     



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spurgeonryan said:
batgod said:

a fight between superman prime an doc Manhattan would have been better


From what everyone is saying, even a Superman Prime would just disinegrate. I actually think whoever made Doctor Manhattan just coped out. "Ummmm....I cannot think of anything special, so my Superhero will actually be Jesus Christ, but I'll change his name to Doctor Manhattan."

 

Where does this Doctor Manhattan come from that he can do all of this stuff? Sounds like rubbish. Batman could probably take him out.

Dr. Manhattan is just a plot device from the one-shot series, "Watchmen" and actually the only person with any kind of powers in that whole story.



LMU Uncle Alfred said:
archer9234 said:
mountaindewslave said:
The_Sony_Girl1 said:
You guys are seriously underestimating Superman and overestamating Dr. Manhattan.


how? I think the issue is that the lore has made Dr. Manhatten too powerful. he is indestructible. explain to me what Superman would do to defeat Dr. Manhattan. even when he was departiclized into a bunch of pieces in the Watchmen comics he simply put himself right back together. if he can break into a million parts and immediately return back to normal then there is no physical possible way Superman can damage him

 

the reality is that Dr. Manhattan is too powerful, being able to teleport, see the future/past, explode/destroy particles of anything from anywhere, has no weaknesses- it is boring to compare him with ANY superhero or supervillain because he is meant to be a 'God' figure and as such is not your regular comic character

There's a few ways to deal with Manhattan. One requires someone to kill him that isn't known to him. Like someone from another universe. Deconstruct atoms. Or burn off his particles. He doesn't really care about a lot of things. As you can see in the comic or movie. He still fucks up. A person who can see the future. Still doesn't care, and fucks up spectre's life. He's all seeing. Still does it. Which begs the qestion when he complains how he can't remeber being human. Remove your power. If you're all powerful. You can do this. Plothole land. Which can be used to exploit.

Second, go back in time and kill him before birth. Can Manhattan really scan the entire universe and keep track of everyone. At the same time. Multiple universes. Multiple time periods of each one. What about his evil version from an alt dimension. Gladly help out and kill him off. There's some options. But it's really stupid to create characters like him.

Third. Get someone that can't be killed. A real God, for example. Or someone who has very simliar powers like Myxlplyx. And lock him into a spell.

Regarding time travel, that is to say killing someone before they're born, there are two schools of thought and limited to how a writer would write it.

Maybe there can be an infinite number of you throughout space time, so killing the past version of a hero or villain wouldn't actually kill the present version, as there can always be another version of you a nano second later or earlier.  Proceeding back to a previous time in and of itself would create a different universe  and change history would it not?  Someone's mere existence traveling forwards or backwards could create a different universe from the original time.  Who's to say that universe doesn't take its own path separate from the present's?  The Dr. Manhattan or Superman of that time might as well be considered different people from their present counterparts if any tinkering happens.

 

Edit: Regarding changing history, I meant that a specific time could just trail off into another pathway and not effect the future of another universe already established.     

One version of time travel has to be picked. Either Back To The Future's way. Or parallel universes.  He could be killed via these options. I know the point of the OP is if Superman can do it alone. The answer has to be no to that. He'd need some sort of external help.



Goku > batman > dr. manhattan = superman



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ils411 said:
mysteryman said:
ils411 said:
Batman with his anti-Dr. Manhattan spray

Stay on-topic. Anyone vs. Batman is an even less fair fight.

Even immortal gods cannot touch plot-armour.


Eh... why even bother? if we're talking about powersets and not the character themselves, then theoretically, Dr. Manhattan could, would, and should win no questions asked. Superman's powerset is that of a superfast flying brick while Dr. Manhattan is that of an all powerfull being. Again, powerset vs powerset, all powerfull being would curb stomp and pimp slap a superfast flying brick all day, everyday.

But we're talking about superman. the dood has pulled out some ridiculous shit out of his ass over the course of his history such as vibrating so fast that he can phase, or resisting mater manipulation, resisting high level telephatic assault, tanking and surviving attacks that should have turned him into putty, and even tanking magical base attacks that again should have turned him to ash.

Next to batman, superman is the most craptastic walking plot divices that can pull out powers out of his ass and win the day. 

So like I said, power set vs power set, Dr. Manhattan, but in a comic book fight, Superman would probably pull out some shit that he's immune to "x" power coz..well...he's superman.

I agree. Dr. Manhattan wins hands down based on powers, but there are dodgy ways that Superman could win.