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Forums - Politics Discussion - Another Shooting, Another Gun Free Zone

MikeRox on 20 July 2015
Jimbo1337 said:
MikeRox said:
o_O.Q said:

why not start banning rope, acid, knives etc etc etc?

they can all be used to harm right? and apparently knives kill more than handguns yearly... as i said the problem is not guns and never has been, it is that people sometimes wish to harm other people and its not going to stop

 

Rope, Knives, Acid etc all have purposes beyond killing someone. Not sure what other function a gun serves than to fire a bullet at someone/thing.

Therein lies the difference.

As for the other part of your comment. There is so much ignorance and a complete lack of understanding as to the social circumstances in which dictatorships sieze power that I'm not even going to bother.

You also have tranquilizer, paintball, and taser guns.

Then you have ammunition such as rubber bullets, wax bullets, plastic bullets, beanbag rounds, and ring airfoil projections, which are all non-lethal ammunition that is designed to incapacitate the target.

So how is that ANY different from say a knife?


Tranquilizers are used by Vetenarians to be able to treat animals. Paintballs are paintballs, not sure of the last time I read of someone being shot to death by paintballs. Tasers and all the other ammunition?  Not generally obtainable in most countries (As in you wouldn't find them stocked in general retailers). As you say though, non lethal, so maybe the US should change it so you can only fire those rounds off in your gun? I mean a rubber bullet is certainly going to deter a criminal as much as a real bullet.

How are they ANY different from say a knife? Well I don't know about you, but my my personal knife collection is for preparing food rather than killing people.



RIP Dad 25/11/51 - 13/12/13. You will be missed but never forgotten.

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Jimbo1337 on 20 July 2015
MikeRox said:
Jimbo1337 said:

You also have tranquilizer, paintball, and taser guns.

Then you have ammunition such as rubber bullets, wax bullets, plastic bullets, beanbag rounds, and ring airfoil projections, which are all non-lethal ammunition that is designed to incapacitate the target.

So how is that ANY different from say a knife?


Tranquilizers are used by Vetenarians to be able to treat animals. Paintballs are paintballs, not sure of the last time I read of someone being shot to death by paintballs. Tasers and all the other ammunition?  Not generally obtainable in most countries (As in you wouldn't find them stocked in general retailers). As you say though, non lethal, so maybe the US should change it so you can only fire those rounds off in your gun? I mean a rubber bullet is certainly going to deter a criminal as much as a real bullet.

How are they ANY different from say a knife? Well I don't know about you, but my my personal knife collection is for preparing food rather than killing people.

Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals so that they can be captured and transported to a new location.  They are also used by the military and the police on other humans since there aren't any side effects or signs of overdose when using these immobilizing drugs.

Really?  You don't know the last time that someone got shot by a high velocity paintball gun, otherwise known as a riot gun like the FN303 launcher?  You clearly know absolutely nothing about what you are talking about.

So I gave you a list of non-lethal guns and ammunition and provided you scenarios of how they are used in society today.  

You said:

"Rope, Knives, Acid etc all have purposes beyond killing someone. Not sure what other function a gun serves than to fire a bullet at someone/thing."

So now you can say rope, knives, acid, and guns etc all have purposes beyond killing someone.  I cannot believe that I had to spell that out of you.  -_-

So what do you say about the "personal knife collection" that sliced up 1500 people in 2013 in America?  Did they mistake those human beings as food? 

Are you the knife god and demonstrate/control how every single person uses a knife in this world?   You may use it for chopping up food while others will use it to hunt animals or slice someone up after raping them.



loy310 on 20 July 2015

Already more guns on the street than car in the USA. Let's give everybody a gun and see how that turns out. We already kill about 8k people a year with guns I wonder what would happen if the number of gun owners doubled, gun homicide would drop right?



Aeolus451 on 20 July 2015
mornelithe said:
Aeolus451 said:

It's a common sense right that's instinctual to all of nature. Everything (the majority of life) will defend itself or others' well being if they are in danger. It shoudn't have to be written down for people to respect or understand it.  

You do see the double standard here, right?  Guns do account for thousands of deaths per year in the US, so aren't the proponents of trying to figure out how to solve that, attempting to defend the well-being of those thousands who will undoubtedly die, this year, and the next, and the next?

I'm not saying you're wrong and they're right, or vice versa, just saying people are genuinely concerned.


Yes, I see what you're saying but it's not a double standard. Frankly, it depends on the circumstances of those gun deaths. Some see any gun death as bad but that's not the case in reality. It's not that black and white. If someone kills a person trying to break into their home, it's a justified and it's the right thing to do.  

Alot of the statistics people are using in the thread are gun related only and the majority of it is does not make the distinction between criminal gun deaths and justified gun deaths. Also, people aren't posting any statistics about murder by other means or other kinds of violent crime. It's revelent to this. 



mornelithe on 20 July 2015
Aeolus451 said:
mornelithe said:

You do see the double standard here, right?  Guns do account for thousands of deaths per year in the US, so aren't the proponents of trying to figure out how to solve that, attempting to defend the well-being of those thousands who will undoubtedly die, this year, and the next, and the next?

I'm not saying you're wrong and they're right, or vice versa, just saying people are genuinely concerned.


Yes, I see what you're saying but it's not a double standard. Frankly, it depends on the circumstances of those gun deaths. Some see any gun death as bad but that's not the case in reality. It's not that black and white. If someone kills a person trying to break into their home, it's a justified and it's the right thing to do.  

Alot of the statistics people are using in the thread are gun related only and the majority of it is does not make the distinction between criminal gun deaths and justified gun deaths. Also, people aren't posting any statistics about murder by other means or other kinds of violent crime. It's revelent to this. 

That's not as black and white as you make it out to be, either.  

"Any force used against an intruder must usually be proportionate to the harm that is reasonably perceived."

http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/may-i-shoot-an-intruder.html

But, I understand what you're saying.



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MikeRox on 20 July 2015
Jimbo1337 said:
MikeRox said:


Tranquilizers are used by Vetenarians to be able to treat animals. Paintballs are paintballs, not sure of the last time I read of someone being shot to death by paintballs. Tasers and all the other ammunition?  Not generally obtainable in most countries (As in you wouldn't find them stocked in general retailers). As you say though, non lethal, so maybe the US should change it so you can only fire those rounds off in your gun? I mean a rubber bullet is certainly going to deter a criminal as much as a real bullet.

How are they ANY different from say a knife? Well I don't know about you, but my my personal knife collection is for preparing food rather than killing people.

Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals so that they can be captured and transported to a new location.  They are also used by the military and the police on other humans since there aren't any side effects or signs of overdose when using these immobilizing drugs.

Really?  You don't know the last time that someone got shot by a high velocity paintball gun, otherwise known as a riot gun like the FN303 launcher?  You clearly know absolutely nothing about what you are talking about.

So I gave you a list of non-lethal guns and ammunition and provided you scenarios of how they are used in society today.  

You said:

"Rope, Knives, Acid etc all have purposes beyond killing someone. Not sure what other function a gun serves than to fire a bullet at someone/thing."

So now you can say rope, knives, acid, and guns etc all have purposes beyond killing someone.  I cannot believe that I had to spell that out of you.  -_-

So what do you say about the "personal knife collection" that sliced up 1500 people in 2013 in America?  Did they mistake those human beings as food? 

Are you the knife god and demonstrate/control how every single person uses a knife in this world?   You may use it for chopping up food while others will use it to hunt animals or slice someone up after raping them.


Um... when did it need spelling out to me? I've been saying they had other purposes all along hence why I don't get why they are compared to regular hand guns in these debates. WTF is the point of a gun other than to shoot someone/thing?



RIP Dad 25/11/51 - 13/12/13. You will be missed but never forgotten.

Jimbo1337 on 20 July 2015
MikeRox said:
Jimbo1337 said:

Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals so that they can be captured and transported to a new location.  They are also used by the military and the police on other humans since there aren't any side effects or signs of overdose when using these immobilizing drugs.

Really?  You don't know the last time that someone got shot by a high velocity paintball gun, otherwise known as a riot gun like the FN303 launcher?  You clearly know absolutely nothing about what you are talking about.

So I gave you a list of non-lethal guns and ammunition and provided you scenarios of how they are used in society today.  

You said:

"Rope, Knives, Acid etc all have purposes beyond killing someone. Not sure what other function a gun serves than to fire a bullet at someone/thing."

So now you can say rope, knives, acid, and guns etc all have purposes beyond killing someone.  I cannot believe that I had to spell that out of you.  -_-

So what do you say about the "personal knife collection" that sliced up 1500 people in 2013 in America?  Did they mistake those human beings as food? 

Are you the knife god and demonstrate/control how every single person uses a knife in this world?   You may use it for chopping up food while others will use it to hunt animals or slice someone up after raping them.


Um... when did it need spelling out to me? I've been saying they had other purposes all along hence why I don't get why they are compared to regular hand guns in these debates. WTF is the point of a gun other than to shoot someone/thing?

Go read my entire post starting with "Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals..." because you clearly missed everything that I just wrote...



MikeRox on 20 July 2015
Jimbo1337 said:
MikeRox said:


Um... when did it need spelling out to me? I've been saying they had other purposes all along hence why I don't get why they are compared to regular hand guns in these debates. WTF is the point of a gun other than to shoot someone/thing?

Go read my entire post starting with "Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals..." because you clearly missed everything that I just wrote...


Yeah I did, hadn't realised you were trying to broaden the conversation to include any type of gun rather than the handguns etc which o_O.Q was referring to.

Btw, tranquilizer guns,tasers etc still have no purpose other than to shoot someone/thing. :p



RIP Dad 25/11/51 - 13/12/13. You will be missed but never forgotten.

RG3Hunna on 20 July 2015

Gang bangers all have guns and yet they still can't stop shootings. Doesn't matter if a place is a gun free zone or not, if a crazy person with a gun shoots someone and nobody expects it, innocent people will die.

Nobody is trying to take your guns, they just want to make sure crazy people can not get their hands on guns. The problem is we don't know how to find out who the crazy people are yet but hopefully one day we'll be able too.



Jimbo1337 on 20 July 2015
MikeRox said:
Jimbo1337 said:

Go read my entire post starting with "Tranquilizer guns are used to sedate animals..." because you clearly missed everything that I just wrote...


Yeah I did, hadn't realised you were trying to broaden the conversation to include any type of gun rather than the handguns etc which o_O.Q was referring to.

Btw, tranquilizer guns,tasers etc still have no purpose other than to shoot someone/thing. :p

How is that broadening the conversation on guns by including tranquilizer guns and taser guns in the discussion?  

Then you dismiss and downplay these non-lethal forms of guns by saying that they do what they are designed to do...which is to shoot someone/thing.  I could say the same thing about knives, which has no purpose other than to cut someone/thing :p.

What is your point?