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Forums - Gaming Discussion - I think I found out why Notch sold Minecraft.

sc94597 on 17 July 2015
Hedra42 said:
sc94597 said:

I think from his question he obviously doesn't view autistic as an insult and in fact thinks it has positive advantages. So he probably wouldn't feel all that bad to be honest. Nobody was diagnosing him anyways. There is just the assumption that he has some type of history with autism to pose the question in the first place. Either with himself, or a family member or friend.

@ underlined: There were 3 posts in this thread, one of them from you, suggesting that this kid was autistic.

The "normal child experience" is whatever you think it is. I don't label people into categories of normal and abnormal unless we are talking about Gaussian distributions and a specific trait. Having said that, I think the speech impediments are not generally considered as normal by others.

Speech impediments don't necessarily indicate abnorbalities. With regards to the girl with a rhotacism, (inability to pronounce the letter 'r') it is considered to be one of the last sounds a child learns to pronounce, and some people never do manage to pronounce it. I'm not sure where you're based, but over here we have a T.V. presenter who is well known for that particular speech impediment. It means nothing.

The boy with the lisp - this is very common. Boxer Chris Eubank is very famous for his lisp. It means nothing.

I only heard one other speech problem and the nature of it wasn't clear, since we didn't see the individual. Without more information,  I cannot judge.

Okay, well your point is misplaced. I was specifically talking about the instance when a disorder was brought up, not the various instances where it was not.

My point was initially posted in response to a comment by -CraZed- , which had hinted at diagnosing the kids from the footage, took the thread title literally and then went on to accuse the OP of saying that Notch sold Minecraft because of special needs kids posing cumbersome questions to him. My point was that neither the video nor the thread were targetting or making fun of disabled children. Interesting you should say that it was misplaced, since you quoted and commented on it the first time, and then made the exact same point yourself, later on.

But I think since we're generally in agreement that it isn't the intentions of the video compiler and the OP of the thread that are the problem, it's the ignorance of many of the people who posted remarks on YouTube and in this thread, we can leave it there.

Responses in bold.


Stating a possibility based on inductive logic is not diagnosing somebody. Please become more familiar with the word "diagnosis." 

The speech impediment is an "abnormality" because the majority of people don't have one. There is a reason why such children go through speech therapy. It doesn't mean it is any less real or any less different because it might go away some day. 

You are confounding two separate quote trees. Your original quote in this one is with regards to my quote to ArchangelMaddz. Please review it. 



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Cloudman on 17 July 2015

Wow, what wasn't really bad at all. They asked some weird questions, but nothing cringe-worthy. Though I wonder why they asked a lot of questions about mods...



 

              

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Lastgengamer on 17 July 2015

Geez people, they're just kids, and they probably have more passion for their games of choice then many of those here and YouTube who are wasting time giving them unnecessary hate.



Hedra42 on 18 July 2015
sc94597 said:
Hedra42 said:

Responses in bold.


Stating a possibility based on inductive logic is not diagnosing somebody. Please become more familiar with the word "diagnosis." 

The speech impediment is an "abnormality" because the majority of people don't have one. There is a reason why such children go through speech therapy. It doesn't mean it is any less real or any less different because it might go away some day. 

You are confounding two separate quote trees. Your original quote in this one is with regards to my quote to ArchangelMaddz. Please review it. 

I know the difference between diagnosis and stating possibilities based on inductive logic, thank you, but from the below, you seem to have taken those possibilities and turned them into a diagnosis:

sc94597 said:

The developers obviously didn't know how to answer questions from kids, and particularly the kids in the audience with disorders of various types.

Abnormal or not, speech impediments are not an indication that someone has a social disorder. The kid with the lisp had a broken tooth, ffs.

I did not refer to the original quote in one of the quote trees. I referred to my original point, which is that I don't believe that the video, or this thread had originally been made with the intention of mocking disabled children. It was part of a response to -CraZed-, who first made assumptions about those kids based on those short clips, and then used those assumptions as a basis for accusing the OP of claiming that Notch sold Minecraft because of some questions posed by 'special needs' kids. And since our discussion has been about making assumptions about special needs, it is related.

And while my original response in the quote tree to your comment to ArchangelMaddz initially misinterpreted who's reactions you were talking about, the points I made both before and after you clarified your comment are still relevant to this discussion: the video is nothing more sinister than just a compilation of awkward moments, and it isn't right to assume someone has a disability of some kind based on a few minutes' footage and then use it as an argument against others.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7431836

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7432014

In any event, suggesting that someone has or could have special needs when they might not, especially in a situation where they have zero chance of defending themselves, is no better than mocking those people that do.



sc94597 on 18 July 2015
Hedra42 said:
sc94597 said:
Hedra42 said:

Responses in bold.


Stating a possibility based on inductive logic is not diagnosing somebody. Please become more familiar with the word "diagnosis." 

The speech impediment is an "abnormality" because the majority of people don't have one. There is a reason why such children go through speech therapy. It doesn't mean it is any less real or any less different because it might go away some day. 

You are confounding two separate quote trees. Your original quote in this one is with regards to my quote to ArchangelMaddz. Please review it. 

I know the difference between diagnosis and stating possibilities based on inductive logic, thank you, but from the below, you seem to have taken those possibilities and turned them into a diagnosis:

sc94597 said:

The developers obviously didn't know how to answer questions from kids, and particularly the kids in the audience with disorders of various types.

Abnormal or not, speech impediments are not an indication that someone has a social disorder. The kid with the lisp had a broken tooth, ffs.

I did not refer to the original quote in one of the quote trees. I referred to my original point, which is that I don't believe that the video, or this thread had originally been made with the intention of mocking disabled children. It was part of a response to -CraZed-, who first made assumptions about those kids based on those short clips, and then used those assumptions as a basis for accusing the OP of claiming that Notch sold Minecraft because of some questions posed by 'special needs' kids. And since our discussion has been about making assumptions about special needs, it is related.

And while my original response in the quote tree to your comment to ArchangelMaddz initially misinterpreted who's reactions you were talking about, the points I made both before and after you clarified your comment are still relevant to this discussion: the video is nothing more sinister than just a compilation of awkward moments, and it isn't right to assume someone has a disability of some kind based on a few minutes' footage and then use it as an argument against others.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7431836

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7432014

In any event, suggesting that someone has or could have special needs when they might not, especially in a situation where they have zero chance of defending themselves, is no better than mocking those people that do.

Since when is the discussion limited to social disorders? There are plenty of other disorders to have. The speech impediment itself is a disorder (albeit not a social one.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speech_disorder

Alright and I responded to your point by agreeing, but then stating that targetting children in general isn't any better. You kept focusing on the disabled end of things.

"It wasnt an attack on disabled kids. It was an attack on Minecraft fans, many of whom are kids and don't have the same filters that adults have. Having said that, there have been specific misdirections with regards to disabilities in comments (not outright attacks.) "

Regardless of whether or not the kids truly have disabilities, there have been comments made with regards to disabilities that are quite off and in some ways disgusting. The kids don't need to have disabilities for this to be an issue. For example, I find your assumption that being wrongly assumed to have a disability would be something negative to the kid who asked about autism to imply that autism is a negative thing, when in fact the kid was inquiring about the positive features. That in my opinion, is a poor way to look at the nature of the disorder, it marginalizes the individual for his/her "special needs" rather than his/her wholesome traits.

But that is a very benign example.

Here are some others:

"The kid that asked about autism is a little bitch that i would gladly punch."

"Now it's autism, everybody has 'autism'. It use to be everyone had ADD. "

"It's now socially expectable to ask people if they have autism? I don't any one member of a fandom has every been that bad."

and with regards to the kids in general

" I think I'm having aneurysm out of sheer stupidity."

"I feel so sorry for these kids."

 

 

 

 



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Hedra42 on 18 July 2015
sc94597 said:
Hedra42 said:
sc94597 said:


Stating a possibility based on inductive logic is not diagnosing somebody. Please become more familiar with the word "diagnosis." 

The speech impediment is an "abnormality" because the majority of people don't have one. There is a reason why such children go through speech therapy. It doesn't mean it is any less real or any less different because it might go away some day. 

You are confounding two separate quote trees. Your original quote in this one is with regards to my quote to ArchangelMaddz. Please review it. 

I know the difference between diagnosis and stating possibilities based on inductive logic, thank you, but from the below, you seem to have taken those possibilities and turned them into a diagnosis:

sc94597 said:

The developers obviously didn't know how to answer questions from kids, and particularly the kids in the audience with disorders of various types.

Abnormal or not, speech impediments are not an indication that someone has a social disorder. The kid with the lisp had a broken tooth, ffs.

I did not refer to the original quote in one of the quote trees. I referred to my original point, which is that I don't believe that the video, or this thread had originally been made with the intention of mocking disabled children. It was part of a response to -CraZed-, who first made assumptions about those kids based on those short clips, and then used those assumptions as a basis for accusing the OP of claiming that Notch sold Minecraft because of some questions posed by 'special needs' kids. And since our discussion has been about making assumptions about special needs, it is related.

And while my original response in the quote tree to your comment to ArchangelMaddz initially misinterpreted who's reactions you were talking about, the points I made both before and after you clarified your comment are still relevant to this discussion: the video is nothing more sinister than just a compilation of awkward moments, and it isn't right to assume someone has a disability of some kind based on a few minutes' footage and then use it as an argument against others.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7431836

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=7432014

In any event, suggesting that someone has or could have special needs when they might not, especially in a situation where they have zero chance of defending themselves, is no better than mocking those people that do.

Since when is the discussion limited to social disorders? There are plenty of other disorders to have. The speech impediment itself is a disorder (albeit not a social one.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speech_disorder

Alright and I responded to your point by agreeing, but then stating that targetting children in general isn't any better. You kept focusing on the disabled end of things.

"It wasnt an attack on disabled kids. It was an attack on Minecraft fans, many of whom are kids and don't have the same filters that adults have. Having said that, there have been specific misdirections with regards to disabilities in comments (not outright attacks.) "

Regardless of whether or not the kids truly have disabilities, there have been comments made with regards to disabilities that are quite off and in some ways disgusting. The kids don't need to have disabilities for this to be an issue. For example, I find your assumption that being wrongly assumed to have a disability would be something negative to the kid who asked about autism to imply that autism is a negative thing, when in fact the kid was inquiring about the positive features. That in my opinion, is a poor way to look at the nature of the disorder, it marginalizes the individual for his/her "special needs" rather than his/her wholesome traits.

But that is a very benign example.

Here are some others:

"The kid that asked about autism is a little bitch that i would gladly punch."

"Now it's autism, everybody has 'autism'. It use to be everyone had ADD. "

"It's now socially expectable to ask people if they have autism? I don't any one member of a fandom has every been that bad."

and with regards to the kids in general

" I think I'm having aneurysm out of sheer stupidity."

"I feel so sorry for these kids."

@ the bolded, I think you missed the point when you made that statement in the first place. As I have stated numerous times already, I was targetting my point at the post I'd originally responded to. This was CrAzEd's post which first casually diagnosed these kids as being disabled, and then based on that casual diagnosis, went on to accuse the OP of shaming disabled kids. If we're talking at cross purposes, then it's probably best for you to drop it.

@ the underlined, again, you have misunderstood. If my eldest kid, who is not autistic, asked a question like that, and then people started debating whether or not he was autistic because of asking that question, he'd be very upset. Where I think you have failed to understand where I'm coming from is that for a kid to be told they have a disability when they do not have one can have a terrible impact on them. It's as bad as mocking kids in general, whether they have a disability or not.

You are right that kids don't need to have disabilities for making fun of them to become an issue, but some people in this thread have taken it upon themselves to diagnose some of these kids as having disabilities to make it into a bigger issue than it needs to be. This self-righteous attitude is what I have a problem with.

So again, if this means we are talking at cross purposes, then I would urge you to drop it.

To conclude, I refer you back to the links to my previous posts - please read them carefully if you are going to reply again, because they are quite clear as to where my arguments are directed. I have deliberately reacted with silence towards the more ignorant and egregious comments throughout this thread, (some of which you have quoted) because they speak more about the people who posted them than the people they are directed at, and I'm not going to waste my time on them.



stuffmakesmelol on 18 July 2015

I can't watch this entire video without losing my sanity. Seriously, a question about autism in a Minecraft convention?