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Forums - Politics Discussion - Is this round of Presidential Candidates the Worst America has ever had? Hold your breath world!

Meh, it's waaaaayyyy too early to pay this much attention. I usually wait until two weeks before the primary, and a month before the election before I really focus and do research.



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I'm pretty excited about Bernie Sanders. So much so that I really can't even understand how this thread got made. He's energizing and coming out of left field. He's making Hillary have to adjust and as much as I would love the opportunity to vote for a woman (Elizabeth Warren), I'm not at all inspired to vote for Hillary. She's too tied in to the system at this point.

Regarding the Republican field...yeah, that's a pretty mixed bag. It'll be fun to watch, though, as Jeb and Trump trade barbs. The usual backdrop of conservative to ultra-conservative candidates is difficult to focus too much energy on as they usually put their feet in each other's mouths.

Obviously my bias shows...but I just don't think this year looks any less entertaining (both politically and comically) than others. Sometimes our general malaise and boredom makes us paint all the world with that brush.



gergroy said:
SocialistSlayer said:

so deleting emails, after being supoenaed is fine. lying and covering up is fine, breaking the law is fine. and you are just going to trust she turned over everthing relevent, scouts honor


She didn't delete emails after she was subpoenaed, she had deleted then we'll before then.  You guys are just buying into the politicized story.

Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton wiped her private email server clean and did not turn over a single new email to the House Select Benghazi Committee after it subpoenaed Clinton’s private emails, according to 
Rep. Trey Gowdy (R-S
, who chairs the Committee.
Gowdy said he learned on Friday that Clinton “unilaterally decided to wipe her server clean and permanently delete all emails from her personal server.”
“While it is not clear precisely when Secretary Clinton decided to permanently delete all emails from her server, it appears she made the decision after October 28, 2014, when the Department of State for the first time asked the Secretary to return her public record to the Department,”  
Gowdy, saying that Clinton should not be able to essentially grade her own papers, had also requested that Clinton turn over her server to a third-party arbiter, but Clinton refused. Gowdy has said that Congress may take legal action to get Clinton’s server, and he said that he and the House leadership are considering the “next steps” in the matter.
“After seeking and receiving a two week extension from the Committee, Secretary Clinton failed to provide a single new document to the subpoena issued by the Committee and refused to provide her private server to the Inspector General for the State Department or any other independent arbiter for analysis,” Gowdy said. “In light of the Secretary’s unprecedented email arrangement with herself and her decision nearly two years after she left office to permanently delete all emails… we will work with the leadership of the House of Representatives as the Committee considers next steps.”
Gowdy has previously said that there were “huge gaps” in the emails the Committee has received from Clinton, who admitted that she deleted more than 30,000 emails that she and her team deemed to be “personal” and not “work-related.”

“There are gaps of months and months and months. And if you think to that iconic picture of her on a C-17 flying to Libya, she has sunglasses on and she has her handheld device in her hand, we have no e-mails from that day. In fact, we have no e-mails from that trip,” Gowdy said in a recent appearance on CBS’s Face the Nation. “So, it’s strange credibility to believe that if you’re on your way to Libya to discuss Libyan policy that there’s not a single document that has been turned over to Congress. So, there are huge gaps. And with respect to the president, it’s not up to Secretary Clinton to decide what is a public record and what’s not.”
and as for the emails beign "saved on the other end"
In a letter provided to the committee, Kendall said Clinton would not be turning over the server to a third-party for review and that the emails no longer exist on the private server located in her New York home.

 

“There is no basis to support the proposed third-party review of the server that hosted the hdr22@clintonemail.com account,” Kendall wrote. “To avoid prolonging a discussion that would be academic, I have confirmed with the secretary’s IT support that no emails…..for the time period January 21, 2009 through February 1, 2013 reside on the server or on any back-up systems associated with the server.”



Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/03/gowdy-clinton-wiped-her-server-clean-116472.html#ixzz3fheUrcYm



 

Normchacho said:

Probably not. I mean...Andrew Jackson beat somebody.

As for this round of candidates; 

I like Bernie Sanders, he doesn't bullshit and I like a lot of his ideas. But he's just too liberal for America.

Hllary Clinton is pretty moderate and obviously has the Clinton name behind her. But she just isn't likable, at least not to me.

Jebb Bush is going to spend this whole campaign trying to make sure nobody ties him to his brother. He will likely end up being the republican candidate for president though.

Trump is an idiot who is only popular right now because he's making a big fuss and has managed to snag the super-conservative crowd for the moment. Democrats should hope to god that he wins the republican nomination because it would pretty much guarentee another democratic president.


Andrew Jackson's rival campaign brought up the fact that his marriage to Rachel Robards wasn't technically legal when it was first made. That was due to her first husband falsely having the local newspaper print a notice of divorce when he never finalized it, so the Jacksons actually married in good faith, and by the time Jackson was actually running for President Rachel Jackson's divorce had been finalized and they were legally married. Yet, his political rivals accused them of bigamy and shacking up. Twenty years earlier, Jackson shot Charles Dickinson dead in a duel over accusations that Rachel was a bigamist. Meanwhile, John Quincy Adams was accused of running illegal gambling operations on public money and handing over an American woman for sexual slavery to the Czar of Russia.  And thus modern campaigning was born.

Trump has always been a master manipulator. He's also been a running joke as for over thirty years. A certain loud contingent of the populace is hoping for a Reagan-style landslide with him.



SanAndreasX said:
Normchacho said:

Probably not. I mean...Andrew Jackson beat somebody.

As for this round of candidates; 

I like Bernie Sanders, he doesn't bullshit and I like a lot of his ideas. But he's just too liberal for America.

Hllary Clinton is pretty moderate and obviously has the Clinton name behind her. But she just isn't likable, at least not to me.

Jebb Bush is going to spend this whole campaign trying to make sure nobody ties him to his brother. He will likely end up being the republican candidate for president though.

Trump is an idiot who is only popular right now because he's making a big fuss and has managed to snag the super-conservative crowd for the moment. Democrats should hope to god that he wins the republican nomination because it would pretty much guarentee another democratic president.


Andrew Jackson's rival campaign brought up the fact that his marriage to Rachel Robards wasn't technically legal when it was first made. That was due to her first husband falsely having the local newspaper print a notice of divorce when he never finalized it, so the Jacksons actually married in good faith, and by the time Jackson was actually running for President Rachel Jackson's divorce had been finalized and they were legally married. Yet, his political rivals accused them of bigamy and shacking up. Twenty years earlier, Jackson shot Charles Dickinson dead in a duel over accusations that Rachel was a bigamist. Meanwhile, John Quincy Adams was accused of running illegal gambling operations on public money and handing over an American woman for sexual slavery to the Czar of Russia.  And thus modern campaigning was born.

Trump has always been a master manipulator. He's also been a running joke as for over thirty years. A certain loud contingent of the populace is hoping for a Reagan-style landslide with him.

Yeah, see...I think we're doing alright. Nobody has even TRIED to anybody.



Bet with Adamblaziken:

I bet that on launch the Nintendo Switch will have no built in in-game voice chat. He bets that it will. The winner gets six months of avatar control over the other user.

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gergroy said:
Jimbo1337 said:

You basically just demonstrated that you know absolutely nothing.  If this was something that is SO overblown, then why is Hillary Clinton deliberately avoiding the media and not answering any questions.  Why isn't she speaking out about it and clearing up these "overblown controversies"?

Here are just a few of Hillary's accomplishments:

1.) Using a personal email server in order to hide her activities and not be held accountable for her actions.  This is illegal under the Freedom of Information Act.

2.) Hillary is also being bought by not only foreign governments such as Saudi Arabia, but major corporations as well.  It is now a fact that Saudi Arabia has beheaded more people than ISIS this year.  This is a gross violation of human rights but it was not mentioned even once by the US mainstream media.  She aso received from Saudi Arabia $500k worth of jewelry. So she's obviously being bribed.  

3.)  Just look at Algeria giving the Clinton foundation Half a billion dollars for earthquake relief in Haiti.  Why didn't Algeria just give it straight to Haiti instead of going through the Clinton Foundation?  So now the Clinton Foundation is acknowledging that this 2010 $500 million dollar 'donation' broke the Obama Administration agreement.

So please, go vote for the lying scumbag that is Hillary Clinton.  Please, go vote for someone who said this about the Benghazi attacks:

Clinton: With all due respect, the fact is we had four dead Americans. Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided that they'd they go kill some Americans? What difference at this point does it make?


Lol, the only thing this tells me is you have listened to one side of a very politicized story and completely ignored the other side.  This is the problem with politics in America.  A lot of People only have the ability to listen to one side.  Then you get all these "controversies" that aren't actually controversies thrown around and people just buy right into them.

 

honestly, I'm not a fan of Hillary as I said in my original statement, but I really don't care that she deleted her email server.  All her government emails would be saved on the other end anyway, and she turned over thousands that weren't.  Why would I need to see who else she emailed on her private email?  We don't require politicians to record their phone calls, so why is it such a big deal that we have every last email?  It isn't the only form of communication.  It is a nothing issue that has been overblown.  

The clinton foundation and Saudi Arabia stuff is just conspiracy theory crap.  It is a charity that Bill runs, does a ton of good.  

the clinton foundation is a scam, they dont do others then themself good. they just spent a mini fraction of the money on heling people, the most is for other expenses.



Normchacho said:

Yeah, see...I think we're doing alright. Nobody has even TRIED to anybody.


Hell, Alexander Hamilton was killed in a duel by sittint VICE PRESIDENT Aaron Burr in 1804. Nobody batted an eye, Burr was never charged. Dueling was just the way they settled personal disagreements back in the day. :)



sundin13 said:
teigaga said:


That wouldn't actually prove much other then that the average person isn't a raging sexist, which isn't what Patriachy is about. It'd be like assuming that systematic racism isn't a problem because Obama is president. 

Essentially our systems were built on certain prejudices and the basis of those still effects society today, it shouldn't always even be drawn into negative/positive. Say for example you had a bunch of children look at two smartly dressed adults, one female, one male and you asked them who is the boss and who is the employer. If the majority presumed the male to be the boss, that would support the argument of us living in Patriachy as the children would associate the males with authority/power. It doesn't mean that Women can never be bosses or be in positions of power/authority or that they're never favoured when compared to men (say art, caregiver or organisational roles). 


The feminist definition of patriarchy is essentially the idea that the fabric of our society and the systems within it are designed in a way that represses women and boosts up men, often used synonymously with "male supremacy". We do not live in a patriarchy. Your seemingly unsourced claim, which largely plays off the reality of the world, is in no way proof that we live in a male supremacist society.

Where did I try to prove we live in Patriachy? The point is a women being in power isn't going to change the "feminist" opinion, because their definition doesn't rely on the idea that women cannot achieve power, but that society makes it harder for them to do so and undermines their power more frequently then it does men. 

I provided you with a hypothetical situation so there is nothing to source. If it plays of the "reality of the world", well that kind of reinforces the point. Whether people find issue with the reality is a completely different question, I never said it was good or bad thing but simply that it would fit the description of a Patriachy which in itself is a description not a word based in morally judgment

 "Patriarchy is a social system in which males hold primary power, predominate in roles of political leadership, moral authority, social privilege and control of property"

Source: 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriarchy



Bernie Sanders is the most interesting candidate in AGES and is driving the discussion the way we need it to be driven.



chapset said:
In the end it's going to be bush vs clinton

Kind of a rematch from 1991... although the protagonists have changed a bit