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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - NX will be a flop if release in 2016

 

Do you agree?

Yes 170 66.93%
 
No 84 33.07%
 
Total:254
Soundwave said:
JNK said:

not sure if this will work. We got the 8GB and 32 Gb wii u which at least goes in the same direction (8gb cheaper for casuals, 32gb more expensive for hardcores) but it doesnt worked well. 

Im sure it doesnt matter what nintendo is doing, their image is bad and they dont have the capabilieties to support their system enough to compensate the lack of third party.

One big third party publisher (like Square enix) showed more aaa games as nintendo. If one publisher is even better then you, how will you win against all of them?

 

Also nintendo have enough money to make the wii u still a sucsess. Get alot exclusives deals, bring the AAA 3rd on the system (pay of them) and more. But they decided not to do so.


They will get third party support if they go the multiple device ecosystem approach. 

Because Japanese developers will support it just to get their games on the Nintendo handheld if nothing else, but all those games will then also be playable on the home version. 

And Square-Enix will support it too. 

They should change the rules of the game. Just because they've done things a certain way for 30 years doesn't mean it was going to be done that way forever. 

I think their best bet is to making a bleeding edge portable ... 600 GFLOPS or so. Then make a cheap, family console version. And then a higher end home version that's more powerful than the PS4 that runs games at 1080P. 

Games scale up and down, but they are playable on all devices. No more Mario 3D Land and Mario 3D World, there is just one Mario 3D game and it works on both. 

Third parties would support the Wii U if it had the 3DS' userbase (50+ million), but the 3DS has the userbase but doesn't have the hardware power. Wii U has OK hardware power but doesn't have the userbase. Unified platform solves this problem. 


You do realise that an ecossystem like you describe would make developers lives a living hell right ? Making a game that can scale down to a somewhat crappy hardware and all the way up to a super powerfull one and function properly on everyone of them would make game development incredibly hard and expensive.



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hansrob00 said:

3rd party publishers are desperate for money because the video game market is very competitive. With that said, Nintendo is probably preparing their major ips for a 2016 date with the release of the NX. I think they probably already have a number of 3rd party publishers on board, at least at launch. I think they are banking on doing a strong launch with their IPs combined with initial 3rd support (even the wii u had 3rd party support at launch). Assuming the launch goes well and sales remain strong for the initial 6 months which their initial offerings combined with initial 3rd parties should help, 3rd parties will begin putting their games on their platform as long as their new console or NX ecosystem sales remain healthy.  At least this is Nintendo's hopes I believe.


Third party developers can get all the money they need from other consoles without the greif of having to develop the game for multiple specifications. You can't possibly how much you're underplaying the added time and expense of developing for multiple specifications. It's practically the same thing as developing a multiplatform game, except it's just one platform. It would go over like a Lead Zeppelin.

Like seriously guys? You think one of the consoles is going to be a tablet? Are you thinking Wii U gamepad or iPad type of tablet, because if its the later, you could have the develop and test touch controls just for that version. You think one verison is going to be some super high specd beast that will be able to duke it out spec wise with any other console? Awesome! Good luck essentially making an HD remake WHILE you're developing the core game. Its absolutely ridiculous what you're suggesting. It is never going to happen.

Maybe, *maybe* there is a handheld and a home consoles that accepts the same game cartridges/disks. Maybe. But they would be remarkably similar in the sense that the NX console controller would more or less have to have the exact same number of buttons and layout of the NX handheld. The specifications would have to be practically identical, the only difference being that the home console outputs the game to the TV at HD and the handheld outputs it to a screen size resolution. If that is pretty much the only difference between the two, maybe it's possible. Maybe. But you would still be literally doubling most of the development costs.

Then either your handheld is going to cost and arm and a leg, or your home console is going to be cheap as dirt. There will be no tablet version. There will be no "hardcore, higher spec'd" version. That absolutely, 100% will not happen. If they do do this, and the graphical fidelity isn't at least as good as the PS4 and X1 are at the time, and the developer tools aren't improved dramatically, it will be the biggest Nintendo failure yet.

This is such an ambitious idea, and look at Nintendo's track record. Why on earth do you guys think Nintendo can actually pull this off well? Their network play finally rivals that of of Xbox Live! ...for the original xbox. Their developer tools are worst than a joke, because no one is laughing when they have to use them. This would require developing very close partnerships with your third parties, something Nitendo, historically has been pretty terrible at maintaining if they can establish one in the first place. Maybe it can be done, maybe such a concept could be pulled off successfully, but not by Nintendo.



JNK said:

Nintendo fans will get less and less because nintendo do so much to fck them up. Actual wii u owners are the biggest nintendo fans out there. And what is nintendo doing? Dont release any more games in 2016, dont released games in 2013, dont released games first half 2015. Thats less then 2 Years Software support to be honest. Im a big nintendo fan but im not blind. Sony and MS exclusives lineup this holilday is way better then nintendos. And they even have all the third partys support nintendo will never get. Im sure many wii u owners will switch to other consoles if nintendo really bring nx in 2016 (and it looks like that) and dont bring much more games on wii u. You shouldnt fck up your loyaliest fans nintendo. 

Yeah, people keep saying "oh it doesn't matter if they alienate the Wii U userbase, cos it's only 10m gamers", but the thing is, that 10m encompasses Nintendo's most dedicated and loyal fans who have stuck with them through thick and thin. If they lose their shrinking core of loyalists, they're fucked.



potato_hamster said:
Darwinianevolution said:
Soundwave said:
JNK said:

not sure if this will work. We got the 8GB and 32 Gb wii u which at least goes in the same direction (8gb cheaper for casuals, 32gb more expensive for hardcores) but it doesnt worked well. 

Im sure it doesnt matter what nintendo is doing, their image is bad and they dont have the capabilieties to support their system enough to compensate the lack of third party.

One big third party publisher (like Square enix) showed more aaa games as nintendo. If one publisher is even better then you, how will you win against all of them?

 

Also nintendo have enough money to make the wii u still a sucsess. Get alot exclusives deals, bring the AAA 3rd on the system (pay of them) and more. But they decided not to do so.


They will get third party support if they go the multiple device ecosystem approach. 

Because Japanese developers will support it just to get their games on the Nintendo handheld if nothing else, but all those games will then also be playable on the home version. 

And Square-Enix will support it too. 

They should change the rules of the game. Just because they've done things a certain way for 30 years doesn't mean it was going to be done that way forever. 

I think their best bet is to making a bleeding edge portable ... 600 GFLOPS or so. Then make a cheap, family console version. And then a higher end home version that's more powerful than the PS4 that runs games at 1080P. 

Games scale up and down, but they are playable on all devices. No more Mario 3D Land and Mario 3D World, there is just one Mario 3D game and it works on both. 

Third parties would support the Wii U if it had the 3DS' userbase (50+ million), but the 3DS has the userbase but doesn't have the hardware power. Wii U has OK hardware power but doesn't have the userbase. Unified platform solves this problem. 

This. I think the Fusion idea would be perfect for Nintendo. Their software would be able to sell on two devices at the same time. Whatever is lost in hardware sale could be compensated on software. Companies that traditionally support handhelds could expand their userbase to home consoles. Western developers wouldn't care that much, but they don't care for Nintendo already, so it's not a big loss. If you get SE, Capcom, Sega-Atlus, TecmoKoei, Namco... The console would attract suddenly to people that love japanese games, even if PS has a firm grasp on that market too.


Do you guys know anything about console video game development? Do you guys know anything about the costs associated with developing for more than one platform or spec? Do you guys have any idea have such a move would lead to the complete and utter abandonment of third parties? Anyone?

You guys need to let this idea go, and let it go quickly. Before you go saying something along the lines of games "scaling up and down". It simply does not work that way, and even if it did, it would require tremendously good developer tools, and Nintendo's developer tools are the absolute worst, and I really do mean the worst by a country mile. It's almost twice as hard to make a game run well on the Wii U than it is to make it run well on the PS4.  Now you need to make a game run well on three or four specs? Forget it. Absolutely forget it. Third parties wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.


because you are talking about Wii U developer kit which is under IBM PowerPC against X1 and PS4 x86 architecture which is really different.  The topic is NX, if NX adopts the x86 archictecture, scaling down and up the graphics for power consumption and other things, it is possible. hence 3rd party would really come to NX.  If Nintendo decides to go to the x86 route.



oniyide said:
PenguinZ said:


They should show that they can competently support their own system. For the most part this generation, they really haven't.


after all this time you think they are going to start NOW? cause after yesterday i dont think they are going to


they are on a short term duration for Wii U games.  not way longer than 2016, which many have speculated the release of NX.  main issue would really be based on the title thread is, does Nintendo do a Saturn like Sega. 3+ years support and abandon Wii U. we don't know, people are speculating too much. Nintendo said e3 is for upcoming games for 2015 and early 2016.  i'm not a day 1 buyer anyway, so let's just wait and see. 



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potato_hamster said:
hansrob00 said:

3rd party publishers are desperate for money because the video game market is very competitive. With that said, Nintendo is probably preparing their major ips for a 2016 date with the release of the NX. I think they probably already have a number of 3rd party publishers on board, at least at launch. I think they are banking on doing a strong launch with their IPs combined with initial 3rd support (even the wii u had 3rd party support at launch). Assuming the launch goes well and sales remain strong for the initial 6 months which their initial offerings combined with initial 3rd parties should help, 3rd parties will begin putting their games on their platform as long as their new console or NX ecosystem sales remain healthy.  At least this is Nintendo's hopes I believe.


Third party developers can get all the money they need from other consoles without the greif of having to develop the game for multiple specifications. You can't possibly how much you're underplaying the added time and expense of developing for multiple specifications. It's practically the same thing as developing a multiplatform game, except it's just one platform. It would go over like a Lead Zeppelin.

Like seriously guys? You think one of the consoles is going to be a tablet? Are you thinking Wii U gamepad or iPad type of tablet, because if its the later, you could have the develop and test touch controls just for that version. You think one verison is going to be some super high specd beast that will be able to duke it out spec wise with any other console? Awesome! Good luck essentially making an HD remake WHILE you're developing the core game. Its absolutely ridiculous what you're suggesting. It is never going to happen.

Maybe, *maybe* there is a handheld and a home consoles that accepts the same game cartridges/disks. Maybe. But they would be remarkably similar in the sense that the NX console controller would more or less have to have the exact same number of buttons and layout of the NX handheld. The specifications would have to be practically identical, the only difference being that the home console outputs the game to the TV at HD and the handheld outputs it to a screen size resolution. If that is pretty much the only difference between the two, maybe it's possible. Maybe. But you would still be literally doubling most of the development costs.

Then either your handheld is going to cost and arm and a leg, or your home console is going to be cheap as dirt. There will be no tablet version. There will be no "hardcore, higher spec'd" version. That absolutely, 100% will not happen. If they do do this, and the graphical fidelity isn't at least as good as the PS4 and X1 are at the time, and the developer tools aren't improved dramatically, it will be the biggest Nintendo failure yet.

This is such an ambitious idea, and look at Nintendo's track record. Why on earth do you guys think Nintendo can actually pull this off well? Their network play finally rivals that of of Xbox Live! ...for the original xbox. Their developer tools are worst than a joke, because no one is laughing when they have to use them. This would require developing very close partnerships with your third parties, something Nitendo, historically has been pretty terrible at maintaining if they can establish one in the first place. Maybe it can be done, maybe such a concept could be pulled off successfully, but not by Nintendo.

it already happened, GC was high spec'd than PS2 that time. the thing that got Nintendo way off is the purple cube design which is too kiddie and nobody adopted into it.



curl-6 said:
JNK said:

Nintendo fans will get less and less because nintendo do so much to fck them up. Actual wii u owners are the biggest nintendo fans out there. And what is nintendo doing? Dont release any more games in 2016, dont released games in 2013, dont released games first half 2015. Thats less then 2 Years Software support to be honest. Im a big nintendo fan but im not blind. Sony and MS exclusives lineup this holilday is way better then nintendos. And they even have all the third partys support nintendo will never get. Im sure many wii u owners will switch to other consoles if nintendo really bring nx in 2016 (and it looks like that) and dont bring much more games on wii u. You shouldnt fck up your loyaliest fans nintendo. 

Yeah, people keep saying "oh it doesn't matter if they alienate the Wii U userbase, cos it's only 10m gamers", but the thing is, that 10m encompasses Nintendo's most dedicated and loyal fans who have stuck with them through thick and thin. If they lose their shrinking core of loyalists, they're fucked.


10mil is not even close enough to be viable



As I have pointed out 2016 will be a difficult year.

$299 PS4:
- Uncharted 4
- Street Fighter V
- Ratchet & Clank
- Star Ocean 5
- Horizon
- The Last Guardian

$249 Xbox One:
- Quantum break.
- Crackdown 3
- Gears 4

And lots of third party support who arent coming back to Nintendo home console. If Wii U successor releases in 2016 then it will be like dreamcast. Nintendo cant repeat Wii U like commercial failure for its brand value.



oniyide said:
curl-6 said:

Yeah, people keep saying "oh it doesn't matter if they alienate the Wii U userbase, cos it's only 10m gamers", but the thing is, that 10m encompasses Nintendo's most dedicated and loyal fans who have stuck with them through thick and thin. If they lose their shrinking core of loyalists, they're fucked.

10mil is not even close enough to be viable

Not on its own, but that's why you're supposed to expand your audience by drawing in customers outside the core fanbase, something Nintendo refuses to do. That core fanbase is their emergency safety net, it's all that stands between them and oblivion.



JNK said:

Hell MS/Sony got a better first party support this holiday as nintendo and they got all the third party support addional. This is ridicoulus. 


Can you name the Sony first party support for this holiday season?  Please let me know what they've got coming first party this year...I'll wait

 

By the way Nintendo released 4 games in Quarter 3 & 4 last year for Wii U (Super Smash Bros, Bayonetta 2, Hyrule Warriors and Captain Toad) this year they have a planned 7 releases which include Xenoblade Chronicles X, Star Fox Zero, Yoshi's Woolly World, Mario Tennis Ultra Smash, Fatal Frame, Devil's Third and Animal Crossing amiibo Party.    So there's more coming this year than last year...why didn't you just abandon ship last year?   Zelda U got delayed, that hurt this years releases, oh well.