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Forums - Sony Discussion - the appeal of ff 7 remake and tlg?

theprof00 on 19 June 2015

tlg will probably sell as well as journey, as I see them selling to very similar userbases.
shenmue, well, I really have no idea how much that can sell.
ff7 though? 10m easily



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think-man on 20 June 2015

One of the greatest best selling jrpgs of all time...makes sense to me. Tlg not so much



 

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Fusioncode on 20 June 2015

Because Fumito Ueda made Shadow of the Colossus. I'd be excited for anything he's working on.



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pauluzzz1981 on 20 June 2015

after i saw the gameplay video of tlg i'm not convinced. I hope the ff7 remake/remaster will do the trick.



DraconianAC on 20 June 2015

A long time ago in 1998 I was lent 3 video games by my friends who found out I just bought a new very expensive computer. The games where: Total Annihilation, Starcraft, and Final Fantasy 7 for the PC. I started with Total Annihilation for hours and didn't touch the rest until I remember a PSX commercial for FF7 where it called the protagonist a "Soldier of Fortune" and had FMV of Cloud escaping a building with a motorcycle. That made me put down Total Annihilation to never again pick up both of those RTS Games until had beaten and sunk in over 100+ hours on FF7.

The game was like a virtual interactive novel for me, and not only that, It had plot twists that my 17 year old mind never saw coming. It was a ride that I'll treasure forever. The plot twist at Nibelheim was what cemented me as a fan of the series.

Time has been harsh on the graphics and translation, but the game does not need a remake. I actually am dreading the decision that they took, but that still won't stop from buying it day one. Damn you Square, you best not change the ending. Cloud & Tifa forever!!

Edited for grammar.



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Headshot on 20 June 2015
Roronaa_chan said:
Headshot said:

 Taking over a decade to release a game after their last is not exactly the definition of a world class studio even if there last two games were very good.


If QB releases in 2016 Remedy will have gone 13 years with only one game released.. Alan wake came out 7 years after MP2, and might I add that the final product was nothing like what they had promised/sold early on, having cut and trimmed so much, while TLG looks to be exactly what it always was.


Its as if you think I'm trying to argue that Remedy is a world class studio. I'm not but I think ICO and Remedy are definitely both the same in stature and are good studios but just not top tier. Trying to spin Remedy into being as lazy as Team ICO have been in the last decade is lost on me. 1 game in 13 years (actually will be 12 but whatever) will turn into 3 games within 13 years if QB releases anytime before October next year and 4 games within 15 years if it releases before July.



Davman on 20 June 2015

Sure because a game didn't sell many millions like cod and assassin's creed is niche.
The logic what sells more is better is sh@t.



Roronaa_chan on 20 June 2015
Headshot said:


Its as if you think I'm trying to argue that Remedy is a world class studio. I'm not but I think ICO and Remedy are definitely both the same in stature and are good studios but just not top tier. Trying to spin Remedy into being as lazy as Team ICO have been in the last decade is lost on me. 1 game in 13 years (actually will be 12 but whatever) will turn into 3 games within 13 years if QB releases anytime before October next year and 4 games within 15 years if it releases before July.

Nobody said anything about laziness. And I wasn't even trying to make any point at all, simply showing that you didn't have one.



Headshot on 20 June 2015
Roronaa_chan said:
Headshot said:


Its as if you think I'm trying to argue that Remedy is a world class studio. I'm not but I think ICO and Remedy are definitely both the same in stature and are good studios but just not top tier. Trying to spin Remedy into being as lazy as Team ICO have been in the last decade is lost on me. 1 game in 13 years (actually will be 12 but whatever) will turn into 3 games within 13 years if QB releases anytime before October next year and 4 games within 15 years if it releases before July.

Nobody said anything about laziness. And I wasn't even trying to make any point at all, simply showing that you didn't have one.

 Don't really understand what you're trying to do to be honest. Simply spinning things to make it seem like Remedy haven't released many games and that there output is as low as Team ICO's disproves absolutely nothing because that was not my point. 

"Taking over a decade to release a game after their last is not the definition of a world class studio." I don't understand how talking about how Remedy don't release many games either disproves this point or is "simply showing that i didn't have one."



Headshot on 20 June 2015
Kyuu said:


I'm not gauging the difference in quality between Remedy and Team ICO using each determiner separately. The quality gap comes from the "combined" result of the three objective determiners I used (namely.. Awards, Reception and Influence)

Awards:
The original Max Payne did win a lot of them, yes. But context is important and you're ignoring it. Awards don't mean much when most have an "on PC/2001" written next to them. Sorry but 2001 sucked for PC so these awards aren't much to write home about. ICO had to compete with MGS2, GTA3, SSBB and Halo CE.. the poor thing.. but SoTC didn't just win a GOTY award in the presence of God of War and Resident Evil 4.. it took an extra step and won IGN's best PS2 game ever and later stepped it up even further by winning the runner-up award of IGN's Game of the Decade and on any system!! Well, IGN is the most popular game website out there. That's what I'd call an Award! It was chosen out of, how many? 7000+ games across 10 platforms?

Reception:
Max Payne's metascore dropped from 89 down to 86 for the 2nd entry thanks to 5 "Mixed" reviews out of 46, making it 5 points lower than SoTC (team ICO's second game) which is fairly significant.

Influence:
I'm sure you're aware of the difference here. ICO slaughters most critically acclaimed games of its generation. Not only did it influence some of the greatest games and game creators, but also trespassed its medium to influence big budget film directors. SoTC did a good job there too. Both games have also seen numerous citings by universities and authors as best examples of Art in Video games.

And you admit that Alan Wake wasn't half as hyped up as The Last Guardian. Doesn't this imply that Team ICO mean more to their fans than what Remedy meant to their fans?

I'd like to throw in one more factor called "Aging" which ICO and SoTC did exceptinally well at.. many of the games that were rated higher at the time were soon ranked WAY below them. These games grow on you.

I've played hundreds of games so by "top favorites" I don't mean 5 or 10 but around 30 or 50. ICO and SoTC are more frequenly mentioned in these lists than Remedy's which seem to have been mostly forgotten over the time. At least relatively.

When all of what I mentioned is taken into considertation, it becomes clear that Team-ICO is a level above Remedy. This doens't mean I hate Remedy, this doesn't mean Remedy is trash. It rather means it isn't exactly as special, as loved or as respected. Yes Team-ICO did screw themselves up by not releasing anything last generation but in no way does this reduce the impact of their previous works.


So we are going from May Payne having not nearly as much awards to having awards with no significance? I'll admit SOTC is a step above the Max Payne games in terms of awards, reception and influence but I'm just not willing to accept that ICO is any signifcant step above Max payne. They are around the same in terms of awards, reception and influence with Max payne having a few more awards in 2001 and ICO having more influence as time goes on. 

The main reasoning behind me seeing both the studios at the same level is that while SOTC and ICO may have more of an influence and have got a tad more awards than both the Max Payne games, its not as if they completely smash the Max payne games out of the park. Plus the fact that they have taken so long to release TLG which I know a lot of people have been upset about wondering exactly what Team ICO have been doing the past few years leads me to believe theyre not at a level above Remedy at the moment. Remedy released a pretty good game in Alan Wake in that time frame and although it was not nearly as hyped as TLG, what they accomplished with Max Payne 1 and 2 and the excitment behind the release of Max Payne 3 was due in no small part to Remedy and how good the last two Max Payne games had been.

I don't see either of us convincing the other to sway from their point of view however so I guess the only thing to sway us will be when TLG and QB release next year.