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The Sega Dreamcast Sales Super Thread (FULL US & Japan HW & SW sales data inside!) Keeping the dream live!

Forums - Sales Discussion - The Sega Dreamcast Sales Super Thread (FULL US & Japan HW & SW sales data inside!) Keeping the dream live!

Ruler said:
GamechaserBE said:

Those were mostly ports because sony had exclusive rights till 2000 for some games listed.


sony didnt have any exclsuive deals, the sega saturn was simple too complicated to devolope 3D games for. All of these games came out before the dreamcast came out both in europe and USA. They are just as much as remasters as the last of us, dark souls 2. 


Sure....

In the conflict with console rivals, Sony has signed a deal to ensure the eagerly-awaited sequel to Tomb Raider, the game in which Lara gained stardom, can be seen only on its Playstations. A PC version will be launched at the same time.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/32939.stm  

The deal lasted till 99-2000



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Kresnik said:
johnsobas said:

Dreamcast had better games than the PS2 until probably late 2003 and even that is arguable.  The dreamcast did fine against the PS1, it was the PS2 that killed it and that was despite the great games on DC not because of them.  DVD had a lot to do with it too.

I'm not talking about at the time PS2 released, I'm talking about looking back at the console.  It gets revered as being much better than it actually was.  Don't get me wrong - I think it had a great library and deserved to do better than it did, but it's nowhere near the praise it gets for its stellar library.

This post sums it up better than I did:

NightDragon83 said:
The Dreamcast is simultaneously the most underrated and overrated console of all time. It was a shame it wasn't supported as well as it should have been, and certainly didn't deserve to die the quick death that it did. But nowadays, people put on their nostalgia goggles and turn the settings up to 11 when waxing poetic about how amazing the Dreamcast supposedly was and how it was the be all, end all of "true" gaming consoles.

Hate to ruin the nostalgia trip, but the Dreamcast was essentially what the N64 would have been if it were disc-based with more VRAM. And other than a handful of cult classics and the stellar line of SEGA Sports titles, the Dreamcast's overall software library is pretty mediocre compared to the other consoles of its time. It gets mega brownie points for being the first major console to bring online gaming to the living room here in the States, but the PS2 and especially the Xbox with XBL did it so much better that everyone forgot about SEGA Net pretty much immediately after the DC was dead.

Well I look to the DC for it's first year and half it lived and see games releasing every month and most of all first pary and that is impressive. Compare it to the PS2 that was known for a weak first year and only started to get a must when third party's released games Like MGS/FF/GTA on it..



STRYKIE said:



Did you forget 2001 was a year or something? I'm all for retrospective sob stories, but that statement is sheer lunacy. The PS2 in 2001 is probably the single most impressive year a video game platform has had. Ever.

And as far as the Dreamcast up against the PS1, if you need Shenmue to sell twice as many copies as your total install base to recoup revenue, chances are you're not doing "fine".


Yeah, going to have to disagree here.

Dreamcast had the best 2 years I've ever known a console have in 2000/2001.  It was a relentless torrent of releases across a variety of genres.

PS2 was a let down in comparison, however the later years there was no contest and from 2002 the PS2 was by far the best format on the market in terms of releases.

Note: I'm talking more from a European perspective as that is the market I live in.

As for Shenmue, given it started development for the Sega Saturn, and was switched to the Dreamcast before the system had even launched, particularly in the West. I'm not sure what saying you need to sell more copies than your install base is really getting at. Surely any launch titles are showing you're not doing "fine" in that case? I mean Killzone Shadowfall needed to sell a gazillion times more copies than the total install userbase ;)

I think a lot of people forget just how short a time the Dreamcast was on the Market. I mean the Wii U has now enjoyed a longer life. In the US, the Dreamcast discontinuation was announced after the system had been on the market 16 months. In Europe 15 months. Now with that in mind, it's worth reconsidering the software lineup the console actually managed to muster.



RIP Dad 25/11/51 - 13/12/13. You will be missed but never forgotten.

I whole heartedly agree. The release scheduale of games was amazing on Dreamcast, i was buying 3 games a month easy. I accumilated over 200 Dreamcast games ,some on import. The most i ammassed on my PS2 when i eventually gave in because of Virtua Fighter 4  was about 50 titles.  I don't think since i have ammassed a collection of games for one system as high as for Dreamcast.  Though the original XBOX came close , it to had some blinding games but Microsoft did cut it's life a bit short ..  But i did see it as spiritual successor .



BRKITG

MikeRox said:
STRYKIE said:

Yeah, going to have to disagree here.

Dreamcast had the best 2 years I've ever known a console have in 2000/2001.  It was a relentless torrent of releases across a variety of genres.

PS2 was a let down in comparison, however the later years there was no contest and from 2002 the PS2 was by far the best format on the market in terms of releases.

Note: I'm talking more from a European perspective as that is the market I live in.

As for Shenmue, given it started development for the Sega Saturn, and was switched to the Dreamcast before the system had even launched, particularly in the West. I'm not sure what saying you need to sell more copies than your install base is really getting at. Surely any launch titles are showing you're not doing "fine" in that case? I mean Killzone Shadowfall needed to sell a gazillion times more copies than the total install userbase ;)

I think a lot of people forget just how short a time the Dreamcast was on the Market. I mean the Wii U has now enjoyed a longer life. In the US, the Dreamcast discontinuation was announced after the system had been on the market 16 months. In Europe 15 months. Now with that in mind, it's worth reconsidering the software lineup the console actually managed to muster.

Bolded 1: Well, as a personal fighting game enthusiast, I can attest to this, but let's not kid ourselves, there were some genres on the Dreamcast where the entire total of titles (let me doubly clarify, I don't mean only the good ones, or the ones I prefer, or the ones that are Dreamcast exclusive, I mean THE absolute entirety) can be counted on one hand. Platformers and RPGs come to mind here. 

Bolded 2: If you can find me a single calendar year that had a stronger commericially and critically acclaimed line-up of games that were only released for the PS2 in North America than 2001, I'm all ears. I mean, the guy I replied to was preaching that the PS2 didn't get going until 2003, which was probably the weakest year for the PS2 in terms of killer app exclusive games (not counting 2008 onwards which was just arbitrary annual sports games).

Bolded 3: I'm also European so I know the feels. But this thread isn't particularly pertaining towards the Dreamcast's European market perfomance.

Bolded 4: Not what I meant. (Although, given the circumstances, Shenmue cost around $47 million to develop, some even speculate $70 million including the Saturn build, go figure) Reason why I brought that up was because Sega were having big financial problems and essentially had to shoot for a Wii-effect, when in reality, then couldn't even muster a market as big as the N64's for the most part. I think they only ever outsold the N64 for what, 2 of the 16 calendar months that the DC was on the North American market?. And has grossly overstocked unsold inventory. i'm not exaggerating when I say there's still brand new Dreamcast hardware and games floating around relatively cheap on eBay even now, 14-15 years later. That's what I'm talking about when I call out the notion that the Dreamcast was "doing fine against the PS1" as extremely rose-glass tinted. Not to mention that the PS1 still had plenty of big guns coming out for it, a huge back catalog of low budget greatest hits/platinum titles and overall was still a very relevant platform in 2000/2001.



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The Dreamcast only has nostalgia to back it up. If it were to actually live through the 6th gen it would've suffered. Its a lot weaker than PS2 which along with no DVD means it wouldn't get as many multiplats, even less than GameCube most likely. No second analog stick which would hinder many games on it. No broadband Ethernet port for the modern gamer. Not to mention software sales would be extremely low since pirating on the console ran rampart since it was so easy to do.



STRYKIE said:
MikeRox said:
STRYKIE said:

Yeah, going to have to disagree here.

Dreamcast had the best 2 years I've ever known a console have in 2000/2001.  It was a relentless torrent of releases across a variety of genres.

PS2 was a let down in comparison, however the later years there was no contest and from 2002 the PS2 was by far the best format on the market in terms of releases.

Note: I'm talking more from a European perspective as that is the market I live in.

As for Shenmue, given it started development for the Sega Saturn, and was switched to the Dreamcast before the system had even launched, particularly in the West. I'm not sure what saying you need to sell more copies than your install base is really getting at. Surely any launch titles are showing you're not doing "fine" in that case? I mean Killzone Shadowfall needed to sell a gazillion times more copies than the total install userbase ;)

I think a lot of people forget just how short a time the Dreamcast was on the Market. I mean the Wii U has now enjoyed a longer life. In the US, the Dreamcast discontinuation was announced after the system had been on the market 16 months. In Europe 15 months. Now with that in mind, it's worth reconsidering the software lineup the console actually managed to muster.

Bolded 1: Well, as a personal fighting game enthusiast, I can attest to this, but let's not kid ourselves, there were some genres on the Dreamcast where the entire total of titles (let me doubly clarify, I don't mean only the good ones, or the ones I prefer, or the ones that are Dreamcast exclusive, I mean THE absolute entirety) can be counted on one hand. Platformers and RPGs come to mind here. 

Bolded 2: If you can find me a single calendar year that had a stronger commericially and critically acclaimed line-up of games that were only released for the PS2 in North America than 2001, I'm all ears. I mean, the guy I replied to was preaching that the PS2 didn't get going until 2003, which was probably the weakest year for the PS2 in terms of killer app exclusive games (not counting 2008 onwards which was just arbitrary annual sports games).

Bolded 3: I'm also European so I know the feels. But this thread isn't particularly pertaining towards the Dreamcast's European market perfomance.

Bolded 4: Not what I meant. (Although, given the circumstances, Shenmue cost around $47 million to develop, some even speculate $70 million including the Saturn build, go figure) Reason why I brought that up was because Sega were having big financial problems and essentially had to shoot for a Wii-effect, when in reality, then couldn't even muster a market as big as the N64's for the most part. I think they only ever outsold the N64 for what, 2 of the 16 calendar months that the DC was on the North American market?. And has grossly overstocked unsold inventory. i'm not exaggerating when I say there's still brand new Dreamcast hardware and games floating around relatively cheap on eBay even now, 14-15 years later. That's what I'm talking about when I call out the notion that the Dreamcast was "doing fine against the PS1" as extremely rose-glass tinted. Not to mention that the PS1 still had plenty of big guns coming out for it, a huge back catalog of low budget greatest hits/platinum titles and overall was still a very relevant platform in 2000/2001.

I think you misunderstand what i said, i mean it took until 2003 for the PS2 to catch up the dreamcast library.  It started at a big deficit, and couldn't keep up until 2002.  It wasn't until 2003 that it was clearly had a better library of games.  I didn't say the PS2 didn't get going until 2003, the PS2 had tons of good games before then.  I'm only comparing the libraries that were out at the time.



currently playing: Skyward Sword, Mario Sunshine, Xenoblade Chronicles X

With those top sellers, the console deserved its sales.

But the Dreamcast is remembered as something greater than it was because it was Sega's last console. Otherwise it would have been more like the Saturn.



Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

A Biased Review Reloaded / Open Your Eyes / Switch Gamers Club

Forgot to do this the other day.

As you may know, several of Dreamcast's games were ported to the PS2 & NGC, this is how some of those games faired, Japan only.

Seaman

DC Seaman          91.572        539.357 SEGA 29/07/1999
DC Seaman: Kindan no Pet 2001  ?           45.688 SEGA 10/08/2000
DC Christmas Seaman  ?           11.983 SEGA 16/12/1999
PS2 Seaman: Kindan no Pet          88.800        305.632 SEGA 15/11/2001

Code: Veronica

DC Resident Evil Code: Veronica        349.049        496.362 Capcom 03/02/2000
PS2 Resident Evil Code: Veronica X        184.475        360.038 Capcom 22/03/2001

Sonic Adventure

DC Sonic Adventure        186.760        475.152 SEGA 23/12/1998
DC Sonic Adventure: International   ?           28.682 SEGA 14/10/1999
NGC Sonic Adventure DX          20.763          58.977 SEGA 19/06/2003

Sonic Adventure 2

DC Sonic Adventure 2          93.035        109.286 SEGA 18/06/2001
NGC Sonic Adventure 2 Battle          30.295        192.186 SEGA 20/12/2001

Phantasy Star Online

DC Phantasy Star Online          84.689        178.747 SEGA 21/12/2000
DC Phantasy Star Online Ver. 2        119.159        148.881 SEGA 07/06/2001
NGC Phantasy Star Online: Episode 1 & 2          71.241        138.277 SEGA 12/09/2002

Marvel vs. Capcom 2

DC Marvel vs. Capcom 2: New Age of Heroes          72.444        160.322 Capcom 30/03/2000
PS2 Marvel vs. Capcom 2: New Age of Heroes          48.998        115.989 Capcom 19/09/2002

Crazy Taxi

DC Crazy Taxi          47.517        160.515 SEGA 24/01/2000
PS2 Crazy Taxi          13.075          13.075 SEGA 22/11/2001
NGC Crazy Taxi            8.218          12.560 Sega 30/05/2002