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Forums - Gaming Discussion - The hardcore abandoned Nintendo; Nintendo didn't abandon the hardcore

DerNebel on 26 January 2015
97alexk said:
DerNebel said:
97alexk said:

People people, this has nothing to do with abandon. They are focusing on all audiences. The reason why the Wii U is selling so low is for 3 reasons

1: Nintendo haters and so called gritty gamers as i call them dont buy a Wii U because they are just simply not interested in there games, they want some FPS game or COD or idk assassins creed wich is for mature people, and mature is cool because thats how they think. Personally we all know they know too little about Wii U's library of games.

And you apparently know hardly anything about the PS4s or X1s library if you think that the people opting for one of those instead of a Wii U are Nintendo haters and only want "some FPS game or COD or idk assassins creed wich is for mature people, and mature is cool because thats how they think", cause believe it or not, most gamers are not 17 year old teenagers that care more about image than about what they actually enjoy.

Im sorry but i have no clue what you just said made any real sense towards what i said. Ps4's and xbox one library are not great at the moment, because thats my personal taste. I think many people agree with me on this, but ik for a fact that MANY people prefer Ps4's and xbox one library over the Wii U's because they like that type of games more, and i see that xbox one and ps4 does way more global marketing, but marketing is really really expensive. Also i know there exist quite alot of nintendo haters out there that want maybe them to go third party or just hate the company and the fanbase. Myself im only talking about those and the COD fans in my previous post. I  know alot of ps4 and xbox owners do not always like gritty games, and i wasn't talking about them either, and last but not least the thing about my image was just really unnecessary!

I wasn't talking about your image, I was directly responding to your post, I bolded the part that I was responding to with the image sentence, you make it sound as if those people that do like those games only like them because they think that liking those things will make them appear cool, that's a teenagers way of thinking.

Also you're highly confusing internet message boards and real life here, the amount of people that have an actual hate for Nintendo is probably small at best. People just don't care for their output as much as they used to, that has nothing to do with hate.



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*Sound Of Rain on 26 January 2015

I think Nintendo console sales are normally low for 2 reasons:

1) You can play Nintendo games on their HH's. Microsoft doesn't have a HH & Sony ignores the Vita. This means you can get the Nintendo experience elsewhere, for cheap.

2) Nintendo is gameplay focused. This means, some people might be fine with just playing Mario Kart, Smash Bros, Kirby, Donkey Kong on the older systems.

For example, the people who like Uncharted might feel a connection with Drake. If you want to see what happens to him, his story, you must buy U4. Nintendo games often lack a story, don't need to play it for curiosity reasons.

Could be wrong of course



97alexk on 26 January 2015
DerNebel said:
97alexk said:
DerNebel said:
97alexk said:

People people, this has nothing to do with abandon. They are focusing on all audiences. The reason why the Wii U is selling so low is for 3 reasons

1: Nintendo haters and so called gritty gamers as i call them dont buy a Wii U because they are just simply not interested in there games, they want some FPS game or COD or idk assassins creed wich is for mature people, and mature is cool because thats how they think. Personally we all know they know too little about Wii U's library of games.

And you apparently know hardly anything about the PS4s or X1s library if you think that the people opting for one of those instead of a Wii U are Nintendo haters and only want "some FPS game or COD or idk assassins creed wich is for mature people, and mature is cool because thats how they think", cause believe it or not, most gamers are not 17 year old teenagers that care more about image than about what they actually enjoy.

Im sorry but i have no clue what you just said made any real sense towards what i said. Ps4's and xbox one library are not great at the moment, because thats my personal taste. I think many people agree with me on this, but ik for a fact that MANY people prefer Ps4's and xbox one library over the Wii U's because they like that type of games more, and i see that xbox one and ps4 does way more global marketing, but marketing is really really expensive. Also i know there exist quite alot of nintendo haters out there that want maybe them to go third party or just hate the company and the fanbase. Myself im only talking about those and the COD fans in my previous post. I  know alot of ps4 and xbox owners do not always like gritty games, and i wasn't talking about them either, and last but not least the thing about my image was just really unnecessary!

I wasn't talking about your image, I was directly responding to your post, I bolded the part that I was responding to with the image sentence, you make it sound as if those people that do like those games only like them because they think that liking those things will make them appear cool, that's a teenagers way of thinking.

Also you're highly confusing internet message boards and real life here, the amount of people that have an actual hate for Nintendo is probably small at best. People just don't care for their output as much as they used to, that has nothing to do with hate.

oh that makes more sense then, also i didnt mean that all those who play cod and so play its because its cool, i played it aswell alot, and it was because it was and addiction, but then we go to a whole different topic here!



burninmylight on 26 January 2015
Intrinsic said:
I think everything is wrong with how you approached this.

First, the "hardcore" are those that want to play the most amount of games. And with all the latest and best features, so we're talking great graphics, great online networks and all genres of games. Who ever provides a platform that can give them all that; is who they will support.

Nintendo decided that they weren't going to compete with Sony and ms, being that the only way to do that effectively last gen was to use the loss leader business model, which Nintendo just didn't want. So they made the Wii, and completely abandoned the type of people that mostly cared about HD graphics, multiplayer...etc and focused on those that couldn't care less about stuff like that. It worked.

Then they made the WiiU, again doing the exact same thing, but hoping that putting a touchscreen on their controller will capture the minds of the casuals again, they probably figured that since the casuals were all using touchscreens now they would be able to identify with the WiiU. It didn't work.

No the only people buying the WiiU are the Nintendo faithful. Those that would have bought a WiiU regardless of whatever Nintendo did. Unfortunately, cause that user base has dwindled over the generations, right now its a very very small number of people.


^ This guy gets it.



Zekkyou on 26 January 2015
97alexk said:

First off im not critizing the other consoles and there audience, im talking about the audiences like people who mostly like gritty games, and there are a plenty of nintendo haters out there . I seen it. Also Wii U's library is really good, ps4 and xbox one has hardly any good quality first party titles, and if they do they have done a bad job making them noticeable. Saying that the Wii U library is lacking is ignorant. There only exist different opinions and taste towards games.

No it's not, at least on a general scale. There is no denying the subjective quality of the WiiU's library, but its near complete lack of 3rd party support has starved it (resulting in the frequent release droughts). It doesn't matter how good Nintendo's own titles are, without the variety and quantity offered by all the developers and publishers that support PS and Xbox, you're not going to be able to attract a wide audience, just Nintendo fans. Sony and MS's own 1st party offerings are just the icing on the cake for most people.

The proof is somewhat in the pudding though. Go have a look at the WiiU and PS4/X1's retail release schedule for the next few months. The WiiU is currently going through another drought, so i'm sure you can imagine what it looks like.

Again, i'm not downplaying the quality of Nintendo's own titles, they're among the best in the industry. That just doesn't do much to fix the WiiU's current situation (regardless to how great a console it may be to those of us who really enjoy Nintendo titles).



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generic-user-1 on 26 January 2015
Soundwave said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
Hardcore Nintendo gamers never left Nintendo. The Wii U is the most hardcore Nintendo console since the N64 with highly rated titles. The problem is the early adopter fans who generally buy third party don't have Nintendo consoles. Have Nintendo gain those peoples attention and they will get their sales back in some respect.


Zuh?

Wii U is aimed and marketed primarily at kids and the "family" crowd. Look at 95% of its commercials:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn3FrNb1X-E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dbGJieRaH0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD4qU0HCo40

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fxQx7ZT-5k

PS4 and XBox One are primarily marketed at hardcore/older mainstream gamers. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKeptMVKlsY

The difference in marketing alone is massive. No one but Nintendo fans consider the Wii U a "hardcore" console in the sense that the PS4/X1 are. 



core gamers dont need fuckn commercials to buy a system... the twins just have 1 e-sport title atm and thats a very stange one, fifa has a lot of e-sport going on, but real sport has a huge influence on the game. and the twins dont have so many artgames, the most is ust casual racers, casual fps, etc... nintendo doesnt have those games, even the holy mk isnt a casual racer, its a partyracer, made for 4 people playing on one screen.

97alexk on 26 January 2015
Zekkyou said:
97alexk said:

First off im not critizing the other consoles and there audience, im talking about the audiences like people who mostly like gritty games, and there are a plenty of nintendo haters out there . I seen it. Also Wii U's library is really good, ps4 and xbox one has hardly any good quality first party titles, and if they do they have done a bad job making them noticeable. Saying that the Wii U library is lacking is ignorant. There only exist different opinions and taste towards games.

No it's not, at least on a general scale. There is no denying the subjective quality of the WiiU's library, but its near complete lack of 3rd party support has starved it (resulting in the frequent release droughts). It doesn't matter how good Nintendo's own titles are, without the variety and quantity offered by all the developers and publishers that support PS and Xbox, you're not going to be able to attract a wide audience, just Nintendo fans. Sony and MS's own 1st party offerings are just the icing on the cake for most people.

The proof is somewhat in the pudding though. Go have a look at the WiiU and PS4/X1's retail release schedule for the next few months. The WiiU is currently going through another drought, so i'm sure you can imagine what it looks like.

Again, i'm not downplaying the quality of Nintendo's own titles, they're among the best in the industry. That just doesn't do much to fix the WiiU's current situation (regardless to how great a console it may be to those of us who really enjoy Nintendo titles).


Well, Wii U's library has variety and it does have a small amount of third party support, Nintendo does lack alot of third party support no denying in that. I just see a different approach that nintendo takes. Nintendo focus on making a s uccess with only first party titles alone and mature third party titles on the side to push the library, and xbox one and ps4 mostly are successfull with there third party support. OFC ps4 and xbox one does have very good first party titles like uncharted for playstation and halo for xbox, but its nothing compared to the amount of great first party games nintendo has. Also i say it again, just because you have more games coming out, doesnt mean they are all good or even fun for that matter. Ok i know this will upset alot ,but for me the majority of games on ps4 and xbox one feel kinda the same with few exceptions ofc. Like sunset overdrive maybe, even though im not interested in that game. Mostly the good selling software are FPS games, in first person view, or car racing games likre forza. Destiny is FPS, COD is FPS, assassins creed however has become just like COD, you can say what you want about unity, but its not that impressive. I think those big hitter FPS games over shadow the games that have real potential on ps4 and xbox one. I can say that though, in 2015 the line up for xbox one and ps4 looks alot more varied, with games like EVOLVE, wait isnt that a FPS aswell? lol, and bloodborne and so on. I would maybe get a ps4 just because for star wars battlefront , but i could just get it on PC. So i stick with Wii U and 3DS :)



generic-user-1 on 26 January 2015
97alexk said:
Zekkyou said:
97alexk said:

First off im not critizing the other consoles and there audience, im talking about the audiences like people who mostly like gritty games, and there are a plenty of nintendo haters out there . I seen it. Also Wii U's library is really good, ps4 and xbox one has hardly any good quality first party titles, and if they do they have done a bad job making them noticeable. Saying that the Wii U library is lacking is ignorant. There only exist different opinions and taste towards games.

No it's not, at least on a general scale. There is no denying the subjective quality of the WiiU's library, but its near complete lack of 3rd party support has starved it (resulting in the frequent release droughts). It doesn't matter how good Nintendo's own titles are, without the variety and quantity offered by all the developers and publishers that support PS and Xbox, you're not going to be able to attract a wide audience, just Nintendo fans. Sony and MS's own 1st party offerings are just the icing on the cake for most people.

The proof is somewhat in the pudding though. Go have a look at the WiiU and PS4/X1's retail release schedule for the next few months. The WiiU is currently going through another drought, so i'm sure you can imagine what it looks like.

Again, i'm not downplaying the quality of Nintendo's own titles, they're among the best in the industry. That just doesn't do much to fix the WiiU's current situation (regardless to how great a console it may be to those of us who really enjoy Nintendo titles).


Well, Wii U's library has variety and it does have a small amount of third party support, Nintendo does lack alot of third party support no denying in that. I just see a different approach that nintendo takes. Nintendo focus on making a s uccess with only first party titles alone and mature third party titles on the side to push the library, and xbox one and ps4 mostly are successfull with there third party support. OFC ps4 and xbox one does have very good first party titles like uncharted for playstation and halo for xbox, but its nothing compared to the amount of great first party games nintendo has. Also i say it again, just because you have more games coming out, doesnt mean they are all good or even fun for that matter. Ok i know this will upset alot ,but for me the majority of games on ps4 and xbox one feel kinda the same with few exceptions ofc. Like sunset overdrive maybe, even though im not interested in that game. Mostly the good selling software are FPS games, in first person view, or car racing games likre forza. Destiny is FPS, COD is FPS, assassins creed however has become just like COD, you can say what you want about unity, but its not that impressive. I think those big hitter FPS games over shadow the games that have real potential on ps4 and xbox one. I can say that though, in 2015 the line up for xbox one and ps4 looks alot more varied, with games like EVOLVE, wait isnt that a FPS aswell? lol, and bloodborne and so on. I would maybe get a ps4 just because for star wars battlefront , but i could just get it on PC. So i stick with Wii U and 3DS :)



1. Evolve is more a store front to sell dlc than a full AAA game. 2. nintendo doesnt need the AAA titles, they need the AA titles, but those arent made anymore, thats nintendos biggest problem. nintendo has to creat a new ecosystem for those games and everything is fine for nintendo again.

Zekkyou on 26 January 2015
97alexk said:

Well, Wii U's library has variety and it does have a small amount of third party support, Nintendo does lack alot of third party support no denying in that. I just see a different approach that nintendo takes. Nintendo focus on making a s uccess with only first party titles alone and mature third party titles on the side to push the library, and xbox one and ps4 mostly are successfull with there third party support. OFC ps4 and xbox one does have very good first party titles like uncharted for playstation and halo for xbox, but its nothing compared to the amount of great first party games nintendo has. Also i say it again, just because you have more games coming out, doesnt mean they are all good or even fun for that matter. Ok i know this will upset alot ,but for me the majority of games on ps4 and xbox one feel kinda the same with few exceptions ofc. Like sunset overdrive maybe, even though im not interested in that game. Mostly the good selling software are FPS games, in first person view, or car racing games likre forza. Destiny is FPS, COD is FPS, assassins creed however has become just like COD, you can say what you want about unity, but its not that impressive. I think those big hitter FPS games over shadow the games that have real potential on ps4 and xbox one. I can say that though, in 2015 the line up for xbox one and ps4 looks alot more varied, with games like EVOLVE, wait isnt that a FPS aswell? lol, and bloodborne and so on. I would maybe get a ps4 just because for star wars battlefront , but i could just get it on PC. So i stick with Wii U and 3DS :)

The issue still remains that the WiiU's only real appeal as a primary system is to Nintendo fans (or those willing to buy a 2nd/3rd system). That is, on a general scale, a lacking library.

It's true that more releases doesn't ensure quality, but it does greatly improve the probability that you will appeal to more people. In February and March the PS4 has 12 retail games spanning 7 genres releasing in NA (and sub-genres within those). The WiiU has Mario Party 10 and Kirby.  That's it. It doesn't matter how good they could potentially be (though i have no faith in MP10 lol), they won't capture the interest of as many people as the PS4's line up will. That means the PS4's is, again on a general scale, much more likely to be "better".

On a side note, i think you're generalizing genres a bit too much. Just because two games fall under the same basic group, doesn't mean they should be treated as the same game. For example FarCry 4 and COD are both "FPS", yet are completely different. So different in-fact i'm able to love the former while disliking the latter :p



rolltide101x on 26 January 2015

No, Nintendo abandoned the hardcore with the Wii. I liked Nintendo up to that point, I know a lot of you guys liked the Wii but to me it was a joke of a system. They went after a more casual market and the casual market has now moved on. That is why they are struggling with the Wii U now. However I really enjoy the Wii U though i do feel it would have been far better without the WiiPad. The Wii U is a very good system overall I just feel they should have scratched the WiiPad and made it cheaper beyond that (and getting 3rd parties) I really can not think of any complaints with the Wii U. As long as Nintendo keeps making systems like the Wii U I will continue to buy their systems. If they make another Wii I may move on completely for forever. 

 

Your first statement is exactly what happened imo. 

"A lot of people are upset Nintendo abandoned the hardcore audience with the Wii, and now Nintendo is trying to get them back with the Wii U."