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Wii U beaten by the Dreamcast - what now?

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The Dreamcast was not a failure. It simply wasnt a solution to Sega's failing console business.



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naruball said:
Skullwaker said:
I'm second hand embarrassed by some of the posts in this thread. Nintendo should go third party? Nintendo should just drop support for the Wii U and rush out a new console?

...And why is that? What would they have to gain? A loss of consumer respect and profit is all. They need to recoup their losses, do what they can to make this gen as profitable as possible and keep releasing quality title after quality title. That's it.


How  would you feel if someone said the same thing about your post? Obviously everyone thinks they're right because they're using facts. But other people can use different facts to make a completely different point.

Example: What did MS gain from completely abandoning xbox after it underperormed and then rushing to release xb360? 

1. They turned things around. Won US, Uk and so many other countries. 'No one' saw them beating Sony like they did (for almost an entire generation).

2. They made huge profits with live-gold. 

Did it hurt their brand? Would it have been more profitable or a good decision overall to keep supporting xbox?

Look, I'm not saying that Ninty should drop the WiiU, but attacking others for their opinions doesn't seem the best way to have a discussion. 

Did I attack anyone? No. I simply said that I'm embarrased for the way people are responding to this. People can say the same for my posts, I don't mind.

Also, the difference is that the 360 was released 4 years after its predecessor. People are wanting Nintendo to abandon the Wii U now. Just 2 years after its release. And Microsoft was bleeding money from their Xbox division. It was a huge loss to them. They had nowhere to go but up. It's a different story for Nintendo, because they're making a profit now and they have their healthy portable division, not to mention their software sales. Releasing a successor now or anytime in the near future would ruin the way consumers percieve them. It's apples and oranges.



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ps4tw said:

Looking at the sales figures, the Dreamcast, a console widely seen as a failure and the downfall of Sega, sold better than the Wii U to date. As Nintendo has the cash assest to survive a failed console, where will they go from here? It seems that they do not want to adapt to the demands of the modern gamer, and their core user base is smaller than ever. This being said, will this force Nintendo's hand out of the console business just as the Dreamcast did to Sega? How can Nintendo repair the publicity damage the Wii U has done to them in the eyes of gamers? 

Two words: software sales.

Dreamcast suffered due to piracy. The WiiU currently does not.



Nah they'll be fine, at the end of the day they are making money from this all in all so its not to much to be concerned about



Wii U makes profit. Nintendo is in fantastic shape financially. SEGA was losing money and nearly went out of business.

So what now? Nintendo sells Wii U as planned and keeps making profit. Even tho Wii U is selling less than XBO and PS4 it's in better shape. Sony posted it's 6th huge loss in 7 years. MS continues to dumb billions with little return. Funny thing is it's starting to look like PS and Xbox will become less of consoles and a brand of gaming services on devices. It's already starting with PSnow and Windows 10.



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ps4tw said:
vivster said:
How can it be beaten by the Dreamcast if it's still selling and some of its biggest games are yet to come out?


Dreamcast sold quicker and yet was still seen as a failure. Begs the question why Nintendo are still flogging a dead horse. 

I love it when gamers don't understand business: Nintendo released the WiiU for the sake of turning a profit and their biggest money maker is through software sales. The WiiU was not released to outsell a console that suffered from piracy.

Asriel said:

Because if they cut and run now, they can't recoup any of the losses they incurred in the last few years of 3DS/Wii U. If they keep Wii U on the market and act to maximise profitability rather than marketshare, they can rescue some kind of financial positive from what is otherwise a poor generation for them. Launching a new console will be expensive, as would going third party. Better to make what money they can before they have to sink even more money into a change of direction. 

What's better for Nintendo launching their next home console? 15 million Wii U owners who received a lot of quality Nintendo software, and who were happy that Nintendo continued supporting the system? Or 7 to 11 million (assuming they cut and run sometime in the next 12 months) unhappy consumers who spent several hundred pounds/dollars on a system Nintendo weren't willing to stick with?

What looks better to a consumer buying the next home console from Nintendo? Nintendo, the platform holder who couldn't make Wii U succeed so they dropped support within three years of launch (and who cut the 3DS price massively after launch)?Or, Nintendo the platform holder that continued to bring their biggest, best titles to Wii U despite a small userbase?

What's a better bet for publishers and consumers? A platform holder who stands by their hardware, or a platform holder who runs at the first signs of trouble? If publishers and consumers are going to invest in new Nintendo hardware, Nintendo's decision to stick by or drop Wii U prematurely will play a major part in how well their next system does, at least initially. There are a lot of other factors Nintendo will need to nail, but sticking by Wii U and grinding out profit is far more sensible than dropping the system prematurely.

Cutting and running will be a disaster for Nintendo. It's what Sega tried when they saw Genesis sales declining, quick-fix solutions to eroding marketshare rather than making long-term decisions based around the future profitability and health of their platform business. Nintendo won't be happy with Wii U's peformance, and Iwata did say at the beginning of this year that so far Wii U and Nintendo have failed. But they won't be panicking about marketshare the way Sega did. Change is a-coming, it just isn't going to come while Nintendo have a niche of Wii U owners they need to keep happy and stockholders who need to see profits posted.



Contrary to popular belief it wasn't the Dreamcast itself that was the main reason for SEGA leaving the hardware business. But I'm not the first here to say that it seems.

Dreamcast was selling decently actually, because it got to those 9m in under two years. Similarly, Gamecube was also selling well at first, but was atrocious in the later half of it's life. WiiU being behind both means little, it's the legs that count. There are and were many systems selling behind both, some indeed ended up failures, some didn't. The difference is, Nintendo makes money compared to SEGA at the time in this case, so they can survive a mediocre generation here and there. It isn't exactly ideal of course, but it is what it is and all we can do is wait to see how this generation ends.



WolfpackN64 said:
ps4tw said:

Looking at the sales figures, the Dreamcast, a console widely seen as a failure and the downfall of Sega, sold better than the Wii U to date. As Nintendo has the cash assest to survive a failed console, where will they go from here? It seems that they do not want to adapt to the demands of the modern gamer, and their core user base is smaller than ever. This being said, will this force Nintendo's hand out of the console business just as the Dreamcast did to Sega? How can Nintendo repair the publicity damage the Wii U has done to them in the eyes of gamers? 


The Nintendo core base is MUCH larger than Sony and Microsoft's. The Wii U will outsell the Dreamcast no problem and Nintendo's stifness is paying off, profits tripeling this quarter. Carry on.


Excuse me...

 

 

Care to elaborate what would give you such idea?



RolStoppable said:
Nintendo will still be alive and kicking. Despite an atrocious eighth gen showing, they've mostly eliminated Sony from the handheld space already.

Additionally, their financials are on the rise again, so it isn't even up for consideration to bow out of the home console space. And due to the unique characteristics of the video game business (new system means a reset of perception), the Wii U's failure doesn't dent Nintendo's image all that much.

overall profits doesn't mean WiiU was successful financially.  3DS is undoubtedly making the money for Nintendo.  This coming from one of the few that has supported Nintendo's home console showing this gen and really thinks it deserves higher sales than Xbox right now.




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ps4tw said:
RolStoppable said:
Nintendo will still be alive and kicking. Despite an atrocious eighth gen showing, they've mostly eliminated Sony from the handheld space already.

Additionally, their financials are on the rise again, so it isn't even up for consideration to bow out of the home console space. And due to the unique characteristics of the video game business (new system means a reset of perception), the Wii U's failure doesn't dent Nintendo's image all that much.

True, but what future does the handheld space have? The 3DS has sold considerably less than the DS, and with mobile gaming developing at a fast pace, will it result in the same situation that the Wii U currently has - only the diehard core fans will purchas the console?

Rising financials hardly means bowing out of the console race isn't up for consideration - that's a very narrow view of the situation. They've lost a huge percentage of the market to Sony and Microsoft and it's debateable (see above reply) as to whether they can realistically get these gamers back. Nintendo's image is also struggling with a childish image - do you think this could be shaken? Personally I think they'd have to make a spin-off company to distance themselves away from the vivid and percieved as childish games that they are known for. 

The next Nintendo handheld performing worse than the 3DS would necessitate Nintendo repeating the same mistakes: Adding expensive features that the market doesn't want and believing that third parties will be there to help creating an installed base. if they avoid these two traps, then they will be easily more successful than with the 3DS, because that system didn't set the bar high.

With Nintendo having several billion dollar in cash reserves and no debt, going third party really isn't up for consideration in the slightest. Their next two home consoles would have to sell as bad as the Wii U to get to that point. I don't think Nintendo lost a lot of consumers to Sony and Microsoft, the biggest factor at work here is disinterest; so at the end of the eighth generation, I don't expect Sony's and Microsoft's gains to make up for Nintendo's decline. Nintendo already proved with the Wii that they can change their childish image, hence why the trolls had to adjust and use the word "casual" instead.

Kerotan said:

they didn't eliminate Sony. Sony's lack of support and the decline in the market is ensuring it's the last handheld they will make. By that logic Sony and MS and eliminated Nintendo from the console market. Vita is likely to sell more lifetime than the Wii U. 

Sony's lack of support is due to getting curbstomped by Nintendo. They quickly realized that they stand no chance anymore.

On the other hand, Nintendo will make another home console, so how are the two situations even similar? You make no sense.

platformmaster918 said:

overall profits doesn't mean WiiU was successful financially.  3DS is undoubtedly making the money for Nintendo.  This coming from one of the few that has supported Nintendo's home console showing this gen and really thinks it deserves higher sales than Xbox right now.

That wasn't my point. What I was saying is that Nintendo doesn't need to lose a thought on going third party when the company itself isn't close to being in bad shape.



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