hunter_alien said: Ninsect said: LemonSlice said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game Fool somebody into thinking the game runs at 60fps? lol, certainly not me, in Bayonetta 2 I can recognize the shift in a split second, it's night and day. Only elitists notice the difference brah. Lol, people still say this? Did people not see the difference in the Hobbit movies (24 vs. 48 FPS)? I seem to remember many people talking about the difference, most of them "casuals" Night and day: games and movies are entirely different experiences. Also, you see it because it was brought to your attention. If you play them side by side, its noticable, otherwise you do not see the difference. Its basic science. You will feel the difference in response time, but even those in the rare cases when there is a fast paced competitive game. Otherwise the "need" for 60 FPS is BS. Simple as that...

Yeah, in games it's an even more jarring difference because the lower FPS also means slower response times. I'm sorry but you do not speak on my behalf, I can see the difference very easily and I notice immediately when the game runs at a high FPS, without being told so...

vivster said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. "Required" is a subjective word in that context. No one says that it is technically required to play the game but that you have standards that are above of what's delivered. There is nothing wrong with having standards. And the "elitists" as you like to call them will tell you the difference between 30 and 60 fps any time of the day. If you played your life long on 60fps you will immediately notice the drop as it is just that jarring. And if not for the smoothness then for the sudden doubling of the input lag. Do you think I am fiddling with the graphics options for fun just to get to a stable 60fps at the start of every new game?

 I have mentioned severakl times that I am talkin g about rock solid, fixed 30 fps, and not drops. Everyone notices major drops... and yes, I am actually playing games for over 20 years now... I had my fair share of 60fps gaming and sub 20 fps atrocities, believe me And only the most elitist gamers pretend that their flawless gaming experience is ruined by a game only because its not 60fps...

hunter_alien said: michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. Expecting a good performance out of your games is being elitist. Got it.    No, but pissing over a product, just because you have your subjective values, is. Most people do not prefer 60 fps over 30, they simply find it "unplayable", or at least thats what Im getting from forums these days. 30 FPS is a perfect performance for most games, like it or not, 60 is unnecesary in most cases.

I get what you're saying but you're kinda going overboard. People aren't saying 60FPS is necessary, it's just that it's much better than 30FPS

60 fps is always better than 30fps. And that's a fact, not an opinion. That's speaking for the framerate alone however. Cutting framerate in favor of better visuals is more debatable.

Regardless, I don't think I'd play a PC game if it was limited to 30fps. TotalBiscuit made a great video about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXJh9ut2hrc EDIT: I seem to have lost the ability to embed videos...

The "cinematic experience" belongs in movies, not games.

Ninsect said: hunter_alien said: michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. Expecting a good performance out of your games is being elitist. Got it.    No, but pissing over a product, just because you have your subjective values, is. Most people do not prefer 60 fps over 30, they simply find it "unplayable", or at least thats what Im getting from forums these days. 30 FPS is a perfect performance for most games, like it or not, 60 is unnecesary in most cases. I get what you're saying but you're kinda going overboard. People aren't saying 60FPS is necessary, it's just that it's much better than 30FPS

Totally agree with you on the overboard thingy I just want to voice the anti 60FPS campaign a bit, seeing that in the last couple of days I had 3 different discussions about why 60fps is a must, and I have seen way to many supporters of this idea

Activating V-Sync causes a performance hit though so 40 fps - 50 fps performance would drop into the 30 fps range if you want a really stable image.

hunter_alien said: michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. Expecting a good performance out of your games is being elitist. Got it.    No, but pissing over a product, just because you have your subjective values, is. Most people do not prefer 60 fps over 30, they simply find it "unplayable", or at least thats what Im getting from forums these days. 30 FPS is a perfect performance for most games, like it or not, 60 is unnecesary in most cases.

30 FPS is not perfect for a single game, because there is always a better option that is 60 FPS. Nothing can be perfect when there is a better option. May be turn based games though I haven't seen a turn based taxing game.

30 FPS can be "acceptable" in some cases. Limited hardware for one. But going around saying "60 FPS is not important! We don't care! You are elitist!"  is why we have many games that run like shit nowadays.

michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. Expecting a good performance out of your games is being elitist. Got it.   No, but pissing over a product, just because you have your subjective values, is. Most people do not prefer 60 fps over 30, they simply find it "unplayable", or at least thats what Im getting from forums these days. 30 FPS is a perfect performance for most games, like it or not, 60 is unnecesary in most cases. 30 FPS is not perfect for a single game, because there is always a better option that is 60 FPS. Nothing can be perfect when there is a better option. May be turn based games though I haven't seen a turn based taxing game. 30 FPS can be "acceptable" in some cases. Limited hardware for one. But going around saying "60 FPS is not important! We don't care! You are elitist!"  is why we have many games that run like shit nowadays.

Next thing he says that 1080p is irrelevant because the human eye can't count so many pixels so fast.

michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: michael_stutzer said: hunter_alien said: 60 FPS is not required in at least 90% of games that are released. Anyone who says otherwise is an elitist and I bet my house on the fact that I could fool him with any game that runs perfectly locked at 30fps and a 60fps game That said, for some genres its still a must: pixel perfect shooters, brawlers and some platformers. Every other genre can be perfectly played at 30 fps. Expecting a good performance out of your games is being elitist. Got it.    No, but pissing over a product, just because you have your subjective values, is. Most people do not prefer 60 fps over 30, they simply find it "unplayable", or at least thats what Im getting from forums these days. 30 FPS is a perfect performance for most games, like it or not, 60 is unnecesary in most cases. 30 FPS is not perfect for a single game, because there is always a better option that is 60 FPS. Nothing can be perfect when there is a better option. May be turn based games though I haven't seen a turn based taxing game. 30 FPS can be "acceptable" in some cases. Limited hardware for one. But going around saying "60 FPS is not important! We don't care! You are elitist!"  is why we have many games that run like shit nowadays.

Bullshit! The reason why we have unoptimized games is because we have por developers. Dont try and put words in my mouth, when its obvious thats not what I have wrote.

60 FPS is not a better option, its a jmeaningless option in most games, as a better loking and stable 30 FPS game beats a crappy looking or fluctuating 60fps game any day. Its a facty, both reviewers and the general gaming comunity accepts it, seeing that there aere plenty multi-billion franchises that are locked at 30 fps

Yeah if we listen to the drivel going around in the forums we should all be playing at 720p @ 30 FPS unless extreme circumstances occur.