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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Destiny Dev: It Was "Liberating" to Move on From Halo

Puppyroach said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

What does that have to do with ANYTHING? So you mean, because the staff at Nintendo are employed directly by the company, they have no problem with pushing out one Mario game after the other? So creativity is only a result of being a developer in your own company?

What are you view on Polyphony that have only had one mission, to make Gran Turismo? Or the numbers of God of War games pushed out by the same studio? Or the fact that Naughty dog are releasing Uncharted 4 next year. According to you, Sony must then be terrible? But I know, of course that is MS's fault as well ;).


Its just like I stated to this guy after you, Mario was developed internally by a dedicated team. He used Polyphony as an example when Polyphony is more akin to 343 than bungie. Both were internally created to focus on one franchise as long as it needs to happen. Bungie is not that type of company and left Microsoft on account of that. Microsoft focuses really on a handful of sucessful titles, so really...what room for creativity do they leave for their developers outside of those games? Very little. Everyone goes on the wheel and gets churned out. 

Sony allows their teams to experiment. They are nothing like Microsoft in that regard. They let the most successful teams experiment even more. Look at Naughty Dog, Sony Santamonica, Sony Japan, Media Molecule and others. Do you see Sony forcing them all to work on one game? Obviously not. Do not even compare Microsoft to Sony in terms to developmental strategy. That will always be a losing battle.



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I'm not surprised they got bored developing just one franchise



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GamechaserBE said:
outlawauron said:

I don't really care about what reviewers said, I'm speaking my opinions based on my experiences. While I haven't bothered with Spartan Assault, I have played every other entry in the series. With the last 3 entries in the series, I don't see how anyone can claim a big difference in quality.

It would have been nice to say why exactly Destiny is better,  because the difference with you and reviewers is that they atleast give  reasons why they don't like Destiny, you are just here saying that Destiny is better than Halo without any explanation..   

Why is Destiny better than Halo Reach for example? 

Well it is a Fact that I love Halo Reach and it is my favourite Halo game (very unpopular opinion though) so let me defend Halo: Reach compared to Destiny...

Why is Halo Reach better than Destiny


- LOCAL "CO-OP' Multiplayer:    In my early twenties it was custom that me and my friends would go out in the city on saturday but before that we would meet on friday evening  and we all would join in somebody's home and play Halo Reach whole night...   It is really sad that except for COD that no other FPS this generation have local multiplayer.. Welcome to the future

- FORGE: Every week some of my friends would create gametypes and maps and we had a lots of fun, we had maps where one player is infected and has to find the other players in a lybarinth, we had maps with only rocket launchers, we had a map with a big wall and two small rooms at each side and one player would spawn in one room with grenades and the other +5 players in the other room and have to try to survive his grenades that were thrown over the wall..if one person dies he would spawn in the room with the grenades...And you would win if nobody stayed alive after 2 minutes or when atleast one player could suvive two minutes..

We had a map where 4 players race in a circle and in the middle the other team would try to kill them with hitting trash to the other players while using the grifball stick...funny to watch people get killed by cones, elephant sized golfballs, chairs etc...

I can go on with this but in the end we had more than 300 gametypes and 800 maps created or downloaded... 

Local multiplayer and Forge makes for me Halo Reach already a better game than Destiny..

But considering some people may come here and say 'I have no frieds so why I care about local or forge' let me continue with other reasons...


- Spaceschips:  It is so amazing that in 2014 we have the ability to watch our spaceships in loading screens, can not wait till 2010 with Reach where we can fly with them and have battles...... Strange their is only one planet in Reach but you can go to Space but not in Destiny with his handfull of planets..

- Hidden stuff/easter eggs etc:  Basically the first 20 seconds of Halo reach that is playable has a secret that not many know...When you land on the ground their is a invisible Elite who runs away when you land...If you sprint you can catch and kill him and their is this kind of stuff in like every map..

- Multiplayer playlists: Their are a lot of them and if you don't like to shoot, you can also play Grifball (Halo's Football) or Racing or infected and so on..

- Mission structure: Something that is really missing in Destiny,  in Halo most missions have a lot of variety,  you have one level in Reach where you land on a Beach and try to get a base while drop pods are falling down around you,  inside the Base you will get with friendlies to a spaceship, with the spaceship you go to space and start a spacefight, first defend a station than attack an covenantship and invade it..... while invaded you fight around in low gravity, after that you have to get to the control room where most players would try to kill everyone or most in a sneaky way...and then you have to return where you landed in the ship to deffend a small spaceship....     And all of this in one mission..

- Skills/level up system:   Normally I like level up but in this game I don't like it in combination with the gameplay...   Try beating a boss underleveled will kick your ass but if you are a few levels higher you beat it so easy...

and I can go on...

If you like Destiny better better because it is on playstation and Halo not I can understand if something else I would like to know...

Music is something that is hard to discuss really enjoyed the music when a big fight start in Destiny but Halo Reach music is also great...

And yes graphics are for sure better on Destiny but what else? 

TLDR:  Halo Reach is better than Destiny..=p





S.T.A.G.E. said:
Puppyroach said:


What does that have to do with ANYTHING? So you mean, because the staff at Nintendo are employed directly by the company, they have no problem with pushing out one Mario game after the other? So creativity is only a result of being a developer in your own company?

What are you view on Polyphony that have only had one mission, to make Gran Turismo? Or the numbers of God of War games pushed out by the same studio? Or the fact that Naughty dog are releasing Uncharted 4 next year. According to you, Sony must then be terrible? But I know, of course that is MS's fault as well ;).


Its just like I stated to this guy after you, Mario was developed internally by a dedicated team. He used Polyphony as an example when Polyphony is more akin to 343 than bungie. Both were internally created to focus on one franchise as long as it needs to happen. Bungie is not that type of company and left Microsoft on account of that. Microsoft focuses really on a handful of sucessful titles, so really...what room for creativity do they leave for their developers outside of those games? Very little. Everyone goes on the wheel and gets churned out. 

Sony allows their teams to experiment. They are nothing like Microsoft in that regard. They let the most successful teams experiment even more. Look at Naughty Dog, Sony Santamonica, Sony Japan, Media Molecule and others. Do you see Sony forcing them all to work on one game? Obviously not. Do not even compare Microsoft to Sony in terms to developmental strategy. That will always be a losing battle.

Once again, what does it have to do with anything if a studio is created for a purpose or bought because of a product they created? The way you look at it is that if they are employed directly, like 343i or Polyphony, they don´t have a will of their own, yet if they are in a former third party studio, free will is all they have. I get the feeling you only put this argument out because it fits the nerrative that Sony can do no wrong. I may be wrong.

You do believe Sony have not put any preassure on ND to produce Uncharted games at a high rate? Or that Polyphone have no choice but to put out new GT games? Compare the variety of ND games from the 90´s to the 00´s and now, fewer and fewer new IP´s. They both do this, MS and Sony are afraid to create new IP´s, that is why they push their strongest developers to keep putting out sequels to their strongest franchises.



Puppyroach said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

Once again, what does it have to do with anything if a studio is created for a purpose or bought because of a product they created? The way you look at it is that if they are employed directly, like 343i or Polyphony, they don´t have a will of their own, yet if they are in a former third party studio, free will is all they have. I get the feeling you only put this argument out because it fits the nerrative that Sony can do no wrong. I may be wrong.

You do believe Sony have not put any preassure on ND to produce Uncharted games at a high rate? Or that Polyphone have no choice but to put out new GT games? Compare the variety of ND games from the 90´s to the 00´s and now, fewer and fewer new IP´s. They both do this, MS and Sony are afraid to create new IP´s, that is why they push their strongest developers to keep putting out sequels to their strongest franchises.


343 and Polyphony are not employed directly. They were created By the Platform developer. Bungie was purchased so Microsoft could get their hands on the Halo IP because without it the Xbox would not be accepted by the mass audience. It was the centerpiece of their purchase of Halo. It wasn't being developed for them in the first place so they snatched them and the IP away from the former company they were working for, savy?

If a company is created (Notice I said created) with the intent of focusing on one game then their existence and hiring strategy to the company is based solely on that. 

As for the Sony question, I'm guessing you haven't noticed that Sony increased the size of Naughty Dog and then split the company in two. There are two teams within Naughty Dog now. One looks after Uncharted, The other looks after Last of Us and a new IP. They were rewarded for their success and allowed to increase in size so they could develop more IP's.

In the 90's and 00's games were smaller and easier to make.  Multiple games could be made in a year. This was the time when Rare was the most creative and pumped out the most for Nintendo. Sony turned Naughty Dog post purchase from a AA team to a AAA team. As you can see Naughty Dogs IP's they made elsewhere post Sony purchase were being butchered to death in the hands of their former publishers. AAA games have a much longer development cycle than what it took to make Crash Bandicoot. Remember Naughty Dogs decisions are a reflection of Sony. Much like how Rares key guys left after MS purchased them so to did the main owner of Naughty Dog. There would have been no Uncharted unless Sony asked for it. In fact Naughty Dog was developing a fantasy game until Sony noticed the change in gaming climate and noticed people wanted shooters more than action adventure. Of course they delivered both, but Naughty Dog was assigned to the shooter. 




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Puppyroach said:

You do believe Sony have not put any preassure on ND to produce Uncharted games at a high rate? Or that Polyphone have no choice but to put out new GT games? Compare the variety of ND games from the 90´s to the 00´s and now, fewer and fewer new IP´s. They both do this, MS and Sony are afraid to create new IP´s, that is why they push their strongest developers to keep putting out sequels to their strongest franchises.

If you want to talk about Naughty Dog, here is the rundown of what they have worked on during the period of time you mentioned.

Rings of Power - 1991 - Sega Genesis
Way of the Warrior - 1994 - 3DO

Crash Bandicoot - 1996 - PS
Crash Bandicoot 2: Cortex Strikes Back - 1997 - PS
Crash Bandicoot Warped - 1998 - PS
Crash Team Racing - 1999 - PS

Jak and Daxter: The precursor Legacy - 2001 - PS2
Jak 2 - 2003 - PS2
Jak 3 - 2004 - PS2
Jak X: Combat Racing - 2005 - PS2

Uncharted: Drake's Fortune - 2007 - PS3
Uncharted 2: Among Thieves - 2009 - PS3
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception - 2011 - PS3
The Last of Us - 2013 - PS3

The Last of Us Remastered - 2014 - PS4
Uncharted 4: A thief's End - 2015 - PS4
Currently working on an unannounced IP - TBD - PS4

They've worked on one IP per console generation, prior to The Last of Us. Also, the PS4 is the first generation for which one of their franchises carries over. And everything indicates that Uncharted 4 will be the last in the series before they move on to something new.

As you can see, what you said about "ND creating fewer and fewer new IPs" is utter bullshit.



GamechaserBE said:
outlawauron said:
jlmurph2 said:
outlawauron said:
jlmurph2 said:


They're very different in terms of quality. But there's obvious nods to Halo throughout the game.

Destiny is way better than every Halo except for the first two...

Reviews would disagree. Destiny is only better than Spartan Assault. 

I don't really care about what reviewers said, I'm speaking my opinions based on my experiences. While I haven't bothered with Spartan Assault, I have played every other entry in the series. With the last 3 entries in the series, I don't see how anyone can claim a big difference in quality.

It would have been nice to say why exactly Destiny is better,  because the difference with you and reviewers is that they atleast give  reasons why they don't like Destiny, you are just here saying that Destiny is better than Halo without any explanation..   

Why is Destiny better than Halo Reach for example? 

I'm not going to bother reading anything in your post since you obviously didn't bother to read mine.

I said there wasn't a big difference in quality because the post I was quoting was saying there were a big step up. I argued against that by saying Halo 3 onwards, it's similar.



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Destiny does not come close to halo. I feel sorry for bungie but they deserve the low scores.



FiliusDei said:
Destiny does not come close to halo. I feel sorry for bungie but they deserve the low scores.


Perhaps they deserve the score they have currently, but it has been said many times before that Destiny has been concepted to be a ten year game.



S.T.A.G.E. said:
FiliusDei said:
Destiny does not come close to halo. I feel sorry for bungie but they deserve the low scores.


Perhaps they deserve the score they have currently, but it has been said many times before that Destiny has been concepted to be a ten year game.


And this might change if it isn't successful. By now it looks like a “several weeks“-game.