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Forums - Politics Discussion - If Kim-Jong-Un Dies Without a Son Who Will lead North Korea

Mr Khan on 01 July 2014
Burek said:
Simple solution, Dennis Rodman would become president.

Fun fact: despite their nominally left-wing ideology, N. Korea is very, very racist against all non-Koreans, especially against non-asians, and especially especially against blacks. There's an anecdote of an African-Cuban diplomat who almost got lynched at one point.



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MoHasanie on 01 July 2014

Some brother or uncle will just get the job. It would be interesting if the daughter became the ruler though.



    

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phaedruss on 01 July 2014
Mr Khan said:
Burek said:
Simple solution, Dennis Rodman would become president.

Fun fact: despite their nominally left-wing ideology, N. Korea is very, very racist against all non-Koreans, especially against non-asians, and especially especially against blacks. There's an anecdote of an African-Cuban diplomat who almost got lynched at one point.


The Chinese and Japanese are also pretty racist. My brother taught English in China for a couple of years and told me that they didn't want any black applicants.



Kongfucius on 01 July 2014
Mr Khan said:
The military would just put one of their men in there directly. The Kims have leaned very heavily on the military as their support base (since theirs was not an organic "revolution" in the beginning, so they don't have the kind of grass-roots basis that Bolshevism had in the USSR or has in China. They were basically foreigners, hiding out in Manchuria and the Russian Maritime Provinces, Korean by ethnicity but not by birth, and armed and sent in by the Soviets after the Japanese retreat from Korea). Il-Sung and *especially* Jong Il gleaned their legitimacy (such as it was) from military support, and supposedly military veterans (especially survivors from the Korean War era) are the biggest supporters of the regime domestically.

If the Kim line died off and it didn't mean the end of the DPRK as a whole, it would be a Generalissimo of some sort who got the helm.


Quoted for correctness, whoever kept the loyalty of the military would have no competition, whether they were a Kim or not, same as most oppressive dictatorships ultimately depend on their leaders's control of the army - many a dictator has come to power in a military coup, albeit sometimes a bloodless one (Saddam Hussein, for example)

Good point about the Kim's as well, Kim Jong-Il was actually born in the USSR if Soviet records are correct



phaedruss on 01 July 2014
Kongfucius said:
Mr Khan said:
The military would just put one of their men in there directly. The Kims have leaned very heavily on the military as their support base (since theirs was not an organic "revolution" in the beginning, so they don't have the kind of grass-roots basis that Bolshevism had in the USSR or has in China. They were basically foreigners, hiding out in Manchuria and the Russian Maritime Provinces, Korean by ethnicity but not by birth, and armed and sent in by the Soviets after the Japanese retreat from Korea). Il-Sung and *especially* Jong Il gleaned their legitimacy (such as it was) from military support, and supposedly military veterans (especially survivors from the Korean War era) are the biggest supporters of the regime domestically.

If the Kim line died off and it didn't mean the end of the DPRK as a whole, it would be a Generalissimo of some sort who got the helm.


Quoted for correctness, whoever kept the loyalty of the military would have no competition, whether they were a Kim or not, same as most oppressive dictatorships ultimately depend on their leaders's control of the army - many a dictator has come to power in a military coup, albeit sometimes a bloodless one (Saddam Hussein, for example)

Good point about the Kim's as well, Kim Jong-Il was actually born in the USSR if Soviet records are correct

How does that fit into the whole ideology though? Aren't the Kims seen as Gods?



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Kongfucius on 01 July 2014
phaedruss said:
Kongfucius said:
Mr Khan said:
The military would just put one of their men in there directly. The Kims have leaned very heavily on the military as their support base (since theirs was not an organic "revolution" in the beginning, so they don't have the kind of grass-roots basis that Bolshevism had in the USSR or has in China. They were basically foreigners, hiding out in Manchuria and the Russian Maritime Provinces, Korean by ethnicity but not by birth, and armed and sent in by the Soviets after the Japanese retreat from Korea). Il-Sung and *especially* Jong Il gleaned their legitimacy (such as it was) from military support, and supposedly military veterans (especially survivors from the Korean War era) are the biggest supporters of the regime domestically.

If the Kim line died off and it didn't mean the end of the DPRK as a whole, it would be a Generalissimo of some sort who got the helm.


Quoted for correctness, whoever kept the loyalty of the military would have no competition, whether they were a Kim or not, same as most oppressive dictatorships ultimately depend on their leaders's control of the army - many a dictator has come to power in a military coup, albeit sometimes a bloodless one (Saddam Hussein, for example)

Good point about the Kim's as well, Kim Jong-Il was actually born in the USSR if Soviet records are correct

How does that fit into the whole ideology though? Aren't the Kims seen as Gods?


He'll make it fit - he'd have control of the propaganda machine, he'd have control of the army to take out anyone who doesn't toe the line (which, even with all the adoration they seem to get, the Kims have also had to do, hence the big secret internment camps). He'd probably portray himself as KJU's beat friend, or most trusted general, or more loyal advisor - maybe even say that KJU named him as his successor on his deathbed or something like that.

Stalin did it a little after Lenin died and painted himself as his most loyal follower and admirer to win support, though there was no familial or dynastic side to it in the USSR, it was still useful



phaedruss on 01 July 2014
Kongfucius said:
phaedruss said:
Kongfucius said:
Mr Khan said:
The military would just put one of their men in there directly. The Kims have leaned very heavily on the military as their support base (since theirs was not an organic "revolution" in the beginning, so they don't have the kind of grass-roots basis that Bolshevism had in the USSR or has in China. They were basically foreigners, hiding out in Manchuria and the Russian Maritime Provinces, Korean by ethnicity but not by birth, and armed and sent in by the Soviets after the Japanese retreat from Korea). Il-Sung and *especially* Jong Il gleaned their legitimacy (such as it was) from military support, and supposedly military veterans (especially survivors from the Korean War era) are the biggest supporters of the regime domestically.

If the Kim line died off and it didn't mean the end of the DPRK as a whole, it would be a Generalissimo of some sort who got the helm.


Quoted for correctness, whoever kept the loyalty of the military would have no competition, whether they were a Kim or not, same as most oppressive dictatorships ultimately depend on their leaders's control of the army - many a dictator has come to power in a military coup, albeit sometimes a bloodless one (Saddam Hussein, for example)

Good point about the Kim's as well, Kim Jong-Il was actually born in the USSR if Soviet records are correct

How does that fit into the whole ideology though? Aren't the Kims seen as Gods?


He'll make it fit - he'd have control of the propaganda machine, he'd have control of the army to take out anyone who doesn't toe the line (which, even with all the adoration they seem to get, the Kims have also had to do, hence the big secret internment camps). He'd probably portray himself as KJU's beat friend, or most trusted general, or more loyal advisor - maybe even say that KJU named him as his successor on his deathbed or something like that. Stalin didn't a little after Lenin died and painted himself as his most loyal follower and admirer


Yea, makes sense. God damn we just need to go in there and kill all these assholes. I mean really what is stopping anyone from doing that? They don't have any allies left do they?



Kongfucius on 01 July 2014
phaedruss said:
Kongfucius said:
phaedruss said:

How does that fit into the whole ideology though? Aren't the Kims seen as Gods?


He'll make it fit - he'd have control of the propaganda machine, he'd have control of the army to take out anyone who doesn't toe the line (which, even with all the adoration they seem to get, the Kims have also had to do, hence the big secret internment camps). He'd probably portray himself as KJU's beat friend, or most trusted general, or more loyal advisor - maybe even say that KJU named him as his successor on his deathbed or something like that. Stalin didn't a little after Lenin died and painted himself as his most loyal follower and admirer


Yea, makes sense. God damn we just need to go in there and kill all these assholes. I mean really what is stopping anyone from doing that? They don't have any allies left do they?


The Chinese back them to hedge American influence in East Asia - they're not massively supportive but so long as they're there,  their threats discourage a stronger military presence or other measures which the Chinese may not be very keen on - basically they ratchet up the tension and stop the west or Japan from getting hasty just in case they do have viable nukes or other WMDs



phaedruss on 01 July 2014
Kongfucius said:
 


The Chinese back them to hedge American influence in East Asia - they're not massively supportive but so long as they're there,  their threats discourage a stronger military presence or other measures which the Chinese may not be very keen on - basically they ratchet up the tension and stop the west or Japan from getting hasty just in case they do have viable nukes or other WMDs


I don't normally support interventionism and that kind of policy, but in the case of North Korea I can make an exception lol. I really don't get what China has to gain from antagonizing the west and Japan at this point, especially over some two-bit military dictatorship that has nothing to offer them.



fluky-nintendy on 01 July 2014

The military there is the real main power of that country. The governor is just the face of the military



...Let the Sony Domination continue with the PS4...