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Forums - Politics Discussion - Will Religion ever be illegal in America?

Dr.Henry_Killinger on 30 June 2014
o_O.Q said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
o_O.Q said:

...lol are you sure you read what I posted? When did I say christianity causes slavery?

A need for cheap labor causes slavery in quite sure no one denies that 

For someone who is wrong quite often you're very aggressive lol calm done brother have a brandy or something 

"considering that Christianity was one of the tools used by the slavers in the first place to pacify the enslaved and also to justify the act of slavery in the first place 

You might want to research that 

Another interesting tidbit is that the bible does not abhor slavery "

Are you sure you want to do this? 

I mean you stated that Christianity was used by slavers as pacification, justification for slavery you are implying causation.

Not to mention, you haven't provided evidence, instead you've said there are many written accounts, despite the fact that you haven't cited any of that vast amount of information.

You also say that Christinaity doesn't abhor slavery implying that it supports it rather, than understanding the fact that around the time that the bible was written, slavery was commonplace and not seen as an injustice for the most part. Its not like the Bible advocates slavery.

And even if it did, free will exists, the fact that people are claiming to reject it and religion in general purports that idea, so it stands to reason that humans can make a choice to accept whatever values they want and if they commit crimes in the name of those values then its the person who commited the crimes and accepted the values who is the problem and not the values themselves.

And FYI, this: "This worst part of this argument is that few on either side are rational or even understand what these terms mean.

Fallacies and generalizations all over the place, its frankly disgusting, but don't mind me I'm just commenting." was in response to the entire thread including you, not just your petty squabble. I mean germans killed Jews at one point in history, should we punish all germans because of it? 


Uh... So therefore you acknowledge that I didn't say that... Ok that's good what I posted was quite clear whatever further inferences you make are all on you

As for evidence that's what Google is for

Ironically, http://lmgtfy.com/?q=burden+of+proof

And finally the point about free will leads back to what I just said about values influencing behavior 

Sure you may have free will but if you're following values with the understanding that should you choose to reject them you will be punished and that those values are the only way to live your life

If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values, then the one who taught you those values are responsible, Religion isn't institincual

You're going to be coerced into making certain decisions based on those values that should be obvious... So ultimately what I'm saying is that as a theist no you do not have free will under certain conditions 

Said values do not have a will that acts upon anything, especially since Religion is subjective, open to interpretation, yes you can fault someone for their interpretations and being cooerced. Not to mention you always have free will as long as you understand the situation you are in.

For example, Religion A says something like "an adulter will be punished by death" and you interpret it as you should kill your wife for cheating or go to hell etc. The prospect of hell incentivizes the action of killing your wife, but you still have to accept it and valuate what is more important to you.

You're blaming the gun, not the shooter.

EDIT: Not to mention, another person whose reads the same line and interprets that a cheating wife will be punished by god or whatever and they do nothing.

Not only are you blaming the gun, but you're the one that loaded it with bullets in the first place.



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

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o_O.Q on 30 June 2014
WagnerPaiva said:
o_O.Q said:

Fair enough

Well about corrupting creation it actually happens in ways that can't be helped 

For example when people take antibiotics for illness which results at times in new mutant strains of pathogens bring formed I 


Yes, that is a good point. I was thinking about those projects to cross species, even with humans, have you heard of those? This kind o thing is pretty scary.

Did you know this is the reason God send the flood? Read Genesis 6, the fallen angels (sons of God) married the human women and they gave birth to abominations (giants and nephilins), these monsters corrupted all flesh of the Earth, including the animals. 

That is the same thing science is doing now: crossing species in a unholy way. I heard they are even making cow-human hybrids and stuff like that.


Well I've heard more about making humans partially synthetic and thus is already happening via technology such as implants which are used by some for identification and tracking kids and so on 



WagnerPaiva on 30 June 2014
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:

For example, Religion A says something like "an adulter will be punished by death" and you interpret it as you should kill your wife for cheating or go to hell etc. The prospect of hell incentivizes the action of killing your wife, but you still have to accept it and valuate what is more important to you.

You're blaming the gun, not the shooter.

EDIT: Not to mention, another person whose reads the same line and interprets that a cheating wife will be punished by god or whatever and they do nothing.

Not only are you blaming the gun, but you're the one that loaded it with bullets in the first place.

Sorry to get in the middle of this, but you made a interesting point.

However, consider the context that these laws were created: in those days the Lord himself talked to the people, they could put a lamb in a rock and FREAKING fire would come from the skies to show God´s aproval.

Also, those dudes were fighting Giants, freaking armies of giants, and with odds like 100:1 or even more. God was very present and, in those days, there were no atheists, maybe you did not enjoy Jeovah and prefered to serve Molok or Baal, but they were there, you could no deny them.

As the love grew cold and humanity cease to have interest in religion, comunion became a niche thing. But, as many believers, myself included, can tell you, it is pretty real when you devote yourself to it.

Ask any satanist why he believe in those things, it is because they talk to them, possess them, do things for them. It is real like the sun for them.

The same to the believers today, we do not kill our wives for God anymore, there are laws today, but, if we aply our lifes to the Lord, He gradualy starts to show Himself, and it is pretty glorious...



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

o_O.Q on 30 June 2014
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
o_O.Q said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
o_O.Q said:

...lol are you sure you read what I posted? When did I say christianity causes slavery?

A need for cheap labor causes slavery in quite sure no one denies that 

For someone who is wrong quite often you're very aggressive lol calm done brother have a brandy or something 

"considering that Christianity was one of the tools used by the slavers in the first place to pacify the enslaved and also to justify the act of slavery in the first place 

You might want to research that 

Another interesting tidbit is that the bible does not abhor slavery "

Are you sure you want to do this? 

I mean you stated that Christianity was used by slavers as pacification, justification for slavery you are implying causation.

Not to mention, you haven't provided evidence, instead you've said there are many written accounts, despite the fact that you haven't cited any of that vast amount of information.

You also say that Christinaity doesn't abhor slavery implying that it supports it rather, than understanding the fact that around the time that the bible was written, slavery was commonplace and not seen as an injustice for the most part. Its not like the Bible advocates slavery.

And even if it did, free will exists, the fact that people are claiming to reject it and religion in general purports that idea, so it stands to reason that humans can make a choice to accept whatever values they want and if they commit crimes in the name of those values then its the person who commited the crimes and accepted the values who is the problem and not the values themselves.

And FYI, this: "This worst part of this argument is that few on either side are rational or even understand what these terms mean.

Fallacies and generalizations all over the place, its frankly disgusting, but don't mind me I'm just commenting." was in response to the entire thread including you, not just your petty squabble. I mean germans killed Jews at one point in history, should we punish all germans because of it? 


Uh... So therefore you acknowledge that I didn't say that... Ok that's good what I posted was quite clear whatever further inferences you make are all on you

As for evidence that's what Google is for

Ironically, http://lmgtfy.com/?q=burden+of+proof

And finally the point about free will leads back to what I just said about values influencing behavior 

Sure you may have free will but if you're following values with the understanding that should you choose to reject them you will be punished and that those values are the only way to live your life

If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values, then the one who taught you those values are responsible, Religion isn't institincual

You're going to be coerced into making certain decisions based on those values that should be obvious... So ultimately what I'm saying is that as a theist no you do not have free will under certain conditions 

Said values do not have a will that acts upon anything, especially since Religion is subjective, open to interpretation, yes you can fault someone for their interpretations and being cooerced. Not to mention you always have free will as long as you understand the situation you are in.

For example, Religion A says something like "an adulter will be punished by death" and you interpret it as you should kill your wife for cheating or go to hell etc. The prospect of hell incentivizes the action of killing your wife, but you still have to accept it and valuate what is more important to you.

You're blaming the gun, not the shooter.

EDIT: Not to mention, another person whose reads the same line and interprets that a cheating wife will be punished by god or whatever and they do nothing.

Not only are you blaming the gun, but you're the one that loaded it with bullets in the first place.


At this point I'm not even really sure what we're talking about now but it seems to me though that you're insulting theists 

"If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values"

That is the point of theism that a set of values is used by a set of people and sure there will be some differences in interpretation bur from what I've experienced for the most part the values are universal across a group



WagnerPaiva on 30 June 2014
o_O.Q said:

Well I've heard more about making humans partially synthetic and thus is already happening via technology such as implants which are used by some for identification and tracking kids and so on 


Yes, the things I saw were for transplants as well. When it is about protetics and stuff like that I really can not say it is wrong, after all, it is such a sorrow to lose a limb.

I know those researches also focus on doing good, with pig hearts and stuff like that, but it is pretty weird. I don´t think I would want to have a cow organ inside me.



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

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Dr.Henry_Killinger on 30 June 2014
o_O.Q said:

At this point I'm not even really sure what we're talking about now but it seems to me though that you're insulting theists 

"If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values"

That is the point of theism that a set of values is used by a set of people and sure there will be some differences in interpretation bur from what I've experienced for the most part the values are universal across a group

Incorrect. There is no "point" of theism, its merely describes what theistic religions are, a set of beleifs and values that entails the belief of a higher power., all of that extra crap is just baseless assumption.

there are non-theistic religions as well: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=non-theistic+religion&l=1

Religions are subjective (up to interpretation by nature), the only thing that is universal is the core beliefs and values themselves. You keep tacking on all this extra crap to make it seem like religion itself is bad, when its is literally just an intangiable human construct belief system.

And now you're saying Im insulting theists?

You are the one ignorantly assuming that all theists don't have the mental fortitude to decide their own values as if deciding to believe in Christinaity or any other Religion is unfathomable. Making sweeping generallizations because all you see are the extremist and don't have the rational thought to divorce a persons actions with the values they claim to have, can't even question why someone would molest children and claim to be a servant of a religion that expressely forbids it.

If you don't have the mental fortitude, you can be brainwashed by any system of belief whether it be Nilhism, Atheism, Theism, Etc.

And I don't understand how anyone using rational thinking would find it hard to believe that people abusing their power is not unique to religion.

Seriously, you claim that you feel that we could be in the dream of some kind of higher being and yet you can't open your mind to the possiblity that People do bad things because they want to?



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

wangjingwanjia on 30 June 2014

If enough people with a lot of power that don't tolerate that anyone else thinks differently, then anything is possible.

But I would say no.

Another interesting question in this matter. Will we ever see an American pope? With American I mean in this sense someone from the USA.





黑色沙漠 - Black Desert - 검은사막

 

WagnerPaiva on 30 June 2014
wangjingwanjia said:
If enough people with a lot of power that don't tolerate that anyone else thinks differently, then anything is possible.

But I would say no.

Another interesting question in this matter. Will we ever see an American pope? With American I mean in this sense someone from the USA.


I have no idea how the RCC works, but I guess it could happen...



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

Oliver4p1 on 30 June 2014

Jesus waits for you



starcraft on 30 June 2014
o_O.Q said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
o_O.Q said:

Uh... So therefore you acknowledge that I didn't say that... Ok that's good what I posted was quite clear whatever further inferences you make are all on you

As for evidence that's what Google is for

Ironically, http://lmgtfy.com/?q=burden+of+proof

And finally the point about free will leads back to what I just said about values influencing behavior 

Sure you may have free will but if you're following values with the understanding that should you choose to reject them you will be punished and that those values are the only way to live your life

If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values, then the one who taught you those values are responsible, Religion isn't institincual

You're going to be coerced into making certain decisions based on those values that should be obvious... So ultimately what I'm saying is that as a theist no you do not have free will under certain conditions 

Said values do not have a will that acts upon anything, especially since Religion is subjective, open to interpretation, yes you can fault someone for their interpretations and being cooerced. Not to mention you always have free will as long as you understand the situation you are in.

For example, Religion A says something like "an adulter will be punished by death" and you interpret it as you should kill your wife for cheating or go to hell etc. The prospect of hell incentivizes the action of killing your wife, but you still have to accept it and valuate what is more important to you.

You're blaming the gun, not the shooter.

EDIT: Not to mention, another person whose reads the same line and interprets that a cheating wife will be punished by god or whatever and they do nothing.

Not only are you blaming the gun, but you're the one that loaded it with bullets in the first place.


At this point I'm not even really sure what we're talking about now but it seems to me though that you're insulting theists 

"If you do not have enough mental fortitude to decide your own values"

That is the point of theism that a set of values is used by a set of people and sure there will be some differences in interpretation bur from what I've experienced for the most part the values are universal across a group

*eye twitches*

*reaches for die*



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS